I was right about the failure of COH3.

I CALLED IT:

All my life I have been preaching that balancing around numbers and stats instead of design decisions is wrong and unfun. Today on the trending stuff this got posted:



I CALLED IT - PROOF:
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So proud to have opened the eyes of those who are willing to see.

Game’s not even gonna be out for like a year, you donut.

Game’s not even gonna be out for like a year, you donut.

Your point: --------------------------------------------------------------->

My post's point:
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(Orthogonal parallel lines never meet, Euclid's Parallel postulate) aka there is no point in arguing with you.

you have gone insane, finally

Something about this video annoys me. Basically attributing causaulity all over the place to create a picture that fits his "campaigns are kewl, units should make big boom!!!!!!!" narrative, when in reality the reason that RTS are niche these days is just the fact that popular gaming culture has happened to develop into a different direction for reasons regarding the fundamental gameplay principles underlying the differen genres (e.g. teamplay as core feature is a must have, accessibility needs to be high etc.). No, better campaigns wouldn't suddenly lead to RTS becoming mainstream games. It's so obviously not true. Anyone who is in touch with what young people are into gaming wise should know this. It's also annoying how he bases his anti multiplayer claims mainly on his own viewerbase, when his entire channel is dedicated to RTS CAMPAIGNS.

Edit: Okay I finished it and it has only gotten worse at the end. His point about RTS having to be sandbox...because Minecraft was succesful? what?

Something about this video annoys me. Basically attributing causaulity all over the place to create a picture that fits his "campaigns are kewl, units should make big boom!!!!!!!" narrative, when in reality the reason that RTS are niche these days is just the fact that popular gaming culture has happened to develop into a different direction for reasons regarding the fundamental gameplay principles underlying the differen genres (e.g. teamplay as core feature is a must have, accessibility needs to be high etc.). No, better campaigns wouldn't suddenly lead to RTS becoming mainstream games. It's so obviously not true. Anyone who is in touch with what young people are into gaming wise should know this. It's also annoying how he bases his anti multiplayer claims mainly on his own viewerbase, when his entire channel is dedicated to RTS CAMPAIGNS.

Edit: Okay I finished it and it has only gotten worse at the end. His point about RTS having to be sandbox...because Minecraft was succesful? what?

LMAO you are wrong on so many levels I doubt if you actually watched the video and even if you did, I doubt you can understand what the video was about.

Basically it said that: RTS ShOULD NOT be balanced around competitive symmetrical statistic designs BUT on actual artistic choices as seen on Starcraft II which is actually what COH SHOULD be (factions that end up playing fair against each other while being COMPLETELY different in terms of unit types).

Also, saying that
Show Spoiler

Is a completely sterile and unproductive view, because it does not begin to touch the reality of 2022 RTS games. The truth is that RTS games want to be like AOE (which was the best RTS ever in 1990 terms) and be linear, every faction being the same, and the game coming down to build order vs build order and speed/skill aka they cater to really professional and really one-sided people.

COH almost broke that curse with WFA (and please don't start the bullshit with OP and UP units) but over the long run it tends to be like another cookie cutter game that caters to babies. That's where I also make the claim that I have been talking about it for YEARS.

LMAO you are wrong on so many levels I doubt if you actually watched the video and even if you did, I doubt you can understand what the video was about.

Basically it said that: RTS ShOULD NOT be balanced around competitive symmetrical statistic designs BUT on actual artistic choices as seen on Starcraft II which is actually what COH SHOULD be (factions that end up playing fair against each other while being COMPLETELY different in terms of unit types).

Also, saying that
Show Spoiler

Is a completely sterile and unproductive view, because it does not begin to touch the reality of 2022 RTS games. The truth is that RTS games want to be like AOE (which was the best RTS ever in 1990 terms) and be linear, every faction being the same, and the game coming down to build order vs build order and speed/skill aka they cater to really professional and really one-sided people.

COH almost broke that curse with WFA (and please don't start the bullshit with OP and UP units) but over the long run it tends to be like another cookie cutter game that caters to babies. That's where I also make the claim that I have been talking about it for YEARS.

So you want an extra large king tiger that shoots nukes and that would make coh2 a mainstream game?

What the fuck am I reading/watching?

So you want an extra large king tiger that shoots nukes and that would make coh2 a mainstream game?

Yup probably what hes hopin for. Would be a perfect unit for him to kill tm8s bases with lmao

Would be a perfect unit for him to kill tm8s bases with lmao

COH almost broke that curse with WFA (and please don't start the bullshit with OP and UP units)

You know what was another main point of the video? That a big majority of the playerbase doesnt care about multiplayer/automatch. Yet somehow you wanna argue with WFA balance now.



RTS isn't mainstream because you don't learn the basics in ~1 hour like in a shooter game. And not because there isnt enough crazy stuff in automatch.

I get your point when a game is seemingly prioritizing balance over fun but I think you can do that without flooding the ranked automatch with crazy bullshit mechanics that often only lead to fun for one side but not both. Add official fun game modes to the game and give the community access to very powerful modding tools etc.

Cool video, I definitely agree that custom content would make or break an RTS.

I think he had an interesting point in that an extreme focus on esports puts players off. I think the last 2 years of Coh2 is a good example of that. I've gone on a rant on it too many times so its nice to see someone that agrees. Hope Coh3 doesn't go the same way.

Cool video, I definitely agree that custom content would make or break an RTS.

I think he had an interesting point in that an extreme focus on esports puts players off. I think the last 2 years of Coh2 is a good example of that. I've gone on a rant on it too many times so its nice to see someone that agrees. Hope Coh3 doesn't go the same way.

Because according to statistics, eSports is about 10% of the game's audience. And reworking the game so that these 10% would be comfortable to play without thinking that other people can lose fun in the game is a very bad idea. That's why I don't like all the esports hype and balancing around the esports mode. For eSports, there should be a separate game mode.

You can well have OP/fun/... stuff in campaigns and custom games but leave it out of competitive multiplayer.
If you can get access to a V1 rocket strike in campaign - fine. Could be fun. Why not?!

The builder stuff - interesting opinion. Thank you for sharing the video.

Multiplayer balance doesn't impact single player campaign if you set them into two different stat folders.

The rooting question is what bring more revenue on a game.

- New content = direct revenue
- Fun goodies = direct revenue
- Multiplayer/Competition = indirect revenue, maintain the game live between two content additions.
- Modding = indirect revenue, he is right on this point Relic must release something solid to allow players to create their own content.

In term of multiplayer, Relic needs to develop a solid lobby that can include the others aspects:
- New content, coop content to play with friends.
- New competitive mods, Imo we reached to the end of the capture the flag mod and it needs to be renewed
- Fun goodies, skins, voices, UI
- Modding, the lobby should integrate better the mod, give them much more visibility.

I think Relic is already doing a great job on the single player experience, the Ardenne campaign was an interesting try and COH3 campaign taking all the good ideas from Total War experience is probably the way the go to catch new solo players.

RTS not popular because people are musch dumber today. It is established fact that global IQ drops 1 point per year.
People simply do not have the brain to play these games.

Yup probably what hes hopin for. Would be a perfect unit for him to kill tm8s bases with lmao

Yes very funny

Because according to statistics, eSports is about 10% of the game's audience. And reworking the game so that these 10% would be comfortable to play without thinking that other people can lose fun in the game is a very bad idea. That's why I don't like all the esports hype and balancing around the esports mode. For eSports, there should be a separate game mode.

Or not at all but ok.

10% is WAY too high for esports """fans""". Maybe CSGO and LOL have those numbers but COH2 is like 0.001%.

RTS isn't mainstream because you don't learn the basics in ~1 hour like in a shooter game. And not because there isnt enough crazy stuff in automatch.

Sad but true.

Multiplayer balance doesn't impact single player campaign if you set them into two different stat folders.

The rooting question is what bring more revenue on a game.

- New content = direct revenue
- Fun goodies = direct revenue
- Multiplayer/Competition = indirect revenue, maintain the game live between two content additions.
- Modding = indirect revenue, he is right on this point Relic must release something solid to allow players to create their own content.

In term of multiplayer, Relic needs to develop a solid lobby that can include the others aspects:
- New content, coop content to play with friends.
- New competitive mods, Imo we reached to the end of the capture the flag mod and it needs to be renewed
- Fun goodies, skins, voices, UI
- Modding, the lobby should integrate better the mod, give them much more visibility.

I think Relic is already doing a great job on the single player experience, the Ardenne campaign was an interesting try and COH3 campaign taking all the good ideas from Total War experience is probably the way the go to catch new solo players.

I have repeatedly talked about this (did I cite my "Make COH3 MP F2P to save the franchise" post?). The business model of F2P and paid shit inside game is the future for every game that wants to have a decent pool of players.