Congratulations balance team

1-
The reason was that you couldn't win *out* of cover, that was the core issue, now that you can and will conisistently roll over enemy units while being in the open coupled with the ability for autowins when in cover (exaggeration but I'd say a good solid 70% of engagements if done properly will end in your favor due to reasons said before, mainly cost efficiency though.)
You gambled your chips on UC carrying your early game and AEC to shut down LVH or straight up skipping it into at guns to win the game with a cromwell, which wasnt effective at all.

As a sidenote, there is cash games having been played, not even in a single of those have I seen brits lose yet, which solidifies the meta as 5 IS because it will give you so much presence in the early game and the ability to push off your opponent with no problems whatsoever in terms of bleed, not that you need 5 IS, you'll do still better regardless.

2-
Easier, way so, but UKF has always been braindead and easy. so nothing really new.

3-
If you blob he outblobs you, if you spread out and try to cap the map with indvidual squads (which you *have* to do) then you lose on a one to one basis, sure you *could* go sniper, but you lose momentum still have to contend with an potenial UC an army thats larger then yours and a whole lot of lost momentum that's going to make you want to push aggressivly with the sniper to the point where it most likely ends up being caught up eventually because you absolutetly have to make up for the lost momentum.

4-
They have the best tech. (okw the worst because the forced light vehicles they pretty much have to go.)
-I could agree with this as a solution but i think they'd still be way to strong, they need to make them less of a unit that forces off everything by merely getting behind cover.


Dunno how replies work so whatever.

They get self spotting at vet 1

Self spotting is not a thing for infantry. All infantry is self spotting. The standard sight range is 35 and the max range for small arms is 35 too.

Why the hell would you want to, on 1v1, match UKF IS 1on1 with Grens when you can open up with sniper?

You can’t go early sniper vs UKF since they now have countersnipe.

It has been argued that Ostheer are simply loosing to superior player.

Is the link to the whole game? Because from what I see in the clip that axis team seem to have an advantage but without the rest of the game it is difficult to tell.

https://m.twitch.tv/videos/590431590

Near the end on Eindhoven.

Self spotting is not a thing for infantry. All infantry is self spotting. The standard sight range is 35 and the max range for small arms is 35 too.

He means the vet 1 sight bonus in cover. He talked about it during his stream. Section behind sandbag on right fuel on rachnaya spotted a grenadier capping the nearby strategic point.

The foaming at the mouth from stormjager or incrounds is really crazy to me,.

Solid arguments, but I think I’ll take top players like miragefla, seeking, fire and terror and orangepest agreeing with me over a guy who has never touched high level games.

Solid arguments, but I think I’ll take top players like miragefla, seeking, fire and terror and orangepest agreeing with me over a guy who has never touched high level games.

Don't want to be rude but top players are the likes of Noggano, Luvnest, Asten, Scotch, Isildur etc.

To be honest it seems more like a certain group of people is trying to completely blow the UKF buffs out of proportion because they don't play the faction and want it nerfed.

It's just BS that a 0.05 RA buff and a moving accuracy buff make a weak faction into some sort of unbeatable monster.

Let's not forget before the last IS nerfs IS had 0.8 RA without out of cover penalty and more DPS. Then they got their DPS and RA out of cover nerfed which made the complete faction useless. Now they gave them 0.85 base RA with 0.05 boost in cover to 0.8 and left the DPS nerfed.

UKF is hated so much by certain people in this community that whenever they become playable and as good as Soviets and USF they need to immediately get nerfed to the ground. Meanwhile Soviets rule almost every tournament I can remember watching and that's somehow fine.

Also ridiculous that people complain about IS blobs when Riflemen + other USF infantry do this basically every game since release. Same as OKW. Double standards are real.

To be honest it seems more like a certain group of people is trying to completely blow the UKF buffs out of proportion because they don't play the faction and want it nerfed.

Ah yes, if you don’t have an argument try to disqualify those you disagree with. Classic.


As for top players, ask Noggano and Luvnest what they think about Brits.

It's just BS that a 0.05 RA buff and a moving accuracy buff make a weak faction into some sort of unbeatable monster.

Lets take a short moment to remember how small increase of USF rifle DPS at range they already beat all their intended targets was deemed as "rifles most OP ever, nothing but rifles will ever be used from this day onward" and a month leater, rifles magically became balanced on their own.

Situation that has been presented would happen in exact same way pre-patch as well.

Ah yes, if you don’t have an argument try to disqualify those you disagree with. Classic.


As for top players, ask Noggano and Luvnest what they think about Brits.

The only one with out argument is you. I have presented a lot of arguments as you can see. Such as stats, link to VODs etc.

If UKF are considered super OP by all these people (proof where?) then why didnt they bother giving the balance team feedback during the months of testing? It's always the same, people dont help with playing the mod then cry about when a patch hits live.

The only one with out argument is you. I have presented a lot of arguments as you can see. Such as stats, link to VODs etc.

If UKF are considered super OP by all these people (proof where?) then why didnt they bother giving the balance team feedback during the months of testing? It's always the same, people dont help with playing the mod then cry about when a patch hits live.

Repeating “Brits were not OP last 2v2 tourney” every time you post is not an argument, people have told you already that it might be due to unfamiliarity or players not fully utilizing sections spam or just an issue that’s more prevalent in 1v1.

As for the “proof where” I gave you a VOD as well, you might as well have a look at Noggano vs Asha and how hopeless the crossroads game was.

https://m.twitch.tv/videos/590431590

Near the end on Eindhoven.

thanks its about 3:30.

Thing is, the reinforcement cost is in line with bolster, which they are expected to have 100% of the games.
Also there is one, maybe two axis squads who do NOT have that mp reduction, so I don't think single units across 3 allied factions having it due to sniper vulnerability is any problem.

Source: "Trust me bro, I could save a replay, but I was too busy crying"
Also, at your rank, it could be 5 combat engineers and result would be the same for you.

Ooh, ooh, you hurt my feelings. Ooh, muh rank sucks. Reeeeeeeee.

...Relax, was just saying the IS buff really caught me at how effective they are.

Don't mind it. Brits have been needing a boost for awhile. Hardly saw them in 1v1 games, now I will.

You can’t go early sniper vs UKF since they now have countersnipe.

How is it an argument?

The only one with out argument is you. I have presented a lot of arguments as you can see. Such as stats, link to VODs etc.

If UKF are considered super OP by all these people (proof where?) then why didnt they bother giving the balance team feedback during the months of testing? It's always the same, people dont help with playing the mod then cry about when a patch hits live.

i think orangepest said smth about vonasten and jove agreeing to him or so, but need to check out his stream search for it, and skip of all the rant (which i think is justified)

The problem as orangepest put it, is that you win in the open and you win in cover, as long as your not facing a very bad engagement you just win. Sure there are some maps (like elst) where there is a lot of medium cover and medium range engagements where you can get the drop on the brit if played correctly, but on other open maps your just screwed.

And ofc if you play absolutly flawless like a god you will win, but 5-6 IS bleed less mp then 5 cons which is a joke IMO

Hmmm.....does explain the last 4v4 game I had which was Tommy blob for 40 minutes on my side of the map. Literally no skill and brute force frontal charge against 2+ MGs, grabbing the VP and throwing a Coordinated Barrage. Took a Pzwerfer from my teammate, the blob not even trying to dodge, and double (one stolen bren)LMG obers to properly shut it down for good. Would hate to see what good players would have done using such a force.

That said, I did shut down his (later) sextons with aggressive Panther play.... Laughs in Radio Silence

Thing is, the reinforcement cost is in line with bolster, which they are expected to have 100% of the games.

That is incorrect.
The reinforcement cost of IS is 28 if it was designed for 5 it should 27.
And here are the patch notes:
General TBF Balance Tuning
Infantry Sections
We are addressing the heavy attrition costs that infantry sections have.

Reinforcement cost reduced by 10% (28 per model)

Also there is one, maybe two axis squads who do NOT have that mp reduction, so I don't think single units across 3 allied factions having it due to sniper vulnerability is any problem.

That is incorrect also there not only one allied squads with a reinforcement cost reduction but plenty.

Source: "Trust me bro, I could save a replay, but I was too busy crying"
Also, at your rank, it could be 5 combat engineers and result would be the same for you.

No comment.

He means the vet 1 sight bonus in cover. He talked about it during his stream. Section behind sandbag on right fuel on rachnaya spotted a grenadier capping the nearby strategic point.

I know what he means but that is not self spotting. Self spotting is the ability of certain units to see (almost) as far as their own weapon range so that they do not need other units to spot for them in order to fire from max range. For example the Command Panther and the Puma both with 50 weapon and 50 sight range, or a Pathfinders recrewed M2HB with 45 weapon range and 50 sight range.

Infantry Sections can not self spot by definition because the maximum range on any of their weapons is 35 which is the same as the standard sight range.


Being able to see further is not self spotting and does not give an as significant advantage. I don't want to start a semantics discussion here but self spotting is a clearly defined and powerful trait and it's important keep that separated from this discussion and stop randomly attributing things to Infantry Sections that aren't true.

They can see quite a bit further at vet 1 when in cover (45) which helps with reconnaissance and which helps to spot for HMGs and ATGs and other vehicles and that is quite powerful. They have it because they are tied to cover more than other mainline infantry and generally can't be as far forwards. Perhaps it can be toned down now. But it's not self spotting and a top player like Orangepest should know the difference.

I know what he means but that is not self spotting. Self spotting is the ability of certain units to see (almost) as far as their own weapon range so that they do not need other units to spot for them in order to fire from max range. For example the Command Panther and the Puma both with 50 weapon and 50 sight range, or a Pathfinders recrewed M2HB with 45 weapon range and 50 sight range.

Infantry Sections can not self spot by definition because the maximum range on any of their weapons is 35 which is the same as the standard sight range.


Being able to see further is not self spotting and does not give an as significant advantage.

every Standard infantry can self spot in your regard, and i dont think we should argue semantics here.

And ye spotting mgs before they set up or seeing what force is coming and getting more troops there, or spotting for TDs is (not) a significant advantage, i wont even start that you can see every flank a mile away and can reposition, Becouse for some reason the small sandbags give cover in every direction while the russian ones dont

While in Teamgames this doesnt matter that much, in 1vs1 engagements this means that you dont get suprised by an mg while sitting in yellow cover or know that you have to soft retreat into green cover etc. This is actually a big deal since you can force good trades, while the opponent might instantly drop a model while spotting you in green cover and planning his further apporach.

This just emphasises like orangepest said, that infantry sections trade very good in a 1vs1 basis with inf sqads while also being able to be blobbed up like seeking did. Combined with bren carrier for the early game, aec and cheap tech this results in overperformance

You can’t go early sniper vs UKF since they now have countersnipe.


Solid arguments, but I think I’ll take top players like miragefla, seeking, fire and terror and orangepest agreeing with me over a guy who has never touched high level games.

complete rubbish, trash even.

Can't go sniper because your UKF opponent can build a sniper? then surely that is countering his build. You're forcing him to buy a Brit sniper and early engineers, because with 5 IS he will have no snares.

We also have ashablios top 1 in all factions complaining IS were too weak with 0.90 RA last patch. Surely his and others that said IS were crap carry weight? Or are Asian players ignored because they don't partake in the english community as much.

ye spotting mgs before they set up or seeing what force is coming and getting more troops there

How are you going to accomplish that, when extra sight works only in cover, when you're stationary?
You can't attack and defend with the same unit at the same time and lets be honest, even biggest pros do not advance taking pauses in cover.

Also, ost pios do that without having to sit in cover.

How are you going to accomplish that, when extra sight works only in cover, when you're stationary?
You can't attack and defend with the same unit at the same time and lets be honest, even biggest pros do not advance taking pauses in cover.

Also, ost pios do that without having to sit in cover.

brits stay in cover on vital points all the time, so do conscripts its one of their main assets, pls dont tell me how to play the game

Why everyone is just comparing the costs ? It is literally hypocracy to say MGs are natural counters to blobs and "this clip" is fine.

In the clip they dont even have weapon upgrades and straight up frontrally engage MGs, which is not fun.