Next patch predictions

I predict that the balance of the non doctrinal infantry units will finally be balanced better(however Soviets are conscripts and penals so they are fucked anyway). IE mosin's will be back on par with the k98.

The tanks they are going to over buff the at on the isu, it will be the new elephant. The t34's will finally be able to destroy p4's one on one, however, with their ram ability may become op.

Then the new commanders will come. They will be op p2w. they will not get balanced because they will be the only options to the eastern armies to fight the Americans/new Germans. then we will be back to square one and no one will use Soviets. Then we will have to endure a year of balancing Americans and new Germans. Then brits/japs? will come. Same thing over and over.

Edit:
I like new armies. But I like a balanced game better. I pray to the marijuana gods that they delay the release of the new expansion until the eastern front armies core units are balanced. If they had a segregated automatch until both are balanced that would be alright too.

That sounds about right actually.

Exciting... look forward to the patch.

I feel like it could have done when I first got the game last year..that's the first thought I had when I saw Woof's spreadsheet. 120 damage and bad pen? huh!

How would you feel if the T34 damage went to 160 then?

How would you feel if the T34 damage went to 160 then?

Good thread, always fun to read speculation as it gives some insights into what some of the players want.

edit: I just wanted to comment on one last thing. We agree with the sentiment that the Soviet core army needs to be effective against all opposing units on its own. Counters should not be exclusive to doctrines that is.

You can put 500 damage on a tank if its armor penetration value is 1. Will do shit against tanks or even light vehicles. That is why I still consider that T34 would be a better balanced tank with a small damage decrease and a small increasing in AP value.

Good damage but low penetration makes T34 more AI (like they said they want in the interview) and more interesting to flank rear armor. But vs a front armor for AT, yes they are quite useless. They can ram only and do AT in pair with ziz.

So it doesn't help to counter panther for example. For panther the only solution as always is to break their mobility (mine, guards, AT nade, ram) but it's not at all easy for the moment. Mines are random, guards counter by smoke and not long enough to kill the panther, ram hard to land because high speed of panther, and AT nade has short range (but best choice because of low AI of panther). They need some nerf i think here. but i don't know what could be the better solution : reduce speed? armor? precision while moving? reduce AI like remove MG option? They should remain a good AT tank to flank to counter ISU/KV2/SU85 take out of position.

And one more point is what happens to T70 if T34 is more AI?? Even less than now interesting vs T34 ! Ouch !

For other tanks :
- Tiger a bit cheap and can be spam but their low range make them not so good.
- IS2 have a bit too much AI.
- KV2 and ISU are ok. Good but can be counter.
- Elefant also. Perhaps a bit to much rear armor. Several T34 even in his back can't kill him easy.....
- P4/SU76/SU85 are ok for me
- KV1 only goal is to take shoots with something else to do dammage....
- KV8 is gamebreaker now. But for the moment it is also the only solution to counter grenader spam... Reduce is dps a bit for me is the only thing it needs.
- Ostwind/brumbar : Good AI and only one can be very painfull for sov if the ost don't overcommit with him.
- katyusha and panzerwerfer are ok. katyusha is less effective no? i find him not enough precise. It could help or do nothing so in this case this waste cost the game..

I seriously hope this was an attempt at a joke.

T34 dmg at 160 with RAM and it's AI?

You're buffing the IS2 and ISU 152's AT capabilities while presumably keeping their excellent AI dmg?

I hope this is not the case. I suspect the new armies and the upcoming soviet army will leave the ostheer in the dust.

How would you feel if the T34 damage went to 160 then?

I seriously hope this was an attempt at a joke.

T34 dmg at 160 with RAM and it's AI?

You're buffing the IS2 and ISU 152's AT capabilities while presumably keeping their excellent AI dmg?

I hope this is not the case. I suspect the new armies and the upcoming soviet army will leave the ostheer in the dust.

Of course it's a joke.

It's a joke because too much but perhaps they going to go in this direction.

Don't start whine here juste on predictions...

You want to lower elefant's armor? No problem, but increase movement speed.

It's balance. We don't have to give you something because we decrease a too much powerfull unit. I said the same on KV8 or IS2

How would you feel if the T34 damage went to 160 then?

Good thread, always fun to read speculation as it gives some insights into what some of the players want.

edit: I just wanted to comment on one last thing. We agree with the sentiment that the Soviet core army needs to be effective against all opposing units on its own. Counters should not be exclusive to doctrines that is.

The damage buff would be nice, but I don't think is necessary in the case for the T34/76. Like somebody else said, it would make it too similar to the T34/85, unless that is getting changed too.

I think the problem is the 80 main gun penetration that makes successful flanking less rewarding when shots constantly fail to penetrate anything larger than a P4. Fighting panthers and tigers on the field? Forget it. Players going T3 in late game are often forced to either 1) lose their tanks and not make a scratch, or 2) ram AND lose their tanks.

There will be more incentive to keep the T34 alive if shots can actually do something. Their armor is already paper-thin - and I think that's OK for its cost - so their role really is to conduct quick flanking hit-and-run assault. This is currently very unrewarding if not impossible to do even if you have large quantity of them. Unless you ram every panther/tiger you see, which is what I've seen many people do if they go T3.

Increasing the penetration (to 110?) and maybe a small buff to its mobility would be a good step. It would be an agile, glass canon tank that requires micro and smart flanking to make full use of it. It would still lose vs a P4 on a head-on assault so that mid-game engagement is largely unchanged. But it'll make it scale a little better vs late game armor rather than always forced to resort to ramming.

That's my 2c anyway.

You want to lower elefant's armor? No problem, but increase movement speed.

Sure thing, give it ISU-152 armor and mobility.
I won't oppose.

interesting. T34 can't be increased too much dammage or they going to be better than P4. Perhaps penetration is a better way. But it doesn't help against infantry

152 already has more mobility than elefant, I believe, and that thing wipe out everything and even if you have Mark vehicle, it becomes jesus, unless you have an elefant, its pretty much GG if your opponents cant flank. That is his downside, armor and health.

Elefant is only antivehicle, so approach with zis or shrecked-infantry, even connscripts with AT nade or guards button + IL2 bombing strike and boom. It has more armor, but 0 mobility as I stated in top (I believe).

I'm curious as to how they'll change the ISU. I already kind of liked it as it was, I hope that they don't just turn it into a long range AT gun. I enjoyed having it as basically a mobile artillery unit.

It would be cool if they made it more likely to cause crew shock or something rather than just give it a massive pentetration buff. Something that means it can be used in co-operation with T-34 or AT guns while still being a menace to infantry.

From my understanding this is also historically correct right? It didn't really penetrate armour but the sheer explosive force of it's shells would kill the crew members or cause them damage beyond being able to operate the tank. We also have the Concrete-piercing round ability if we really want to use something like that.

but ost can flank ISU with panther quite well. Try to flank an elefant with T34. Not possible. Only IS2 can do this.

For infantry AT (ziz, AT nade, guard) you won't going to kill an elefant. Only one grenader or MG make these options not possible. Then what to do? Even if succes, it's not going to be an elefant killed. Yesterday i flanked it with ziz and it succes to escape. An elefant flanked by a ziz should be more punitive ! That's why i said rear armor of elefant should have to be a bit decrease.

Soviets are going to get more options to counter the Elefant in next patch, lets wait and see.

I hope they leave Conscripts as they are and focus on improving the unit composition of the Soviets in regards to other infantry units.

Regarding Balance in 3v3/4v4:

I often read Ostheer is OP in this patch and I also often read: "Soviet's need a counter to XXX that's not doctrinal."

May be true in 1v1 and 2v2. But seriously, those are not the matches where you find heavy tank spam that need to be countered.

When you now go to 3v3 and 4v4 (what I believe many people like) I often see it the other way round - you NEED an Elephant as Ost-player, because Soviets can dug in so incredibly well and on many Maps you don't have a chance for flanking (what's a real problem for Ostheer against ISU/SU) as well, because there are units all over the map.

So please, no overnerfs. And also: Lategame sucks, because Infantry just gets roflstomped. Please limit heavy tanks to 1 per player.