Smartie's commander reworks: Soviets

And by the way the price differential between the Cromwell and the Comet is a lot higher.

The performance difference between those two is also a lot higher. The 85 only has 10 more armor than the 76, the Comet has 130 more armor than the Cromwell

Don't see how the price of the 85 is a problem

The performance difference between those two is also a lot higher. The 85 only has 10 more armor than the 76, the Comet has 130 more armor than the Cromwell

Don't see how the price of the 85 is a problem

Both T34s have exact same armor, only hp is different.

Both T34s have exact same armor, only hp is different.

That is incorrect. The 34/85 has 160 armor, 34/76 has 150

That is incorrect. The 34/85 has 160 armor, 34/76 has 150

Had to re-check 3 separate sources.
76 is even worse then I thought

That's a lot of bounces from most of that list, esp from contemporary med tanks. Yes the infantry AT has high deflection damage but an auf J will roll right over you (figuratively) long before your deflection dmg kills it. TDs and AT guns are still penetrating reliably but even then it's not a guarantee in the case of the latter.

It's not that high.

PS: 30/120
Elite zook: 25/100
Piat: 25/100
Zook: 20/80
PTRS: 10/40

Unless the cheatcommands is bugged.

It's not that high.

PS: 30/120
Elite zook: 25/100
Piat: 25/100
Zook: 20/80
PTRS: 10/40

Unless the cheatcommands is bugged.

I was speaking in comparison to AT guns and TDs where the deflection damage is negligible. It's still low overall dmg, hence why I've called them meme weapons vs this tank and that it'll roll over you. Thanks for the stat summary though.

I was speaking in comparison to AT guns and TDs where the deflection damage is negligible. It's still low overall dmg, hence why I've called them meme weapons vs this tank and that it'll roll over you. Thanks for the stat summary though.

But deflection dmg on AT guns and TDs is 0 XD

There's few things in the game that deal deflection dmg and most of the time it's inconsequential.

But deflection dmg on AT guns and TDs is 0 XD

There's few things in the game that deal deflection dmg and most of the time it's inconsequential.

Yes, that's what I meant by negligible Tbh, I wasn't sure if there was something in the code that had a 0.001dmg or something. And yes I agree.

That's not an argument imo. The T-34/85 is way to cheap for his performance. And by the way the price differential between the Cromwell and the Comet is a lot higher.
Fact is:
T34/85 is CHEAPER although the unit has MORE HP than the P4J. Thats not justified.
Bring down the HP to the same level as the P4J and the price is justified. As long as it have more HP it needs to be more expensive.

You get ALOT more from the crom/comet difference so you should get more out of it... Like seriously use THAT as a metric the 85 is UP. comet gets more range, pen, armour, health, abilities and vet.... Compared to more health and more pen (despite what some people on the forum might cry about, 10 armour is negligible)

alternatively, the okw p4 gets the ability to bounce enemy shots for the same price of the 85. Guaranteed 1 extra shot or potentially many shots and no repairs required.

Its justified because for 40 fuel more than the tank its supposed to replace which is determined roughly balanced in the faction.

Don't compare it to the german versions. Compare it to the t34/76 because that's the direct comparison in every way including faction design.
Compared to a t34/76 the 85 isn't THAT much better Given that say 40% cost increase. It does have great pen but if yuu want to pay that much for armoured AT with that durability youll get the su85.
Using your example of before, you wouldn't even consider paying 155 fuel (cromwell x 1.4) for a cromwell that had a bit more pe, you will just get the firefly.

For a doctrinal "unit replacement" yuu need to look at relative "value" compared to the unit its supposed to replace, not the units its fighting.

Compare STOCK units against each other for relative cost efficiency the base doctrinal uniys against THEIR stock units.

(basically if faction A's "thing" is 10% more cost-effective armour and B is 10% LESS, (say 90 fuel and 110 fuel respectively, for the EXACT same tank) and that is part of their faction design then trying to balance a 100 fuel tank for EACH of them would result in different results, you would need to determine what 100 fuel can buy relative to the faction you are dealing with. Basicly for the first dude the new tank would need to be better than what they have and for faction B the 100 fuel tank would have to be worse than what they have stock. You can't balance doctrinal units against the stock units of another faction, not when it's a clear replacement anyways...

To replace the 76, in the same tier, but for an extra 40% cost the 85mm needs more than JUST extra pen. This can be accomplished by more ability and utilities OR more stats. It currently has the latter.

T-34/85 is simply more cost efficient than PzIV J.

That both t34's are more cost effevtive is in line with the faction. Same with okw and redicolous armour out of the gate.
Has any one ever used ram on the the t34 85? Its quite a bit unfitting and nearly usseles ability for such a unit. Just a lazy copy paste.

Comparing cost efficiency across factions without any context is pretty silly. If you wanted to balance unit cost around that, MG42 would have to cost at least double the price of Maxim.

That both t34's are more cost effevtive is in line with the faction. Same with okw and redicolous armour out of the gate.
Has any one ever used ram on the the t34 85? Its quite a bit unfitting and nearly usseles ability for such a unit. Just a lazy copy paste.

Ram is straight up stupid in a game which supposedly focuses on unit preservation.