[Winter Balance Update] OKW Feedback

move JP4 to Battlegroup HQ

The BG tech change is fantastic, please go with this version over the initial implementation.

The P2 cloak feels a lot better. I wouldn't hate to see an accuracy bonus for the first burst out of stealth to encourage ambush tactics. Would give OKW a better option to counter snipers.

The BG tech change is fantastic, please go with this version over the initial implementation.

+ 100000

It's actually incredible how one change solves several OKW problems at once. Pray to the CoH2 gods that they won't revert it.

Note: I post this here and in the bugs thread because I don't know if this is a real bug or it is just made like this , but I hope that it will be changed.

I don't know if this was mentioned before but the OKW trucks after ordering them to be constructed they don't take the resources until they start the actual constructing, which is frustrating because some time u may forget about them and build a unit that will take the construction resources, we don't need to babysit the trucks until they start the real construction and take the resources.
thanks for your efforts.

+ 100000

It's actually incredible how one change solves several OKW problems at once. Pray to the CoH2 gods that they won't revert it.

+10000000000000
If they revert it, it will be the biggest mistake, this change solve alot of things for OKW without breaking any thing else.
Great change.

The BG tech change is fantastic, please go with this version over the initial implementation.

The P2 cloak feels a lot better. I wouldn't hate to see an accuracy bonus for the first burst out of stealth to encourage ambush tactics. Would give OKW a better option to counter snipers.

+ 100000

It's actually incredible how one change solves several OKW problems at once. Pray to the CoH2 gods that they won't revert it.

These changes to battlegroup are god tier tbh.

They allow rushing tier 4 easier and make the MG34 come out alot quicker into the time slot it should be in allowing it to vet reasonable in the early game.

These changes to battlegroup are god tier tbh.

They allow rushing tier 4 easier and make the MG34 come out alot quicker into the time slot it should be in allowing it to vet reasonable in the early game.

I think u miss understand the changes.
The tier4 still require to fully upgrade BG so it still the same.
MG34 is the weakest mg in the game and it is already an issue for OKW because it came too late to counter blobs, also this changes fix the un diverse and predictable OKW early game.

I think u miss understand the changes.
The tier4 still require to fully upgrade BG so it still the same.
MG34 is the weakest mg in the game and it is already an issue for OKW because it came too late to counter blobs and it fix the un diverse and predictable OKW early game.

MG34 is weakest in damage only, its suppression is exceptionally good for its price, being only slightly worse then that of 42.

MG34 is weakest in damage only, its suppression is exceptionally good for its price, being only slightly worse then that of 42.

So where is the problem in the changes?
Why OKW couldn't have it earlier?.
All factions can make it alot earlier and some factions have it in the beginning of the game.
I think it is a great change for OKW and it should have been done alot earlier.

Why do you argue me?
I didn't said it comes too early.

Why do you argue me?
I didn't said it comes too early.

Sorry I thought u are the guy that I reply to him in the beginning.😅

obers even slower to get out now. not sure I'm digging that aspect of this change.

obers even slower to get out now. not sure I'm digging that aspect of this change.

Ober are slower but ober with lmgs are faster.

After trying it out a little.
I misunderstood the change. FRP is still optional and i find that good.

But making it Battlegroup upgrade mandatory for STG might be a bummer. Maybe make it medic OR btg-upgrade necessary for stg. It feels so late - but i can clearly see that the earlier mg helps alot to compensate that

edit:
overall okw feels a lot more flexible to play. thank you for that!

After trying it out a little.
I misunderstood the change. FRP is still optional and i find that good.

But making it Battlegroup upgrade mandatory for STG might be a bummer. Maybe make it medic OR btg-upgrade necessary for stg. It feels so late - but i can clearly see that the earlier mg helps alot to compensate that

edit:
overall okw feels a lot more flexible to play. thank you for that!

Timing of weapon upgrades doesn't change.
Its just availability of medics that got improved.
You're not supposed to have STGs by 2nd minute.

I really do not see why OKW should tied to truck and especially truck set up since that makes depended on map (truck route) and selected location.

The discrepancies between T1/T2 timings for HMG/PF access and T3 build are not great either.

The patch solution also seem to luck finesse.

Since the current implementation already creates "side techs" (finally the "side tech" arguments will stop) for OKW if one goes T1 I see little reason not to fully implement the change and redesign the system.

Suggestions:

1)Break the bond between trucks and tech simplify the system.
All related infantry related tech is removed from truck and moved to HQ.

Incendiary grenades/ST44/PF/HMG access now are all related to HQ.

For instance one can create a tech that unlocks I.Gren/HMG and one tech that unlocks ST44/PF

Price can be deducted from T1/T2 cost

Reasons:
Make the system simpler, makes timing not tied to map/truck location, makes timing not related to T1 or T2 choice, tech can no longer be "unlearned"

2) Equalize cost for setting up T1/T2 add a separate tech for some vehicles to better adjust timing.

Reason: consistancy, T3 prerequest tech cost.


Optional:
1) Since back teching to medic has become more accessible I do not really see why one has to even buy the medic truck to begin with. One can add a medic unlock in HQ requiring a truck to set up to unlock. One still has the option to buy medic for T1 maybe for monition.

This will also make the loss of T1 truck less severe and promote aggressive placing.

2) Add mechanized unlock in T2 the unlock the vehicles but make Puma available from start similar to Le.ig to make access to the unit easier and promote diversified builds.

Another idea would be to move all HT to T1 and Leig to T2 so that T1 is UHU/AAHT/STUKA and T2 is Leig/Luch/Puma to try and make the two options closer together in power level.

3) Make the panzer authorization unrelated to AA. There is simply no connection between the two. Then Panzer authorization can be even move to HQ so that it can no loner be unlearned by losing a T4 . It can even be split into PA I giving access to JP/Ostwind/Hetzer PA II PzIV/Panther.

By making the AA gun a separate upgrade you can allow it to attack ground, make it work similar to other AA units with toggle mode of AA and ground attack.

4) Make OStwind/Hezter available with requiring T4 to be on map either as call-in or build-able form HQ

...

The new tech system is a huge improvement, I dont see no reason why the mod team should complicate things with your suggestion.

The new tech system is a huge improvement, I dont see no reason why the mod team should complicate things with your suggestion.

The change has to do make keep the improvements but making the solution simpler. (maybe I have not done a good job of explaining it in a simple manner. You might also want to check the op of this thread:https://www.coh2.org/topic/107094/the-mysterious-ways-of-okw-tech)

It basically aims to make T1 T2 choice provide the access to weapon/HMG at the same time while make the upgrade available for units available in the same building.

The patch basically creates side tech for OKW.

Since that is the case there is little reason for T1 and T2 to work differently (one with side tech one without, one with faster HMG access one with slower).

Side techs can simply be move to HQ and the solution will have more finesse.

...

The phrasing of this is very, very confusing.
What is now the new role of trucks? Do all tech ups get added to the HQ? Where do the side techs now go? What is unlocked where and when?

From what I get though (and I am not sure I understand it correctly), this would be a huge buff to OKW while at the same time destroying a lot of the faction flavor. Trucks would be mostly optional? Or at least cheap to rebuild, since a main focus seems to be to keep tech when the structure is destroyed.

Where is the trade off then for aggressive placement? This has been part of OKW since the release, as well as the decision to either get healing or the mechanized base before your first medium. The T3 is such a strong area denial tool, loosing it because of bad placement MUST hurt (it already got decent indirect buffs ever since mortars were reworked into a support role, which made repairing it much less risky). If the tech does not get destroyed, there is actually not much reason for OKW to have strong forward bases (mostly referring to T1 and T3). T1 would likely need a price increase to balance out the fact that OKW now can have medics in the base AND a forward healing/reinforcement base as part of normal tech (plus medic crates on Sturmpios). T3 should then also not get a gun at all (bunkers not having pop cap cost is already bad enough, now this building with an actually very decent weapon would be overkill).

Ok let me give the simplest version while being as close as possible to ver 2.

Track cost cost 70/15
same as now unlock flame grenades as now.

Truck set up both T1 and T2 cost 150 manpower and 10 fuel
(same as ver 2) gives access to HMG (T2 set up slightly cheaper)

HQ now has an upgrade named "weapon upgrades" cost 50/10
half of what the cost "Battle Group Upgrade" in version 2 )
Unlocks ST44/PF regardless if one choose T1 or T2

Might require truck set up to keep the times the same with ver 2 or truck build for slightly earlier access but doubt with will make much of difference

"Battle group upgrade" for T1 now cost 50/10
(for the same total cost of as in ver 2)

"Battle group upgrade" for t2 now cost 100/45
(for the same total cost as in ver 2)

So things basically cost the same and arrive around the same as in version 2 but:
Both truck cost the same to set up
(consistency)

Hmg access at the same time regardless of t1/t2 choice
(consistency)

Weapon access is no longer tied to vehicles access allowing better fine tuning of vehicles timing with out messing with weapons timing especially of the panzerfaust.
(better tools for fine tuning the timing of OKW vehicles)

Upgrades are now more player friendly and inline with other factions being available in HQ

Is more consistent is design between T1 and T2 since in version 2 T1 has side grades and T2 does not.

Is this more clear?