how does okw deal with the mg and sniper?
in 4v4 the okw is the shit
Never played USF I see.
Posts: 888
how does okw deal with the mg and sniper?
in 4v4 the okw is the shit
Posts: 52
None says usf has easy time dealing with sniper, but at least they have a fast M20 (non-doc) and t0 mortar to obscure sniper's range. USF also has a fast free infantry squad (officer) that's big pressure on a sniper build.
Never played USF I see.
Posts: 149
Posts: 149
On offtopic I disagree with that
OKW is not agressive but rather evasive, they are all about ambushing with STpios and delaying the opponent, because in a 1v1 matchup volks can effectively fight only Conscripts.
OST is defensive
USF is offensive
Soviets can chose, but closer to offensive anyway
UKF is something in between
Well depending on their build, when they throw sniper after they got enouth mainline inf its hard, but by that time you can get somesort of the counters. Like JLI for excample.
If they build snipers in early game, then I find its easy in 3v3 to just suicide rush it with kubel when opportunity allows. Because even if kubel dies, you still will win in a MP bleed anyway.
Posts: 518
And an IR Halftrack for spotting.
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Honestly I wish Obers timing could be on first building built, and MG/STG unlock upon Panzer HQ built. I still think they come a bit late, and when they do, they have to fight for their lives against vetted mainline infantry because they come so late.
I wish something could be done to help Volks be less squishy during the late game. One thing I suggested is having a doctrine similar to Soviet airborne where instead of SVT's, you can drop G43's for your infantry.
Posts: 783
Vet5 STG volks are good for late game, they can stand more or less ground vs vetted uped inf somewhat, problem is all their power comes from vet and if you lose vetted volks there is pretty much no replacement aside from obersts\doc inf, since its already takes almost full game to vet them up.
Other mainline inf at least have powerfull upgrades (like 7 men cons) or weapons upgrades to make even un-vetted new squad somewhat usefull.
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Posts: 5279
For combat stats only, volks with max veterency get
-24% recieved accuracy
+30% weapon accuracy
-20% weapon cooldown
For comparison rifles get
-38% recieved accuracy
+30% accuracy
-20% weapon cooldown
Ostruppen get
-28.5% recieved accuracy
+40% accuracy
-20% weapon cooldown
Conscripts get
-37.3% recieved accuracy
+50% accuracy
-20% weapon cooldown
The only mainline infantry that gets worse combat bonuses is the infantry sections who get less recieved accuracy reduction and less accuracy-but make up for it by having the lowest stock recieved accuracy of any mainline in the game by a fair margin.
My point is that volks vet really isn't that good. The passive healing is great and imo it wouldn't hurt to put it back to vet 3 but other then that, they just don't scale as well as pretty much any other mainline.
I am not saying they should be buffed, but they are definitely on the weak end of mainlines.
Posts: 149
Would be a bit OP if you ask me, considering they perform somewhat like vet3 grens strate of the bat and being able to have them rather quickly if you go for med HQ.
Its more like Schwerer HQ could have been cheaper to build, while cost difference transfered to its upgrade. In this case you would be able to just afford them ealier, without changing how faction works. But I agree, that by the time obersts arive its pretty much pointless to use them without LMG, which is a shame.
Vet5 STG volks are good for late game, they can stand more or less ground vs vetted uped inf somewhat, problem is all their power comes from vet and if you lose vetted volks there is pretty much no replacement aside from obersts\doc inf, since its already takes almost full game to vet them up.
Other mainline inf at least have powerful upgrades (like 7 men cons) or weapons upgrades to make even un-vetted new squad somewhat usefull.
Posts: 38
the allied MGs that come at minute zero are both garbage at suppression
so you can pretty much just walk up to them and flamenade so there's your counter.
Posts: 1289
People keep saying that, but that's not what I'm seeing. They may be not be the best MGs in the game, but they still do a very decent job, especially in the early game when there isn't yellow cover everywhere. They are definitely _not_ "garbage".
That is most definitely not the case.
Posts: 177
Posts: 3053
People keep saying that, but that's not what I'm seeing. They may be not be the best MGs in the game, but they still do a very decent job, especially in the early game when there isn't yellow cover everywhere. They are definitely _not_ "garbage".
That is most definitely not the case.
Posts: 38
You do have the biggest chance vs the maxim and the vickers to frontaly nade them. Its is no true in every engagement, but it does happen iften enough.
Posts: 38
Use two squads and spread them out slightly and you can frontally nade them every time. I do it all the time. Vickers and maxim aren't mg42 or 34 in terms of suppression, it's very doable even in the early game.
Posts: 3053
The area of suppression isn't that small even for the Maxim. Also, the MG controller can manually change targets. So you would have to spread out the assaulting squads fairly wide, and at this point it's flanking. And if we're talking about flanking, the MG 34/42 with their slow gun traverse can be countered just as easily.
Also, if the attacking side has two squads, so should the defending side. What if the defending side has two MGs? Or one MG and one inf squad shooting at one of the out-of-cover and moving attacking squads?
It's all not as easy and one-sided as you make it seem.
Posts: 38
Like 10-15m spread is easily enough to not trigger group suppression.
The vickers and maxim literally have like the exact same traverse but with worse suppression so yeah.
I'm not making a balance statement, it's just a fact that it's pretty easy to frontally nade the vickers and maxim
I'm just saying that flamenades are an adequate counter to the two min0 allied MGs because their suppression is not enough to keep them from being flamenaded.
Posts: 143
Posts: 1289
In that case the MG operator can easily manually switch targets. Also, per my last post, if the attacker has two squads, so should the defender. Only that would be a robust basis for a scenario.
True. All I'm saying is that this worse suppression is still good enough to suppress frontally charging squads, especially in the early game when there still is lots of neutral cover.
I haven't seen a lot of this fact in action (at least not in the early game, when OKW doesn't have any other counter).
I doubt the validity of this assertion, but I am open to evidence.
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