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[Winter Balance Update] General Discussion

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12 Jan 2021, 18:25 PM
#781
avatar of Switzerland
Donator 33

Posts: 545

The exact reason the debuff while cloaked was implemented was to discourage repositioning while cloaked. I do agree that rotation should perhaps not be as heavily affected.
12 Jan 2021, 19:38 PM
#782
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2021, 17:47 PMKatitof

And 5th man.
And increased range.
i repeat cause u didn't see the () the insibility is there so they can get 1 shoot in before the guys that man the crews (the 2 guys on the gun) don't die from the tank before even taking a shoot as it lacks the range of other at gun not by much tho and their shield which is important as it gives partial green cover and the shield itself absorbs the tank projectile
12 Jan 2021, 20:19 PM
#783
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

i repeat cause u didn't see the () the insibility is there so they can get 1 shoot in before the guys that man the crews (the 2 guys on the gun) don't die from the tank before even taking a shoot

What? Rak outranges most tanks by 20. If a tank shoots your rak before it gets 1 shot off, not being camofalauged had nothing to do with it. That means you didn't spot for your AT gun...
12 Jan 2021, 20:41 PM
#784
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474


What? Rak outranges most tanks by 20. If a tank shoots your rak before it gets 1 shot off, not being camofalauged had nothing to do with it. That means you didn't spot for your AT gun...
yes but that's the offensive use, if you're using it for defensive purpose sometime ur spotter is near the at gun to protect form inf flanks

anyway i think u got my point the invs should exist only for defensive purpose not offensive and is there to make the raketen safely hit the first shot, same is the idea for the jp4 in my opinion we should rework both units vet like this

1 Unlocks the "Mobile Camouflage" ability. (speed reduced to 10-20%, rotation same)

2 +25% reload speed.
+25% penetration.

3 For first shot, fired out of camouflage:
+100000 penetration.
+50% damage or +X% reload, choose the one u think it's more balanced

4 +15% maximum speed.
+15% rotation

5 +10% reload speed or 10% acc
+5 range (to 60)


1 Unlocks the "Cautious Movement" ability.

2 +160 additional healthpoints.
+20% accuracy.

3 For first shot fired out of camouflage:
+50% damage or +X% reload, same as above
+50% accuracy.
+50% penetration.
(was vet 5)

4 +20% rotation speed.
+20% maximum speed.
+10% reload speed.

5 +15% reload speed.
+15% accuracy.
(was vet 3)

The highlighted part are what changed check the current one on the vet page
12 Jan 2021, 20:54 PM
#785
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

yes but that's the offensive use, if you're using it for defensive purpose sometime ur spotter is near the at gun to protect form inf flanks

anyway i think u got my point the invs should exist only for defensive purpose not offensive and is there to make the raketen safely hit the first shot, same is the idea for the jp4 in my opinion we should rework both units vet like this

Did you read my opinion on the previous page when I quoted you? Cause no, I don't get your point

The Rak needs a serious rework. It most certainly should not be getting buffed. No AT gun should be retreating, it's still one of the cheesiest units in the game, even without mobile camo

Give OKW is a normal AT gun is my opinion, so I don't agree at all with that suggestion. If the Rak needs retreat AND camo in order to function, then it's time to scrap that horribly designed piece of shit altogether
12 Jan 2021, 21:03 PM
#786
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

i tried 100% time to ask it to the mod team but they categorically said to me they can't, idk why

we are stuck with the raketen without a shield

i would have loved a pak 38 like with Vcoh low pen but invisibility non retreat but first shoot always pen

honestly speaking they should remove the retreat and just give it explosive resistance and 60 range like a normal at gun , it's not shield but it would work tho it would be resistant to nades and mortar too
12 Jan 2021, 21:22 PM
#787
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1


honestly speaking they should remove the retreat and just give it explosive resistance and 60 range like a normal at gun , it's not shield but it would work tho it would be resistant to nades and mortar too

I like this as well, but I don't think explosive resistance is feasible either. Before grens got the received damage modifier I suggested giving them explosive resistance with vet. I think one of the modders said that would require adjusting each individual explosive weapon
12 Jan 2021, 21:23 PM
#788
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1


What? Rak outranges most tanks by 20. If a tank shoots your rak before it gets 1 shot off, not being camofalauged had nothing to do with it. That means you didn't spot for your AT gun...

That is incorrect RW has a range 55 and most tank have a range 40 so it 15 not 20.
12 Jan 2021, 21:32 PM
#789
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2021, 21:23 PMVipper

That is incorrect RW has a range 55 and most tank have a range 40 so it 15 not 20.

Math error my bad. Doesn't change the point at all
12 Jan 2021, 21:36 PM
#790
avatar of WAAAGH2000

Posts: 732

UKF Tommy and Engineer default population maybe should reduce by 1,after NERF Tommy it 5 men squad not good as other factions elite infantry
12 Jan 2021, 21:46 PM
#791
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474


I like this as well, but I don't think explosive resistance is feasible either. Before grens got the received damage modifier I suggested giving them explosive resistance with vet. I think one of the modders said that would require adjusting each individual explosive weapon
mhhh what about : when set up raketn gets + 40% damage restiance and + 50% RA ?
12 Jan 2021, 21:47 PM
#792
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1


Math error my bad.

No problem it happens


Doesn't change the point at all

Well it sort of does. RW has sorter range than ATG and need more time to fire the first shot than other ATG. RW is simply less forgiving than other ATGs when it comes to first shot.
(clarified)
12 Jan 2021, 22:25 PM
#793
avatar of Switzerland
Donator 33

Posts: 545

Other AT guns are even less forgiving and cant retreat.
12 Jan 2021, 22:58 PM
#794
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2021, 21:47 PMVipper

Well it sort of does. RW has sorter range than ATG and need more time to fire the first shot than other ATG. RW is simply less forgiving than other ATGs when it comes to first shot.
(clarified)

I don't mean it changes nothing in general. Just nothing about my point

Stug said cloak was needed so that a tank doesn't shoot your rak before the rak shoots first. If that happens, even with 5 shorter range, that means you had nothing spotting for an AT gun

In the post you quoted and corrected, I was only speaking to that specific scenario. The Rak is plenty capable of getting one shot off before a tank does, with or without camo
12 Jan 2021, 23:00 PM
#795
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

mhhh what about : when set up raketn gets + 40% damage restiance and + 50% RA ?

I'm not good enough at math to check those numbers but I see the idea you're going for. Could work, similar spirit to the gren vet 3 changes
12 Jan 2021, 23:02 PM
#796
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

mhhh what about : when set up raketn gets + 40% damage restiance and + 50% RA ?

Then not a single med tank would be affected and they would become undecrewable by infantry as accuracy over 100% doesn't do anything.

Just keep your ATGs behind your line instead of scouting with them.
12 Jan 2021, 23:04 PM
#797
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2021, 23:02 PMKatitof
would become undecrewable by infantry as accuracy over 100% doesn't do anything.

That would be -50% RA, not +50%

Unless im mistaken hes suggesting making their target size larger in exchange for damage resistance. Just like vet 3 grens

Yes the accuracy over 100% is useless, but it's not like it was 100% before.....
12 Jan 2021, 23:07 PM
#798
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

Unless im mistaken hes suggesting making their target size larger in exchange for damage resistance.

I'm assuming that he doesn't want to make the unit much more durable at vet0 then vet3 7 man cons, but I've seen worse suggestion from axis only crowd as well.
12 Jan 2021, 23:10 PM
#799
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2021, 23:07 PMKatitof

I'm assuming that he doesn't want to make the unit much more durable at vet0 then vet3 7 man cons, but I've seen worse suggestion from axis only crowd as well.

Can you show me how you get those numbers from the percentage he gave? Legit don't know

In my head it looks like the Rak becomes super easy to hit from any range with small arms, but takes less damage
12 Jan 2021, 23:18 PM
#800
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8


Can you show me how you get those numbers from the percentage he gave? Legit don't know

In my head it looks like the Rak becomes super easy to hit from any range with small arms, but takes less damage

I'd rather wait for him to clarify.
You literally have 2 options to interpret here.
You can do the math yourself, one is silly but there is exchange, 1 is lolzworthy, I'm assuming he didn't went with latter.
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