[Winter Balance Update] UKF Feedback

Actually rifles at late game are more useful than the sten because they do not get destroyed while trying to close the distance.

UKF has two nondoctrinal infantry options (not counting Airlanding Officer with limit 1). Giving Heavy Sappers LMG+Enfields puts them in the same fighting role as IS. That would be so boring, I can imagine better ways to set them apart. Just listing some of them:

1. Keep SMG and AT grenade (except with AT satchel charge option). Add something like demolition charges / heavy gammon bomb / AT or AI satchel charge/ heavy AT mine (M20/Riegel).
2. Keep SMG and AT Grenade, add smoke grenade or white Phosporous and two Thompsons.
3. Keep SMG and remove AT Grenade, give them some kind of more reliable PIAT (PIAT expert combat training).
4. Keep SMG and AT grenade and add a flamer (included this as an option inspite of dissent with you).

All four options would fit a heavy engineer thematically and would grant them their own distinct combat value.

Double building and repair rate for free ?

Point here is that Vicker K is not the only issue but the armor also. Combined with target size Ro.E. entity get nearly 170 effective HP.

UKF has two nondoctrinal infantry options ...

Yes the are many option. I am simply pointing out that removing the moving penalty for heavy sapper although correct is recipe for disaster.

Heavy sapper get crazy durability while they can equip 3 weapons, including a flamer.

Point here is that Vicker K is not the only issue but the armor also. Combined with target size Ro.E. entity get nearly 170 effective HP.

And?

You're getting it at stage where tanks and indirect fire is all over the place, negating it all.

Stop acting like heavy sappers upgrade comes before AEC.

Point here is that Vicker K is not the only issue but the armor also. Combined with target size Ro.E. entity get nearly 170 effective HP.

Mate, trust me, im main UKF for 2000+ hrs by now and i can say heavy sapper flame will never stand again late game elite and tank, event if they do deal some dmg, remember that you have spent 150 muni for 3 lmg set up or 165 muni for flame +2 lmg set up, with that amount of muni, i can sort out section armed to the teeth with double Bren and medic/pyro, and get much more out of it, just stop hanging on small scrap like this already. Royal engineer and mobile assault are quite off meta by now if you ask.

And, who give a shit about armor and speed when i cane have double repair for free,

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i can say heavy sapper flame will never stand ...

I suggest you try heavy sapper as fighting unit in game.

A 210 unit being more durable than elite infantries is simply wrong any way.

I suggest you try heavy sapper as fighting unit in game.

A 210 unit being more durable than elite infantries is simply wrong any way.

stop with that, i play with sapper every day, what do you think. And also stop with cutting my post just to deflect the subject in your way. Yes, sapper can be somewhat "durable" but describe them as fighter is just delusional. i already make it clear in the rest of the post, At best they can stand again gren or volk after a DOUBLE or event TRIPLE amound of muni had been spent AFTER THE LASTET TECH OF THE FACTION, but that is pretty much end of the line with them. The fact that they can some what fight with THAT kind of investment isnt event close to broken, any unit with with such a load of muni should be able to dish out some dmg. May be sapper with 3 lmg used to be scary when they have their own version of bren, but is is long gone. Can i ask you for a replay with sapper as late game mainline fighting unit which actually have an impact on the victoy ? In case you deflect it back to me, i can provide some good replay of my own with sapper built as trolling with teammates as carrier, but outside of meme maker, what do you have ?

This sapperphobia need to go.

stop with that, i play with sapper every day, what do you think. And also stop with cutting my post just to deflect the subject in your way. Yes, sapper can be somewhat "durable" but describe them as fighter is just delusional. i already make it clear in the rest of the post, At best they can stand again gren or volk after a DOUBLE or event TRIPLE amound of muni had been spent AFTER THE LASTET TECH OF THE FACTION, but that is pretty much end of the line with them. The fact that they can some what fight with THAT kind of investment isnt event close to broken, any unit with with such a load of muni should be able to dish out some dmg. May be sapper with 3 lmg used to be scary when they have their own version of bren, but is is long gone. Can i ask you for a replay with sapper as late game mainline fighting unit which actually have an impact on the victoy ? In case you deflect it back to me, i can provide some good replay of my own with sapper built as trolling with teammates as carrier, but outside of meme maker, what do you have ?

This sapperphobia need to go.

I am not sure where this hostility comes from my point is that heavy sapper upgrade is currently badly designed, I think you agree to that.

Imo just removing the moving penalty is not going to fix but it will create other issues.

The ability provides things that it simply should not the option for 3 weapons and armor.

I am not sure where this hostility comes from my point is that heavy sapper upgrade is currently badly designed, I think you agree to that.

Imo just removing the moving penalty is not going to fix but it will create other issues.

My over reaction. Sapper is my fav unit in my fav faction and i belive i know them in my hand, so im kind of carried away.

There are two points, the fist is the heavy upgrade is not good designed, im agree on this. The secon, which im strongly againt, is that sapper is being described as some kind of cost - effective fighting unit with elite lever stat.

The ideal and proposal on this unit has already been shown, what remain is up to the team now.

My over reaction.

No problem it happens to all of us.

Sapper is my fav unit in my fav faction and i belive i know them in my hand, so im kind of carried away.

There are two points, the fist is the heavy upgrade is not good designed, im agree on this. The secon, which im strongly againt, is that sapper is being described as some kind of cost - effective fighting unit with elite lever stat.

The ideal and proposal on this unit has already been shown, what remain is up to the team now.

Maybe I was not cleat Sapper are fine. It is the sapper with the heavy upgrade in the new that imo the get unreasonable things (3 weapons slots/armor small target combination).

I do think Heavy Sappers are discussed to the fullest. There is nothing new anymore

Lets get back to mortar emplacements. The more I think about them in their new late game, the more I do know what will happen in teamgames:


1. UFK players will find a spot for 2-3 mortars with 180 Range ability + Repair station (Advanced Emplacement Regiment) from where they can shell the opponent frontline at 2 VIPs without drawing counterfire from LEIGs and mortars.

2. Axis side will notice that they can’t push it, because it is too far behind enemy lines. One hit offmaps make no sense either because of brace.

3. Axis will try to counterfire with leFH but get destroyed by Counter Battery and Precision Barrage (Advanced Emplacement Regiment) + UFK teammate abilities.

4. And lo!, the shitstorm came upon them and the glory of the emplacement dimished as it was nerfed to the ground to be never seen again in this game, because the devs were so afraid.

So please do us all a favor: Keep the cheap one mortar emplacement with upgrade for a two mortar emplacement, but put a nondoctrinal land mattress in the place of the proposed 180 range ability mortar emplacement. Thanks!

So please do us all a favor: Keep the cheap one mortar emplacement with upgrade for a two mortar emplacement, but put a nondoctrinal land mattress in the place of the proposed 180 range ability mortar emplacement. Thanks!

Im not a big fan of the new heavy barrage, too, it is nice to have, but at the same time an easy target for pressure from the community, along with a lot of other ukf change. They are just tip of the iceberg covered with bandage and can disappeared after just a couple of path with enough wining from axis players, leaving the true issues of the faction untouched (yes, it is the bolster upgrade, i will keep repeating it).

The land mattress as it is now is meh,and the commander it being in is also meh. What prevent it from being stock i wonder ? I mean, the mod team are event trying to introduce stock 120mm mortar while athe perfect candidate is left in the dust.

I suggest two stock design for LM
Fist is a late game conventional rocket platform. Put it behind anvil or hammer with the number of rocket per barrage reduce from 30 to 20, increase with vet.

Second is mid game heavy mortar alternative, put it in platoon CP, require both aec and boffor tech or company CP. Range reduce to mortar pit lv, barrage fire 8 to 10 shot with more delay between shot (still a bit faster than normal mortar and a faster cd than current), wp barrage change to quick smoke. Further in to this design can be hammer unlock barrage with more rocket, and anvil unlock wp barrage.

I do think Heavy Sappers are discussed to the fullest. There is nothing new anymore

Lets get back to mortar emplacements. The more I think about them in their new late game, the more I do know what will happen in teamgames:


1. UFK players will find a spot for 2-3 mortars with 180 Range ability + Repair station (Advanced Emplacement Regiment) from where they can shell the opponent frontline at 2 VIPs without drawing counterfire from LEIGs and mortars.

2. Axis side will notice that they can’t push it, because it is too far behind enemy lines. One hit offmaps make no sense either because of brace.

3. Axis will try to counterfire with leFH but get destroyed by Counter Battery and Precision Barrage (Advanced Emplacement Regiment) + UFK teammate abilities.

4. And lo!, the shitstorm came upon them and the glory of the emplacement dimished as it was nerfed to the ground to be never seen again in this game, because the devs were so afraid.

So please do us all a favor: Keep the cheap one mortar emplacement with upgrade for a two mortar emplacement, but put a nondoctrinal land mattress in the place of the proposed 180 range ability mortar emplacement. Thanks!

Don't forget about the Boffors being non-exclusive with the AEC. UKF Sim city might be more in vogue again I think. I really like the new Mortar Pit but I can see how it can be toxic.

After careful thought I also think the Land Matress would be a far better overall option for core UKF in my opinion, probably in tier 2. The commanders it’s included with could probably do with an off map mortar strike or artillery in its place anyway. Let’s see

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Lets get back to mortar emplacements.

The changes in emplacement are simply not enough and unless a serious overhaul in them is made the remain a collection of bandaids.

There many solution but one has to improve the design of these things. For instance once could create a separate where one could invest his resources in tech specifically for emplacements to improve them.

Im not a big fan of the new heavy barrage, too, it is nice to have, but at the same time an easy target for pressure from the community...

The biggest setback for UKF emplacements is the existence of the Advanced Emplacement Regiment and the existence of brace.

If an emplamcement is just fine, that commander pushes it slightly over the top. Brace is another story. While completely fine on emplacements near the frontline where you can force the use of brace in multiple ways to kick it when brace wears off, it is a whole different story at artillery emplacements far behind the frontlines where you usually would use offmaps to fight them. I do think you just can't balance it.

The land mattress on the other side can be balanced. Its timing and performance is easily adjustable and there is no commander who has an influence on that. I do see it at around the time the Walking Stukka shows up. Maybe just in the last building without Anvil/Hammer tech.

For Mobile Assault Regiment I do see something mobile as a doctrinal replacement. Either something like a halftrack for early mobile pressure or an Avre / a Crocodile for very late attacks on fortificated positions.

The biggest setback for UKF emplacements is the existence of the Advanced Emplacement Regiment.

So true! Trying to balance core armies without changing commanders is not really going to work properly is it?

On the Land Mattress, it is very unlikely for its position to be changed. But we'll keep an eye on the Mortar Pit and Advanced Emplacement. If the Heavy Barrage spam become real - after we bug fix it - a global cooldown on the heavy rounds could be a thing or there's more cost and risks to it.

On the Land Mattress, it is very unlikely for its position to be changed. But we'll keep an eye on the Mortar Pit and Advanced Emplacement. If the Heavy Barrage spam become real - after we bug fix it - a global cooldown on the heavy rounds could be a thing or there's more cost and risks to it.

But that is the typical UKF emplacement problem. All other commanders get punished for the existence of one commander that should have never been released. That is so frustrating and hampers balanced emplacement play so much.

I really do thing UKF desperately needs some nondoc onmap artillery / rocket artillery that can be used on targets behind enemy lines and isn't depended on one of your squads getting there into grenade throwing range (only faction without it). Thumbs up for you trying to get this done! But I'm afraid the mortar emplacement is not the right way to implement it.

Thanks for giving us feedback nonetheless!

AEC is worse in literally every way than the puma. I don't think the nerfs were not needed, but it'd be nice if it got a speed or acceleration buff to compensate, or at least got its smoke fixed. It also seems to miss a lot of shots, even while stationary, but I don't have accuracy numbers so I couldn't say for sure.

This is especially pertinent because brits have a lot less snares on the field on average than any other faction and have no other nondoctrinal light vehicles.

On the Land Mattress, it is very unlikely for its position to be changed. But we'll keep an eye on the Mortar Pit and Advanced Emplacement. If the Heavy Barrage spam become real - after we bug fix it - a global cooldown on the heavy rounds could be a thing or there's more cost and risks to it.

Speaking of the Land Mattress, any chance of it being improved? The range is so short and the accuracy is so crap for something that has to be wheeled into position. Feels like I'm wheeling a Katyusha into position when I should be wheeling in a Low-Angle Panzerwerfer.