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Two-Step PGren Upgrade

27 Nov 2019, 00:39 AM
#21
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

Give Pioneers 50muni single shrek upgrade and you’re good to go.
27 Nov 2019, 00:40 AM
#22
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1

Give Pioneers 50muni single shrek upgrade and you’re good to go.

Hilarious
27 Nov 2019, 01:03 AM
#23
avatar of thekingsown10

Posts: 232

I like this idea as well but there should be an option later game to remove them and replace with shreks for a cost.
27 Nov 2019, 01:12 AM
#24
avatar of KiwiBirb

Posts: 789

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2019, 00:37 AMVipper
AT rifles similar to PTRS will hardly work against thing like the T-70, the Quad the AA HT.

Actually PTRS are rather bad vs light due to high aim time and it will be even worse on expensive unit with no snares.


It’s for UC, M3 and m20, all of which Ost can’t counter unless the allied player is brain dead and gets snared
27 Nov 2019, 01:52 AM
#25
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

I like this idea as well but there should be an option later game to remove them and replace with shreks for a cost.


That's a key part of the proposal.
27 Nov 2019, 01:52 AM
#26
avatar of Felinewolfie

Posts: 868 | Subs: 5

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Nov 2019, 13:25 PMLago
Ostheer's got no light tank. That's part of its design, and means it needs to field infantry counters to light vehicles.

The best one it has against lights is Panzershreck PGrens, but these are 100 munitions. If you're on the back foot, that can be a problem.

If I recall correctly, Relic's previous solution to this was to make the Panzerschreck upgrade two parts: you'd buy one Panzershreck for half the cost, then you'd buy the next. This created an inevitable problem of one-Panzershreck PGren blobs, so they got bundled together.

But that ability to buy lesser AT for less munitions and fully upgrade later was a neat feature that could be worth bringing back.

  • What if PGrens could get two Panzerbusche AT rifles (they're in the campaign) for 50 munitions? They're much less effective than shrecks, but they do the job on the cheap.

The PGrens could then upgrade those AT rifles to Panzerschrecks for another 50 munitions.


Bazookas are 60 muni.
PzShreks used to be 60/ea. 120 for 2. So Relic discounted those 20% further to 100 for 2.

... Could always make them 60 muni for 1 again. Pay 60 for 1. Pay 60 for 2nd one.
27 Nov 2019, 09:57 AM
#27
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1



It’s for UC, M3 and m20, all of which Ost can’t counter unless the allied player is brain dead and gets snared

The same applies, AT rifles like PTRS start firing too slow. PG with 2 PTRS and no snare would be burned to crisp by clown can with flamers and pinned by UC with Vicker.

Actually Ostheer should have access to a redesigned 221 that would be cheaper and have lower DPS vs infatry but higher penetration so that it would act as soft counter to those micro lights.

The added benefit would be that 222 could become more expensive and tougher becoming better vs lights.
27 Nov 2019, 14:33 PM
#28
avatar of Unit G17

Posts: 498

What about making Schrecks and Büchses different upgrade paths? The latter would cost 60 muni, grant a pair of AT rifles and give some sort of mini target weak point ability, like temporarily slowing down the target vehicle. This would make this upgrade path viable even in late game.
27 Nov 2019, 14:47 PM
#29
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2019, 09:57 AMVipper

The same applies, AT rifles like PTRS start firing too slow. PG with 2 PTRS and no snare would be burned to crisp by clown can with flamers and pinned by UC with Vicker.

Actually Ostheer should have access to a redesigned 221 that would be cheaper and have lower DPS vs infatry but higher penetration so that it would act as soft counter to those micro lights.

The added benefit would be that 222 could become more expensive and tougher becoming better vs lights.


So you want an MG34 to be better vs vehicles than a 20mm autocannon firing PzGr 39 Armour Piercing and PzGr 40 Composite rigid armour piercing rounds?

Top kek
27 Nov 2019, 15:02 PM
#30
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1



So you want an MG34 to be better vs vehicles than a 20mm autocannon firing PzGr 39 Armour Piercing and PzGr 40 Composite rigid armour piercing rounds?

Top kek

Read understand respond.

221 would be a soft counter to car.
222 would be a soft counter to light tank
27 Nov 2019, 15:38 PM
#31
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2019, 09:57 AMVipper
Actually Ostheer should have access to a redesigned 221 that would be cheaper and have lower DPS vs infatry but higher penetration so that it would act as soft counter to those micro lights.


Isn't the 221 currently 220 MP 15 FU?

You can't really go much cheaper than that.
27 Nov 2019, 16:02 PM
#32
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2019, 15:38 PMLago


Isn't the 221 currently 220 MP 15 FU?

You can't really go much cheaper than that.

That is without the tech cost and for OKW.

One can easily go cheaper than that if it a soft counter to WC51/M3/UC (and sniper) which are generally cheaper.

It depend on what tech requirements the unit would have for Ostheer but 15 FU is too high.
27 Nov 2019, 16:48 PM
#33
avatar of Widerstreit

Posts: 1392

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Nov 2019, 16:51 PMLago


I suppose you could do that. That approach has the benefit of being on a very cheap squad, but the drawback that you're then stuck with an AT rifle squad after AT rifles become ineffective.


I still would like Panzerbüchse 39 on Ostheer Pios instead of PanzGrens. With the option also to upgrade mine-sweepers and maybe an extra ability they would become very potentail.

50mun for 2 Panzerbüchsen (locking flamethrower-upgrade, option to upgrade mine-sweeper) adding e.g. "fast-fire ability" = 30% faster reload for the PnzBüchse for 30sec, 15mun.

27 Nov 2019, 16:49 PM
#34
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

There is only one solution

27 Nov 2019, 17:13 PM
#35
avatar of Sir Edgelord

Posts: 127


FYI, The Wehrmacht faction ingame represents the early-to-mid war Eastern front German army: https://steamcdn-a.akamaihd.net/steam/apps/231430/extras/UKF_Blog_Infographic_FactionProfile_Revised.png?t=1574777616

I meant the Multiplayer version.
There could be no STGs, no Americans, no ISU-152 and stuff, if it was "early-to-mid war".
27 Nov 2019, 17:53 PM
#36
avatar of KiwiBirb

Posts: 789

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2019, 09:57 AMVipper

The same applies, AT rifles like PTRS start firing too slow. PG with 2 PTRS and no snare would be burned to crisp by clown can with flamers and pinned by UC with Vicker.

Actually Ostheer should have access to a redesigned 221 that would be cheaper and have lower DPS vs infatry but higher penetration so that it would act as soft counter to those micro lights.

The added benefit would be that 222 could become more expensive and tougher becoming better vs lights.


Yeah, this would probably be a better solution. I’d also like to point out that this would require a nerf to the flame HT as flame HT + AT light vehicle has often proved op.

A return of the munition cost of getting a 222 would further delay the AT + flame HT cancer
27 Nov 2019, 18:03 PM
#37
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3



Yeah, this would probably be a better solution. I’d also like to point out that this would require a nerf to the flame HT as flame HT + AT light vehicle has often proved op.

A return of the munition cost of getting a 222 would further delay the AT + flame HT cancer


True, that damn OP af Ostheer T2, gotta nerf it!
27 Nov 2019, 18:22 PM
#38
avatar of CODGUY

Posts: 888

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Nov 2019, 13:25 PMLago
Ostheer's got no light tank. That's part of its design, and means it needs to field infantry counters to light vehicles.

The best one it has against lights is Panzershreck PGrens, but these are 100 munitions. If you're on the back foot, that can be a problem.

If I recall correctly, Relic's previous solution to this was to make the Panzerschreck upgrade two parts: you'd buy one Panzershreck for half the cost, then you'd buy the next. This created an inevitable problem of one-Panzershreck PGren blobs, so they got bundled together.

But that ability to buy lesser AT for less munitions and fully upgrade later was a neat feature that could be worth bringing back.

  • What if PGrens could get two Panzerbusche AT rifles (they're in the campaign) for 50 munitions? They're much less effective than shrecks, but they do the job on the cheap.

The PGrens could then upgrade those AT rifles to Panzerschrecks for another 50 munitions.


Poor OST doesn't have a light vehicle. It just means they rush a medium faster than everyone else and have more AT abilites than any other faction. Not really seeing the problem here?
28 Nov 2019, 12:34 PM
#39
avatar of Bananenheld

Posts: 1593 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2019, 18:22 PMCODGUY


Poor OST doesn't have a light vehicle. It just means they rush a medium faster than everyone else and have more AT abilites than any other faction. Not really seeing the problem here?

Aaw thanks for the explanation. I never knew ostheer has the fastest medium rush.
28 Nov 2019, 12:58 PM
#40
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3


Aaw thanks for the explanation. I never knew ostheer has the fastest medium rush.


He’s rank 2100 Ostheer, don’t mess with him. He’s the Ost guru.
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