Commander Update Beta 2021 - British Feedback

it can be overlooked to a certain degree, but yeah. It remind me once i created a highland infantry section with sniper voice line, sound pretty nice i will say. Sure the ausies wont sound that good. I will just stick with Recon section then, they can fit to more than one commander.

The Commando voicelines also fit from what I remember since they never actually say "Commandos", again from what I remember at least.

Think voice lines is the main issue...

Once if i remember correctly you suggest Polish section with Polish voice line.

Once if i remember correctly you suggest Polish section with Polish voice line.

True but I there is polish voice lines in the campaign and partisans.

Do you have anything to add that has more to do with UKF feedback and less with me?

Do you have anything to add that has more to do with UKF feedback and less with me?

That was cool idea that's it

That was cool idea that's it

Yes common wealth units for UKF force would be cool if they could be implemented.

I still dream of the day people consider a preview an actual preview (i.e. a testing ground) and keep in mind that especially in the first iteration there are going to be a lot of values that need further tweaking. We're creating a new weapon here, is it really a surprise that the values might be off on the first try? Wait for further iterations before coming up with these kind of remarks please. This type of feedback is worthless.

I do think most of us are with you

But I have another question about the basic integration of this unit (not about actual values). Why adding them at a commander which already has a special infantry unit? Wouldn't it be more interesting to move the Commando call-in to another commander? I'm all in for additional infantry options at multiple UKF commanders to give alternatives to the standard IS build.

True but I there is polish voice lines in the campaign and partisans.

polish voice line ? The game event have these ?

polish voice line ? The game event have these ?

Well there is Annya who is polish resistance and comes with some polish partisans as far as I can remember. I have not actually checked to see what is available.

The problem with the Polish (partisan) voice lines is that they're in the Soviet speech files and speech files are tied to each specific faction.

So in order to use the partisan voices from the Soviets for a British unit they'd have to rip them out from the Soviet speech files and put them in the UKF ones.

I believe there was even a tutorial on how to do this for CoH on the old relicnews site that's now defunct as well but the only way to see it is through the Wayback machine site that contains the archives for anyone that's interested in it.

In a few short words, not possible because only Relic I believe can repack the speech files for CoH2, at least currently.

Thanks for the info

polish voice line ? The game event have these ?

Considering the fact that there is.... you know.... fully voiced polish language client since day one, yeah, there are polish voice lines.

let mortar pit auto fire other mortars

I still dream of the day people consider a preview an actual preview (i.e. a testing ground) and keep in mind that especially in the first iteration there are going to be a lot of values that need further tweaking. We're creating a new weapon here, is it really a surprise that the values might be off on the first try? Wait for further iterations before coming up with these kind of remarks please. This type of feedback is worthless.

Speaking of future iterations. Could you consider looking at the AI strafe in Tactical Support's FOP. It's buggy and will target vehicles despite being an AI stafe. Would be a nice bug fix/slight buff to the commander. Thanks~

Air Resupply Operation

The ability offer too much for cost 100/75:
3 medic kit = 30 munition for Ostheer
ATG = 125/60 for USF
Mortar = (lets say same cost for HMG) 125/50
Sprint in out combat
+50 Reinforcement speed
on the other hand it comes rather late.

Suggestions:
Either change to 1 medic 1 mortar and lower CP to 2 price to 125/40
or
move make Forward assembly able to drop the item separately

Assault


Suggestions:
Extend the ability to include Ro. Engineer
Remove recon planes or limit to 1

Churchill Crocodile

Suggestions:
Remove flare
Trade durability for damage output
Does not benefit WAR speed
increase EFH to 1200 buy adding damage reduction modifier
DOT flamer move to ability instead of always on

Commandos
Increasing the overlap glider and FL glider is a step in the wrong direction.

Suggestions:
Consider changing the command types. FLG for instance could provide AT commandos with 5 rifles and 2 Piats they can put away or Thompson command durably mid oriented with no camo.

Concentrated Fire Operation
Heavy call in like Croc Churchill and "delete emplacement" abilities combo should be avoided. For instance it makes Pak43 useless against Croc.

Forward HQ
The ability comes way to late and it would be more useful if available earlier.


Suggestions:
CP 1-2 can convert ambient building increasing sight by 10 allowing reinforce.
Can call in medic kit
Can call in flares
Can call base barrage similar FA at extended range
health of building to set level 75-100%

Similar bonus upgrade available for FA

If there is need for stronger Off map that can be locked behind Hammer/Anvil or require further tech

Hold the Line
Ability has limitation in use/is confusing as to what is front-line sector and can be countered by decaping
Improve usability.

Suggestions:
Now target a single sector
Cost to 120
now does cancel even if the sector is capped
(similar change should apply to other abilities like perimeter overwatch, sector artillery)

Improved Fortifications
the idea is not bad but very hard to implement and imo other solution should be implemented. Focus this ability in making emplacements more cost efficient.


Suggestions:
upgrade now reduced pop cost by 2
gives garrison bonus
includes advances assembly to free a spot
increases the duration of brace or decreases CD

If there is a need for counter fire now can call in barrage similar to the one in FA with extended range

M3 Resupply Halftrack
The recent change have made Tank hunter less desirable.


Suggestions:
Scraping tank hunter and replacing piat with Boy in HT freeing 1 commander slot possibly for "Artillery Cover" or some other off map

Raid Section
Unit is too good and need changes.

Suggestions:
Now comes with 5 rifles using VG/Grenadier power level depending on received accuracy modifiers
Cap bonus reduces to 1.15 being able to sprint and cap faster is too much
Unit now has "fire and maneuver" training allowing them to fire Brens on the move. (bren can use a different having same DPS long range as rifles and better mid/close)
Unit can not build sandbag/cashes
unit keep grenade but not sprint
Vet 1 camo removed

Recovery Sappers

Suggestions:
Ability allow to build Royal sapper from HQ (CP 0 call-in should be avoided since it map depended)
Unit has savage, smoke grenades and come with 5 rifles. Repair speed replaced by 20% repair speed to emplacement plus no damage penalty when repairing.

Moved to "Advanced Emplacement Regiment" replacing "Defensive Operations".
This should solve repairing issue for the commander.

Tank Hunter Infantry Section
great to see vet suited for unit role, would rather see unit scraped or replaced with an AT sapper squad that would have added utility.

Vickers K Light Machien Gun
The idea of making Bren and vicker offer different things is good the implementation not great.

Suggestions:
If one want to go for LMG/Assault rifle design one should probable make Vicker K the lmg and Bren the assault rifle.
In addition the LMG should be limited to 1 taking both weapon slots and even consider making bolster take one slot so that LMG is only available to 4 men squad.

It should also remove the VK from heavy sappers and lower price of the upgrade or even make it free.

There is another solution, VK could provide a unique ability to the squad. For instance squad with VK can not now use an suppression ability affecting a single squad when in garrison.

Air Resupply Operation

The ability offer too much for cost 100/75:
3 medic kit = 30 munition for Ostheer
ATG = 125/60 for USF
Mortar = (lets say same cost for HMG) 125/50
Sprint in out combat
+50 Reinforcement speed
on the other hand it comes rather late.

Suggestions:
Either change to 1 medic 1 mortar and lower CP to 2 price to 125/40
or
move make Forward assembly able to drop the item separately

FOB already drop medic in the current beta, at is stock anyway so only the mortar is a thing.

Assault


Suggestions:
Extend the ability to include Ro. Engineer
Remove recon planes or limit to 1

the plane make it unique and voice line include "air support" so it should stay at least to some extend. If limited to 1, player should be able to chose which sector the plane will go through.

Churchill Crocodile

Suggestions:
Remove flare
Trade durability for damage output
Does not benefit WAR speed
increase EFH to 1200 buy adding damage reduction modifier

can be a thing.

DOT flamer move to ability instead of always on

not needed.

Commandos
Increasing the overlap glider and FL glider is a step in the wrong direction.

Suggestions:
Consider changing the command types. FLG for instance could provide AT commandos with 5 rifles and 2 Piats they can put away or Thompson command durably mid oriented with no camo.

British paratrooper can be a thing and fit the commander. I have an "air landing infantry section" in personal mod.

Concentrated Fire Operation
Heavy call in like Croc Churchill and "delete emplacement" abilities combo should be avoided. For instance it makes Pak43 useless against Croc.

other counter are available, namely ele, jag. Pak 43 will still counter croc in vanguard and tac support.

Forward HQ
The ability comes way to late and it would be more useful if available earlier.


Suggestions:
CP 1-2 can convert ambient building increasing sight by 10 allowing reinforce.
Can call in medic kit
Can call in flares
Can call base barrage similar FA at extended range
health of building to set level 75-100%

Similar bonus upgrade available for FA

If there is need for stronger Off map that can be locked behind Hammer/Anvil or require further tech

solid

Hold the Line
Ability has limitation in use/is confusing as to what is front-line sector and can be countered by decaping
Improve usability.

Suggestions:
Now target a single sector
Cost to 120
now does cancel even if the sector is capped
(similar change should apply to other abilities like perimeter overwatch, sector artillery)

Baseline is that the ability must become less buggy

M3 Resupply Halftrack
The recent change have made Tank hunter less desirable.


Suggestions:
Scraping tank hunter and replacing piat with Boy in HT freeing 1 commander slot possibly for "Artillery Cover" or some other off map

Boy At rifle alone is redundant compare to PIAT. Tank hunter section simply can use some more utilities.

I will suggest Lee Enfield Rifle grenade in the M3 instead of vicker K (like echelon, with improvements) so Vicker K can go to special units.

Raid Section
Unit is too good and need changes.

Suggestions:
Now comes with 5 rifles using VG/Grenadier power level depending on received accuracy modifiers
Cap bonus reduces to 1.15 being able to sprint and cap faster is too much
Unit now has "fire and maneuver" training allowing them to fire Brens on the move. (bren can use a different having same DPS long range as rifles and better mid/close)
Unit can not build sandbag/cashes
unit keep grenade but not sprint
Vet 1 camo removed

1.15 cap bonus is that of stock section, so it have to be 1.25 at least if the point is to create a difference. It can be that section decap at 1.5 rate and cap at normal rate so they can harass point quickly.

On the other hand, if power is at Vg lever then no one will use them over stock sections since they will be worse than stock section event out of cover, and the concept of stating weaker and scale better is proving problematic with pfulisiers. Say, how can anything scale better than stock section without being oppressed. Further more, there are not many ways to make them more attractive by utilities, as snare is overlap with at section and aggressive abilities overlap with assault section. Following yuor suggestion, they can be made into osstruppen-like unit with event weaker stat while being cheap, but then the faction/commander dont need an unit like that.

The unit need a clear identiy. "Recon Section" will simply cut it very clean for an infantry section without cover debuff.

Tank Hunter Infantry Section
great to see vet suited for unit role, would rather see unit scraped or replaced with an AT sapper squad that would have added utility.

Change unit to Tank hunter sapper and use sapper models will fix the visual bug with Boys rifle, namely magazine floating under the gun. Tank Hunter sapper can use some utilities like build tank trap and/or heavy AT mines. What i think is not needed is the PIAT upgrade.

Vickers K Light Machien Gun
The idea of making Bren and vicker offer different things is good the implementation not great.

Suggestions:
If one want to go for LMG/Assault rifle design one should probable make Vicker K the lmg and Bren the assault rifle.
In addition the LMG should be limited to 1 taking both weapon slots and even consider making bolster take one slot so that LMG is only available to 4 men squad.

It should also remove the VK from heavy sappers and lower price of the upgrade or even make it free.

There is another solution, VK could provide a unique ability to the squad. For instance squad with VK can not now use an suppression ability affecting a single squad when in garrison.

While making Bren into a Bar and Vicker K into mg42/m1919 is logical, moving bren away from stock is not as Bren gun is standard issue weapon, Vicker K is not, and making BAR-like weapons available stock for ukf will create a lot of new unwanted issues. So i believe those two weapons will stay like they are now, with teaks for vicker k in future beta. What can be done to make things more reasonable is to limit the vicker K for special/elite units (as rifle grenades to M3 suggested above). Point is, while is is weir to see line infantry run and gun with a gun big and chunky like the vicker K, it will be more acceptable when the guys doing that stuff are elite like commandos.

FOB already drop medic in the current beta, at is stock anyway so only the mortar is a thing.

They are difrent types, one is healing only the other healing + stat boost

Boy At rifle alone is redundant compare to PIAT. Tank hunter section simply can use some more utilities.

Boys is actually very good and almost never upgrade AT Hunter with Piat. It would probably be a good upgrade for Sappers, but other things might work also. If it moved to truck then AT hunter can be replaced with another ability.

...
The unit need a clear identiy. "Recon Section" will simply cut it very clean for an infantry section without cover debuff...

You are correct about the identity and the current "Bar riflemen" is proably not the best approach.

If there are CP 1 they do not overlap that much with IS since one will still have to build IS.

Boys is actually very good and almost never upgrade AT Hunter with Piat. It would probably be a good upgrade for Sappers, but other things might work also. If it moved to truck then AT hunter can be replaced with another ability.

boys are decnt, but moving to truck creat other issues, like, what unit do you want it on, section have debuff out of cover that at section just happen to get away from, and dont have snare. Sapper is simply better with piat. At section as a unit is easier to adjust. I have a "grenadier guard section" design, 4 man squad at cp1 who can upgrade to boy at for free, increase squad size to 5, add snare and tank detection, or upgdae to a rifle grenade like echelon for same price but stay 4 man. Vet is still fit for boys at rifle since rifle nade don need effect from vet.
.

You are correct about the identity and the current "Bar riflemen" is proably not the best approach.

If there are CP 1 they do not overlap that much with IS since one will still have to build IS.

once can easy stall for cp1 by dual vicker or UC, and then raid section allow them skip all side tech in the HQ (nade, rack and bolster), which is unheathy.

..boys are decnt, but moving to truck creat other issues, like, what unit do you want it on

They would cheaper, combine both AI and AT and not require tech lock.

I think they would be great for Ro.E. They would add AI and still retain decent AT.

once can easy stall for cp1 by dual vicker or UC, and then raid section allow them skip all side tech in the HQ (nade, rack and bolster), which is unheathy.

In the current implementation it is.

As you say they unit need a clearly defined role.
If it a mainline it should not start with 5 entities and should one range it that is good.
If it is support unit it should have less DPS more utility so that one will not depend on them for fighting.

They would cheaper, combine both AI and AT and not require tech lock.

I think they would be great for Ro.E. They would add AI and still retain decent AT.

i thought we are moving away from the time that at rifle do both ai and at dmg, and event if we came back to that, boys will obviously being long range whike sapper having smg and thus they dont fit together. Further more, If the long range ai dmg isnt notiable, noone will use them since they cant scale beyon LV phase so pp will get PIAT for at anway. On the other hand, poor scaling is exacly what happening with at section now and evnt the PIAT upgade is not going to help them since PIAT is bad compare to zoock/shreck for a dedicate at squad plus their abilities is redundant, so pp end up keep the boy for at least some ai. PIAT on sapper at least cheap and being stock

i thought we are moving away from the time that at rifle do both ai and at dmg, and event if we came back to that, boys will obviously being long range whike sapper having smg and thus they dont fit together. Further more, If the long range ai dmg isnt notiable, noone will use them since they cant scale beyon LV phase so pp will get PIAT for at anway. On the other hand, poor scaling is exacly what happening with at section now and evnt the PIAT upgade is not going to help them since PIAT is bad compare to zoock/shreck for a dedicate at squad plus their abilities is redundant, so pp end up keep the boy for at least some ai. PIAT on sapper at least cheap and being stock

I do not think it work that way. RE do little damage long range. With Boys they would contribute without having to move into the fray.

Imo a free slot on the commander with Boys on truck would be an improvement, you might think differently and that is fine by me.