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Raketens are too good

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24 Feb 2020, 19:12 PM
#1
avatar of IncendiaryRounds:)

Posts: 1527

Permanently Banned
In 1v1, you're basically not allowed to use stock mediums against OKW. Its already difficult to use stock mediums vs OKW P4, however, the raketens have the RoF of the USF at gun and basically the penetration of a pak (only 10 less) and now have almost the same range with an extra crewman and retreat. There's little u can do to counter a raketen. I'd say it's at least as survivable as the Zis now. I think a slight pen nerf is in order
24 Feb 2020, 19:15 PM
#2
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

I don't like that it can still retreat but that would maybe be too drastic a nerf. Rate of fire OR penetration like you said is probably a good idea
24 Feb 2020, 19:22 PM
#3
avatar of IncendiaryRounds:)

Posts: 1527

Permanently Banned
I just think SOMETHING has to give.

The rak is still the only at gun that can overextend for a kill without as much punishment since there's a retreat button and the 55 range actually makes it easier for it to overextend.
24 Feb 2020, 19:24 PM
#4
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 2358

Make it 4 man, leave retreat as it is.

Volk escorts could use a little small arm fire buff too.
24 Feb 2020, 19:32 PM
#5
avatar of A table

Posts: 249

Never thought i would live to see the thread ''Raketens are too good''
24 Feb 2020, 19:38 PM
#6
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

remove retreat make them ,3 men like v coh , remove vet fixed
24 Feb 2020, 19:42 PM
#7
avatar of blvckdream

Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1

Reload times

Raketenwerfer

Vet 0: 3.8-4.3
Vet 5: 1.93 - 2.18

M1 AT-gun

Vet 0: 2.1-2.4
Vet 3: 1.61 -1.84
24 Feb 2020, 19:47 PM
#8
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

Its already difficult to use stock mediums vs OKW P4


HUH??????

SU85????

DOUBLE ZIS3???

FREE T70 RECON????

T34/76 RAM????
24 Feb 2020, 20:03 PM
#9
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 3029 | Subs: 3

you should be allowed to suppress raketens again
24 Feb 2020, 20:09 PM
#10
avatar of Support Sapper

Posts: 1220 | Subs: 1



HUH??????

SU85????

DOUBLE ZIS3???

FREE T70 RECON????

T34/76 RAM????


He say "stock medium" meaning using cromwell, Sherman, t34/76 against okwt4.
24 Feb 2020, 20:10 PM
#11
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

you should be allowed to suppress raketens again


+1
24 Feb 2020, 20:18 PM
#12
avatar of blvckdream

Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1

Sander already explained that removing suppression from Raketenwerfer was not a nerf.
24 Feb 2020, 20:23 PM
#13
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 3029 | Subs: 3

Sander already explained that removing suppression from Raketenwerfer was not a nerf.


not a durability nerf but a combat nerf. The combat penalties from being suppressed are very high
24 Feb 2020, 20:23 PM
#14
avatar of Mazianni

Posts: 785

Raketen is mostly fine as is IMO. You could reduce it back to 4 men but then people would complain about it being wiped all the time again.

And yeah, if you allow it to be suppressed then it will mostly just take longer for MGs to kill without massively impacting it's combat ability.
24 Feb 2020, 20:24 PM
#15
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

Sander already explained that removing suppression from Raketenwerfer was not a nerf.


If my tank is backing up with engine damage I would like to stop the rak in its tracks, not hope that I can do enough damage to kill it fast enough. It depends on the situation
24 Feb 2020, 20:34 PM
#16
avatar of Doomlord52

Posts: 960

The only way this unit will ever be 'fixed' is by making it more like a normal ATG. Right now, it simply has so many 'gimmicky' trade-offs that its going to be annoying to use (or play against) in one situation or another.

+Available in T0
+5 models
+Can cloak at vet 1
+Can retreat
-All 5 models 'blob' together for easy wipes, especially in cover
-5 less range than any other ATG
-Gun shield doesn't give cover (supposedly? might be bugged)
-Need to manually toggle cloak, cloak locks the unit in place
-Very inconsistent performance on bumpy ground (i.e. craters)
24 Feb 2020, 23:06 PM
#17
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 2358

The only way this unit will ever be 'fixed' is by making it more like a normal ATG. Right now, it simply has so many 'gimmicky' trade-offs that its going to be annoying to use (or play against) in one situation or another.

Agreed. But:

+Available in T0

If changed, add pfaust to volks after sws is bought.

+5 models

Make it 4 as the rest of axis TW

+Can cloak at vet 1

Removing cloak after it being nerfed is simply killing the unit, one should consider buff its mobility if so.

+Can retreat

This made the raketen unique and worthy of stealing. Remove this and cloack and simply just remove the raketen aswell

-All 5 models 'blob' together for easy wipes, especially in cover
-5 less range than any other ATG
-Gun shield doesn't give cover (supposedly? might be bugged)
-Need to manually toggle cloak, cloak locks the unit in place
-Very inconsistent performance on bumpy ground (i.e. craters)

This are the defects of the model and buggy behaviour. Sadly they cant be fixed directly.
Maybe if raketen projectile performs a ballistic trajectory it could remove some of the ground collisions.

Lets be clear now, Im not against your points, im just adding my opinion to continue the discussion.
25 Feb 2020, 00:49 AM
#18
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

Yes it is too good and too cheap. Make it more expensive so okw cannot spam it.
Comes too early and negate LV plays.
25 Feb 2020, 02:46 AM
#19
avatar of SuperHansFan

Posts: 833

It should have the highest pen of all AT guns, because historically it could pen anything the allies had iirc. It's the only latewar AT gun after all.

Vaz
25 Feb 2020, 05:05 AM
#20
avatar of Vaz

Posts: 1158

you can smoke it with a sherman
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