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russian armor

Ultimate guide to further improving coh2

12 Mar 2014, 07:13 AM
#21
avatar of buckers

Posts: 230

OP is really likes germany, huh?
youre ideas are okay, they need some tweaking but your heart is in the right space

Molotov are bullshit, especially for a player in Australia that has a 3 second delay input on most of his games (ie: me)

i tried to make a thread about it, but the mods deleted it, because 'he didn't like the idea'

i agree, 100%. this will make the game tenfold better

but relic will not do it, they're just....i don't.... they're just.... silly people.

we can make these changes in the coh2 elite mod
(they won't enable modding - since it deters sales of their doctrines and skins, YAY CAPITALISM)
12 Mar 2014, 07:32 AM
#22
avatar of WiFiDi
Honorary Member Badge

Posts: 3293

a thought the title seems a tad egotistical. these are your opinions not everyone elses, my only gripe. :)

i might put my thoughts down later after i take a tumble into the never ending pit.:(
15 Mar 2014, 23:26 PM
#23
avatar of HS King

Posts: 331

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Mar 2014, 07:32 AMWiFiDi
a thought the title seems a tad egotistical. these are your opinions not everyone elses, my only gripe. :)

i might put my thoughts down later after i take a tumble into the never ending pit.:(


Lol the title is only here to attract readers , thanks look forward to your input
16 Mar 2014, 01:17 AM
#24
avatar of dasheepeh

Posts: 2115 | Subs: 1

Whats with the Molotov hate?? Does this ability, which has a very long and easily recognizeable animation, really ruin the early game? I mean, really? Fire nades? Conscripts are designed to be more of a close range units, while Grenadiers are better suited for long range. I really dont see the issue with molotovs at all
16 Mar 2014, 02:25 AM
#25
avatar of Aerohank

Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1

Whats with the Molotov hate?? Does this ability, which has a very long and easily recognizeable animation, really ruin the early game? I mean, really? Fire nades? Conscripts are designed to be more of a close range units, while Grenadiers are better suited for long range. I really dont see the issue with molotovs at all


People just don't want to micro their units to avoid damage. The only micro germans want to do is micro that causes damage; i.e. rifle grenades.
16 Mar 2014, 05:57 AM
#26
avatar of sluzbenik

Posts: 879



People just don't want to micro their units to avoid damage. The only micro germans want to do is micro that causes damage; i.e. rifle grenades.


Dude, we have to back up our tanks a lot, isn't that enough?

But seriously yeah, I think some of us would like to play Ostheer like Soviets, and you can't do that. But how many rifle nades do you have to dodge a match vs Molotovs? I don't think it's that OP, it's just annoying, like a fly you can't quite swat, over and over.

16 Mar 2014, 07:29 AM
#27
avatar of Omega_Warrior

Posts: 2561



Dude, we have to back up our tanks a lot, isn't that enough?

But seriously yeah, I think some of us would like to play Ostheer like Soviets, and you can't do that. But how many rifle nades do you have to dodge a match vs Molotovs? I don't think it's that OP, it's just annoying, like a fly you can't quite swat, over and over.


That's because there are a lot upgrades that the german players want to go for. If they want to span vanilla grens and rnades all day that's definetely an option, but I hardly ever see that option taken.
16 Mar 2014, 14:34 PM
#28
avatar of Aerohank

Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1



Dude, we have to back up our tanks a lot, isn't that enough?

But seriously yeah, I think some of us would like to play Ostheer like Soviets, and you can't do that. But how many rifle nades do you have to dodge a match vs Molotovs? I don't think it's that OP, it's just annoying, like a fly you can't quite swat, over and over.



Sure you can. A rifle grenade costs just as much as a oorah+molotov charge.

Just because you can spend all your ammo on upgrades, doesn't mean you have to. You don't have to upgrade vanila grens to beat vanila conscripts. You don't have to get panzerschreks, you don't have to get a flamer halftrack. Having more options ins't a downside to playing germans, it's a bonus.

If you wan't to play germans like soviets, just pretend all those fancy unit upgrades don't exist. Suddenly you will have plenty of ammo for rifle grenades. Or, alternatively, ask relics for more soviet options to spend munitions on; like non-doctrinal conscript DP upgrades, bazookas for penal troops or whatever. Don't ask for nerfs on the one thing soviets have to spend their early game munitions on when the germans have so many nice options.
16 Mar 2014, 18:39 PM
#29
avatar of herr anfsim

Posts: 247



Sure you can. A rifle grenade costs just as much as a oorah+molotov charge.

Just because you can spend all your ammo on upgrades, doesn't mean you have to. You don't have to upgrade vanila grens to beat vanila conscripts. You don't have to get panzerschreks, you don't have to get a flamer halftrack. Having more options ins't a downside to playing germans, it's a bonus.

If you wan't to play germans like soviets, just pretend all those fancy unit upgrades don't exist. Suddenly you will have plenty of ammo for rifle grenades. Or, alternatively, ask relics for more soviet options to spend munitions on; like non-doctrinal conscript DP upgrades, bazookas for penal troops or whatever. Don't ask for nerfs on the one thing soviets have to spend their early game munitions on when the germans have so many nice options.


I think what a lot of people are saying is that molotovs is to much of a nobrainer. Its something you will use in pretty much every engagement, and it further reduces the effect of cower, wich Relic already toned down.

I dont have much of a problem with the molotovs themselves, but I do think its combat is to centered arround this "spellcasting" kind of gameplay.
16 Mar 2014, 23:55 PM
#30
avatar of JStorm
Benefactor 360

Posts: 93

Molotovs will continue to be a no-brainer until the Soviets get something else to spend their munitions on.
17 Mar 2014, 00:22 AM
#31
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post16 Mar 2014, 23:55 PMJStorm
Molotovs will continue to be a no-brainer until the Soviets get something else to spend their munitions on.

Exactly this.
I don't know how mentally challenged one need to be to think that molotovs will not be the go-to thing when it is the ONLY non doctrinal way of spending munition besides mines.
On top of that, its still additional fuel upgrade, something that germans pay nothing for, because its already included for them.
17 Mar 2014, 01:09 AM
#32
avatar of JHeartless

Posts: 1637

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Mar 2014, 00:22 AMKatitof

Exactly this.
I don't know how mentally challenged one need to be to think that molotovs will not be the go-to thing when it is the ONLY non doctrinal way of spending munition besides mines.
On top of that, its still additional fuel upgrade, something that germans pay nothing for, because its already included for them.


+1
17 Mar 2014, 01:40 AM
#33
avatar of pigsoup
Patrion 14

Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2

can relic remove the damage that airplanes do when they crash into the ground? it's the most ridiculous rng in the game in my opinion.
17 Mar 2014, 05:52 AM
#34
avatar of Omega_Warrior

Posts: 2561

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Mar 2014, 01:40 AMpigsoup
can relic remove the damage that airplanes do when they crash into the ground? it's the most ridiculous rng in the game in my opinion.
What are you talking about? That' the best RNG!
17 Mar 2014, 07:24 AM
#35
avatar of c r u C e

Posts: 525

I don't think nerfing molotovs will ''further improve balance''...they are easy to dodge already
17 Mar 2014, 08:27 AM
#36
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

What are you talking about? That' the best RNG!

Yes, it can win you a game, it can loose you a game, but it should never be touched.

Planes in vCoH did the same(gliders are not planes) and everything was fine.
17 Mar 2014, 08:30 AM
#37
avatar of herr anfsim

Posts: 247

jump backJump back to quoted post16 Mar 2014, 23:55 PMJStorm
Molotovs will continue to be a no-brainer until the Soviets get something else to spend their munitions on.


Obviously. Point remains though.
17 Mar 2014, 08:55 AM
#38
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8



Obviously. Point remains though.

Its not really any 'point' though, its just underlining/pointing out the intended design.

Soviets are ability focused faction, germans are upgrade focused faction, molotovs are offensive area denial ability.

Everything works as intended here.
17 Mar 2014, 09:14 AM
#39
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 807

I don't think molotovs are the real problem here. The only somehow bothering thing in my opinion is that a con squad spotted and engaged by an mg42 squad will still be able to throw a molotov in the face during a frontal attack. But I don't see how this can be changed, because buffing mg42 will probably not be a wise option, nor nerfing the molotov.

Someone said that molotov should produce damage in time (maybe after 2 seconds), not from the first second, as penalty for lack of attention and/or bad micro. Maybe this?
17 Mar 2014, 09:32 AM
#40
avatar of sluzbenik

Posts: 879

Yeah, it would be nice to see more ammo upgrades.

A big muni sink for Americans in vCOH was the M8, which cost a ton for armor skirts and a gun. I don't know why they didn't do something similar with the T70. You could upgrade it somehow to pre-nerf status, or give it an MG that could do light suppression like the M8 and drop uber mines, I would love to do that playstyle again. Remember driving an M8 next to a medic bunker and dropping a mine? Good times...

Shocktroops could need to buy their SMGs like Rangers, etc. There are lots of ways they could have given Soviets more interesting munitions-based upgrades.

Instead, what we have is conscripts. Conscripts with SMGs tossing Molotovs until we all have carpal-tunnel syndrome.




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