How the new Patch changed the flow and feel of the game.

So the March Deployment patch is here. I can remember myself being very hyped towards it. Before it was released obviously. I am sick of it right now and i have the inner wish that everything would go back to the old status.

Why do i think so?

Well, i will do my best to explain my point.

The Patch was meant to improve the infantry combat and make cover more valuable / important. And im actually fine with that idea. But not to the extent it is now. Open fields are basically no - go zones now. You get shredded as soon as you leave cover. The patch is encouraging players to stay in cover. The infantry battles are now meant to be far more interesting and tactical, with more depth added to them. But i think that Relic failed to accomplish their goal.

My opinion is that it makes infantry engagements rather boring as everyone now needs to sit in cover. Aggressive and mobile pushes are now being more penalized and punished more than ever before. Deep snow gets even more annoying now.

But my biggest complaint about this new patch is the fact that one faction seems to work well with these changes as its more static. The other faction however relies on mobility and its abilities to succeed. And by that i obviously have the Soviets in mind. You always needed to compensate for the lack of really powerful weapon upgrades with Soviets. You needed to use their mobility to compensate. Soviets dont have any decent infantry weaponry suited for long ranges, Germans outclass every weapon the soviets have at every range but the closest one. So that means that you have to close the distance with Soviets, and this still applies to the new patch as the Soviets still dont have long range weaponry.

But how are you supposed to close the distance?

Even moving through cover isnt that effective as the DPS of german squads is still way higher and it still will damage your squads quite badly. Your squad is usually half dead when it finally closes the distance now.
And the Germans are still very potent at close range. You really dont have that big of an advantage.

What does this mean? Its a constant uphill battle.

No matter at how you look at it, the Soviets need to close in and rely on their mobility, and this is actually punished in this patch. Mobile pushes against static entrenched enemies are now more penalized than ever, because cover is so important now and having a squad in the open usually means its dead.

And thats my point. The current patch sharply contradicts and penalizes the obvious advantage and design of one faction.

And this really isnt how balance looks like. Yes, i know, before the patch it was all about PPSH and mollies. But is it really justified that one faction doesnt really need to adapt while other one now has to play against their strengths and get punished when trying to make use of those? Really?

Feel free to discuss.

Well written. Please change back to the Aftermath patch. The game flow was great and it was fun to play. Now I feel like Tarzan swinging from cover to cover and it feels static, where is the drive?
Relic spent month after month to get it well balanced and woosh... its gone. I don't get it.

Very accurate and descriptive, I hope relic it can adequately convey the game.

It's a great patch but implemented evil.

I cannot stress enough how much I love the new infantry combat.

Gameplay-wise its simply amazing. No "Run straight at the enemy with shocks/assault grens" anymore. Cover deciding who is going to win the engagement. Its great. And I dont feel that there is too little movement, not at all to be honest. Its tactical movement from now on. The gameplay still is very dynamic but now you have to think about HOW to move your units and in certain situations its truly better to have a squad stand still behind instead of a blind rush into enemy lines. In my opinion: Exactly as it should be.

Balance-wise I cant really say anything though. Sometimes I felt that Cons were little too weak but then in another game my team and me got utterly destroyed by vanilla cons (superior skill involved aswell though). There is currently so much happening Im surprised that so many players already seem to be able to pinpoint what is OP and what isnt. Let the meta game evolve a little, soviets seem to be more reliant on tier 1 or tier 2 now.

Flanking pios are a little bit hilarious though...The pioneer squad does seem a little too strong but then again it also doesent scale well. That might need some tweaking but the important part is not to fuck up the Combat Engineer vs Pioneer balance at the same time. But then again I always thought that CEs should be a bit superior to Pios anyway.

Cover system is OK. Be patient, they will keep fixing the unbalanced issues. I don't think they will wait 1 month till the new patch because they may risk in losing playerbase.

I played 3 games as soviets in 2v2. Won all of them, but it's true i feel unbalance issues like pioneers wining conscript squad (pioners charging) and grenadier 25ammo grenade. I think that's now more viable to build some tier at the begining with soviets since using only conscripts will make you be weak. Ooray for focusing fire works great too...

Flanking pios are a little bit hilarious though...The pioneer squad does seem a little too strong but also doesent scale well. That might need some tweaking but the important part is not to fuck up the Combat Engineer vs Pioneer balance at the same time. But then again I always thought that CEs should be a bit superior to Pios anyway.

They were originally planned that way, but changed it back in beta. If I remember correctly I believe the CEs were a little more expensive, but where a bit stronger in combat. It gave the soviets too much early power because they would always beat the first engagment with the pios so they took it out. Seems that they are repeating a similar problem again.

Well written. Please change back to the Aftermath patch. The game flow was great and it was fun to play. Now I feel like Tarzan swinging from cover to cover and it feels static, where is the drive?
Relic spent month after month to get it well balanced and woosh... its gone. I don't get it.

Thats how i see it too.

Before the cover system was not working right, now tidied, and are finding it bad?

It can only be because they started losing, because before it was just run up, without problems, chest of steel!

The game is evolving for me, became more real this time ...

Bravus, the cover system always worked, now it just has much more impact. This change favors the Germans much more than it does the soviets and the opening post perfectly explained why.

Bravus, the cover system always worked, now it just has much more impact. This change favors the Germans much more than it does the soviets and the opening post perfectly explained why.

Direct you happen to be well positioned, with up green protection, and the enemy came up, breaststroke steel, taking shots, there comes close or even the side of the infantry looked like they were wanting to kiss, or a Molotov etc... Now this issue has improved

How can you close the distance?

Shocks: Smoke
Conscripts: Oorah
Guards: Better at range
Penals: You got me there
Partisans: Ambush

Mortars are more effective now since germans hug cover, so I recommend that.

This patch has made infantry combat fun and has thankfully stopped the rush to armour that it was previous.

Disagree with OP.
This game gained some depth because of the recent changes. I do understand how some people may struggle to adapt but going back is the worst thing that could happened.

Completely agree with opener. It now feels like the only role of any soviet infantry is to try and somehow hold onto a reasonable portion of the map while not losing the manpower war too badly (you will always be losing it in infantry combat) while you are gathering fuel and/or cps for tanks. Attacks of any kind seem extremely high risk with little to no reward.

Most successful tactic really seems to be to bunker up with a few T2 units (but overinvest and you'll just get bombarded to death by mortar ht) and rush to a T70 as fast as possible by building several fuel caches. Or guard motor and wait a bit longer than that for T34/85, but skipping the fuel caches because you'll have plenty..

How can you close the distance?

Shocks: Smoke
Conscripts: Oorah
Guards: Better at range
Penals: You got me there
Partisans: Ambush

Mortars are more effective now since germans hug cover, so I recommend that.

• Shock smoke only helps you approach against people who for some reason won't use the smoke to relocate just as far behind.
  
• Have you tried oorahing into an lmg squad? I can tell you how that goes with ppsh cons: even vet3 ppsh cons will lose 100% guaranteed against a vet0 LMG gren squad if they have to oorah up to them first.
  
• Guards are at best equal (to be honest my personal opinion is that they are still weaker, but you can disagree with this) with LMG grens at range. As such you are fighting a 240/60 unit with a 360/100, and breaking even with kills. Not exactly a good use of resources.
  
• Penals got oorah, but same issue as cons. You're dead if you have to try approach like this with the new damage ratings.
  

BOTH sides hug cover (soviets have to do it more than germans in fact, because germans have far better ranged damage). So germans can and should indeed take a mortar ht every game because it can completely annihilate all the soviet weapon teams very easily through incendiary barrages. If you really have some reason not to get a mortar HT, even the normal axis mortar fires >30% faster than the soviet one for otherwise exactly same stats so it'll do far more damage on average. Though to be honest rifle nades are enough clearance for pretty much all situations.

Game gained some depth at the cost of the Soviet Early game Advantage. While nothing is done to the Ost late game advantage.

I like the changes in lethality but not the rebalancing of units. It is harder then ever to have early game map control before the real late game thrashing begins.

I think changes are needed for Soviet support teams to help them dislodge Ostheers turtle. Staying in sandbags is suicide for Conscripts if a Mortor is present. Ost doesnt suffer from the same fate.

Also as noted failed assaults are much less forgiving now and when you rely on them being the aggresive focused faction then you are at a distinct disadvantage.

Completely agree with opener. It now feels like the only role of any soviet infantry is to try and somehow hold onto a reasonable portion of the map while not losing the manpower war too badly (you will always be losing it in infantry combat) while you are gathering fuel and/or cps for tanks. Attacks of any kind seem extremely high risk with little to no reward.

Most successful tactic really seems to be to bunker up with a few T2 units (but overinvest and you'll just get bombarded to death by mortar ht) and rush to a T70 as fast as possible by building several fuel caches.

• Shock smoke only helps you approach against people who for some reason won't use the smoke to relocate just as far behind.
  
• Have you tried oorahing into an lmg squad? I can tell you how that goes with ppsh cons: even vet3 ppsh cons will lose 100% guaranteed against a vet0 LMG gren squad if they have to oorah up to them first.
  
• Guards are at best equal (to be honest my personal opinion is that they are still weaker, but you can disagree with this) with LMG grens at range. As such you are fighting a 240/60 unit with a 360/100, and breaking even with kills. Not exactly a good use of resources.
  
• Penals got oorah, but same issue as cons. You're dead if you have to try approach like this with the new damage ratings.
  

BOTH sides hug cover (soviets have to do it more than germans in fact, because germans have far better ranged damage). So germans can and should indeed take a mortar ht every game because it can completely annihilate all the soviet weapon teams very easily through incendiary barrages. If you really have some reason not to get a mortar HT, even the normal axis mortar fires >30% faster than the soviet one for otherwise exactly same stats so it'll do far more damage on average. Though to be honest rifle nades are enough clearance for pretty much all situations.

Nonsense. As a German player these are the things that get me on the back foot and the mortar half track complaint is nonsense - it's the only good thing in those doctrines. Frankly after your trolling on Danes channel you have no credibility on this issue at all.

Completely agree with opener. It now feels like the only role of any soviet infantry is to try and somehow hold onto a reasonable portion of the map while not losing the manpower war too badly (you will always be losing it in infantry combat) while you are gathering fuel and/or cps for tanks. Attacks of any kind seem extremely high risk with little to no reward.

Most successful tactic really seems to be to bunker up with a few T2 units (but overinvest and you'll just get bombarded to death by mortar ht) and rush to a T70 as fast as possible by building several fuel caches.

• Shock smoke only helps you approach against people who for some reason won't use the smoke to relocate just as far behind.
  
• Have you tried oorahing into an lmg squad? I can tell you how that goes with ppsh cons: even vet3 ppsh cons will lose 100% guaranteed against a vet0 LMG gren squad if they have to oorah up to them first.
  
• Guards are at best equal (to be honest my personal opinion is that they are still weaker, but you can disagree with this) with LMG grens at range. As such you are fighting a 240/60 unit with a 360/100, and breaking even with kills. Not exactly a good use of resources.
  
• Penals got oorah, but same issue as cons. You're dead if you have to try approach like this with the new damage ratings.
  

BOTH sides hug cover (soviets have to do it more than germans in fact, because germans have far better ranged damage). So germans can and should indeed take a mortar ht every game because it can completely annihilate all the soviet weapon teams very easily through incendiary barrages. If you really have some reason not to get a mortar HT, even the normal axis mortar fires >30% faster than the soviet one for otherwise exactly same stats so it'll do far more damage on average. Though to be honest rifle nades are enough clearance for pretty much all situations.

Good point you have there. Me and my pal encountered many german players 2vs2 on the new river map (dunno the name) spamming mortar halftracks. It's really hard to counter them, because the map doesn't offer many possibilities to get close to them. Even M3 with Guards mostly doesn't work because MHT's get support by Grens fausting the M3 .

Nonsense. As a German player these are the things that get me on the back foot and the mortar half track complaint is nonsense - it's the only good thing in those doctrines. Frankly after your trolling on Danes channel you have no credibility on this issue at all.

Cruzz is ranked 8th on the german 1v1 ladder and 15th on the soviet 1v1 ladder.
You are ranked above >800 on the german 1v1 ladder, and you have a total of 0 games played as soviets.
I'd say cruzz's analysis of the current state of the game is far, far more accurate and credible than yours.

Staying in sandbags is suicide for Conscripts if a Mortor is present. Ost doesnt suffer from the same fate.

Excuse me? Soviets have a mortar, and also the 120mm... Zis barrage, SU76 barrage, Katyuscha, Artillery, ISU-152. Ostheer squadwipes are still happening, even more with the new patch.

Now I agree that some changes have to be made, but the newly added tactical element is very fun. It makes the game a bit harder against good opponents, while adding depth and action. So far me and my mates are having lots of fun, on both sides!

Cruzz is ranked 8th on the german 1v1 ladder and 15th on the soviet 1v1 ladder.
You are ranked above >800 on the german 1v1 ladder, and you have a total of 0 games played as soviets.
I'd say cruzz's analysis of the current state of the game is far, far more accurate and credible than yours.

And were you on Dane's channel when Cruzz was being a 'Cunt'? No? Well then you don't know what I (Or you it seems) are talking about.

I don't understand what people are talking about with this talk about static gameplay... I've played around 10 matches after the patch with Sov mostly, and there's a remarkedly emphasized chess-like aspect of back-and-forth maneuver between cover now that wasn't there before. It's anything but static as you're constantly attempting to anticipate the next move of the opponent and positioning your units accordingly to gain an advantage.

It's not about simply taking a green cover position and then watching as your cons die to grens in similar cover. You need to move.

Sure, I'm no expert, but that's my 2 cents.