retreat modifiers

KV8 -> 1 flammer
Half Track -> 2 flammer

And i think the KV8 do more damage, that is right?

LOL.

But KV8 is just a problem for me if the enemy spam AT to take my tank, KV8 with fire is easy for all tank's beat, if the enemy no have properly AT...

I think this problem could be solved if they nerf the top speed of the KV-8. You can have a full health squad and if a KV-8 shows up it can run them all down into the ground, especially if there is a road near by. All of the people saying "don't overextend your troops L2P." need to get serious.

It goes like this:

1. Okay, attack here troops!
2. Shit, a KV-8 showed up. Retreat!
3. KV-8 burns down hole squad while on retreat

If the Kv-8 had a lower top speed, then it will still do its crazy high damage while in range, but the retreat command would put the infantry out of range faster, leaving less time to burn them up. This wouldn't be unfair to the KV-8 because it would still be fast enough to chase down non-retreating infantry, which move slower. Remember, if you manage to force retreats all over the place with the Kv-8, you are winning the battle.

4.286 for FHT (8.572 if both are firing on the same target) vs 15.000 for KV-8.

Didn´t they slightly fix the situation with the KV8 (march patch)?
I´m sure someone already said it but flames "ignores" any bonus your retreating squad may have.

"increasing the retreat modifiers will no doubt help in unit preservation for both high level and noobie players like myself."

Nope. I don´t want small arm fire power to be reduced. If anything and possible, there should be another modifier for flame weapons or at least tweak the crits for units retreating but i don´t think this is possible ATM.

although, when there is a road on the retreat path, it's funny to see smaller vehicles out-running retreating units

Vehicles on road vs People running on road. I don´t find it strange.

The retry is good enough.

The retry is good enough.

Retreat. You have use several times retry which is "try again".

for me there is nothing more satisfying than to chase a (rambo-)unit and crush who wants to steal behind the lines an emasculated mortar / mg.

and how to kill a sniper spam effectively (or at all)? - On the retreat!

and KV8 ...
see this now so rare that when one comes, this caught me bad (which was probably my fault then).
but whether a unit that you play rare, can be op?

Hope that more changes are only dealt with cautiously - the game has never been so balanced! (except isu-ele-problem)

KV-8 is already pretty slow. No one likes lots of RNG, so why not just make it deal more consistent damage.

Even if the grens were supported, they would have died anyway. 2 paks wouldn't have stopped that from happening.


What difference do you think it would make to have support there? The KV would've taken some damage and that's all. The grens would still have died. It's far too harsh.

Neither army should have super-rapid-squad-wiping units. It's not reasonable. And even top-100 players lose plenty of squads in this manner.

1 second is not a reasonable amount of time to expect players to react when the punishment for a "slow" 2-second reaction is losing a whole squad.

You may be right, 2 paks wouldn't have maybe prevented that situation (rescuing those grens).

BUT there would have been chance that they would have killed that KV8 (if Soviet player was careless). There was another gren there on the left, it could have fausted (succesfully) that chasing KV8, then it would have been bye bye KV8. Even without any fausts, KV8 doesn't just have that super armor anymore. It goes down quite fast.

That trade I would have done any day of the week.

You may be right, 2 paks wouldn't have maybe prevented that situation (rescuing those grens).

BUT there would have been chance that they would have killed that KV8 (if Soviet player was careless). There was another gren there on the left, it could have fausted (succesfully) that chasing KV8, then it would have been bye bye KV8. Even without any fausts, KV8 doesn't just have that super armor anymore. It goes down quite fast.

That trade I would have done any day of the week.

omg

omg

Thank you for your contribution.

-EDIT- Somehow it's hard to take this thread seriously when looking at your messages. Basically just checking few of those you're claiming that Soviet T1 can't be countered with Ostheer T1, you're begging for removing sand bags of Cons etc.

Thank you for your contribution.

-EDIT- Somehow it's hard to take this thread seriously when looking at your messages. Basically just checking few of those you're claiming that Soviet T1 can't be countered with Ostheer T1, you're begging for removing sand bags of Cons etc.

please quote me where i said remove conscripts sandbags or any other removal changes other the retreating mechanics.

MORE IMPORTANLY if you can read (altho i doubt it), read the thread title called RETREAT MODIFIERS.
I just want to share my opinion that squads for BOTH factions should not die on retreat so easily and lose the veterency.

finally again i would request some admin to lock and delete this thread because its become an OP flame thread which i NEVER intended.. i used the kv8 just example, should have used FHT

You may be right, 2 paks wouldn't have maybe prevented that situation (rescuing those grens).

BUT there would have been chance that they would have killed that KV8 (if Soviet player was careless). There was another gren there on the left, it could have fausted (succesfully) that chasing KV8, then it would have been bye bye KV8. Even without any fausts, KV8 doesn't just have that super armor anymore. It goes down quite fast.

That trade I would have done any day of the week.

I think your "(if Soviet player was careless)" shows the problem perfectly. German player would have to be so good he'd manage to retreat in 1 second of being attacked and have 2 paks in exactly the right place. and STILL lose the gren squad.

And the soviet player loses his totally unsupported unit only "(if he is careless)"


When one army is brually punished even if they are careful and the other side only *might* be punished even if he is careless - this is imbalance.

please quote me where i said remove conscripts sandbags or any other removal changes other the retreating mechanics.

MORE IMPORTANLY if you can read (altho i doubt it), read the thread title called RETREAT MODIFIERS.
I just want to share my opinion that squads for BOTH factions should not die on retreat so easily and lose the veterency.

finally again i would request some admin to lock and delete this thread because its become an OP flame thread which i NEVER intended.. i used the kv8 just example, should have used FHT

My apologies, I just now realized that you don't know how to use them and therefore you were wondering why they exist.

@Bulgakov you are correct, I used the word "careless". In this situation soviet player would lose 360MP and 135Fuel. Maybe it is just random situation but so is the underlying example. It's not every map where KV8 can just drive straight chasing the retreating units. If KV8 have to move even inch on some other way, most likely retreating units can get away.

Actually German half-track is even deadlier in these retreating situations. But these are really rare examples. Can you honestly say that this is so big of an issue that something needs to be changed? E.g. KV8 is doctrinal unit.

This issue is more hard with german's because the bad armor, the soviet guys have a big armor on all infantry... If one soviet play click retreat they should be fine, if a german player do that, is not garanted...

One time i rush into woods (spotted enemy position) with 5 ASS GRENS (full squad) in the front (2m) of a 2 soviet sniper's (2 guys full health) and they run to base, but with a little slow action to retreat by my enemy, and 1 sniper with half of life get sucess to run AGAIN to base...

Man, is my infantry DRUNK or is the GOD ARMOR??? lol

With soviet's, is always retreat and sucess.

But with german i lost the count of the times that i lost panzers grens on the retreat...

2broken.

^Being stupid seems to be what makes you kool kid nowadays, can't see other explanation why so many of them suddenly popped up out of nowhere.

The only infantry that have more armor are shocks, every other infantry unit have same armor of 1.

This issue is more hard with german's because the bad armor, the soviet guys have a big armor on all infantry... If one soviet play click retreat they should be fine, if a german player do that, is not garanted...

One time i rush into woods (spotted enemy position) with 5 ASS GRENS (full squad) in the front (2m) of a 2 soviet sniper's (2 guys full health) and they run to base, but with a little slow action to retreat by my enemy, and 1 sniper with half of life get sucess to run AGAIN to base...

Man, is my infantry DRUNK or is the GOD ARMOR??? lol

With soviet's, is always retreat and sucess.

But with german i lost the count of the times that i lost panzers grens on the retreat...

2broken.

Bravus, you need to take a look into some of the weapon tables.

The reason that a sniper could escape your assault grenadiers is not because soviets have good armor on their units. It's because the assault grenadiers weapons are sub-machine guns which have a very short effective range. Retreating from sub-machine gun wielding infantry will always result in a high chance of escape.

edit** after reading some post again i must say that Im NOT saying KV8 is OP. Im saying, Units on retreat shouldent die easily, espeically veteren infantry either conscripts or shocks or grens. KV8 is a DEDICATED anti infantry tank, It owns infantry well and good BUT it shouldent roast everything on retreat

in some post i read that retreating will become a soft counter to kv8..well isnt it now? and im just advocating a squad surviving a retreat. i have no other problems with units.

Why shouldn't/wouldn't it roast infantry on retreat? If you've over-extended and have set up poor defenses or left a gren/pgren/MG etc etc left alone too far forward, it's your fault and only your fault. Don't send one squad half across the map unsupported in the late game.

When you hit retreat, the units pick up their shit and run like hell back to base. Why should you get any sort of modifier to prevent them from dying when literally they just have their backs to the enemy and are taking a good deal of fire. I never thought once when I would have a squad chased down by any sort of vehicle or infantry that it was bullshit they died on retreat.

Yeah the KV-8 kills infantry super quick and that vet 3 squad died on retreat in like 4 seconds but look at those screens, it was in cover, hit retreat into negative cover. It's a fucking tank that shoots flames, it's gonna kill shit fast.

tl:dr get tanks, AT guns and plant mines. In my opinion it's only your fault if you lose a squad on retreat, whether it be you waited too long, were unsupported or just far too deep in enemy lines.

Maybe it is just random situation but so is the underlying example. It's not every map where KV8 can just drive straight chasing the retreating units. If KV8 have to move even inch on some other way, most likely retreating units can get away.

Actually German half-track is even deadlier in these retreating situations.

But these are really rare examples. Can you honestly say that this is so big of an issue that something needs to be changed? E.g. KV8 is doctrinal unit.

I agree about KV's low maneuverability and about German HT. I don't like that thing speeding around chasing down retreating squads either.

I think the benefit of flame vehicles should be to have a long-range durable flamer for clearing out buildings/cover or punishing blobbing. To also give it squad-wipe powers is giving it too much.


About the KV8 - Yes, it's slow but in the example we saw that it didn't need much time to destroy the squad. and doctrinal or not - if a unit is too squad-wipey, it should be toned down.

I'm not asking for super-low damage, I'm just saying that the ability to ignore cover with a splash damage weapon is already a great ability. I don't see why it needs such damage output too.





(Imagine a Nazi super-science laser tank which kills any unit in 2/3 seconds regardless how quickly they retreat - would you say it is a good unit?)

(Imagine a Nazi super-science laser tank which kills any unit in 2/3 seconds regardless how quickly they retreat - would you say it is a good unit?)

... oh ... you mean the Tiger ace....