Jagdtiger is horrible

I really like how in these imaginary scenarios there's always a single, unsupported JT agains multiple allied vehicles, abilities, combined arms etc.

use fast flanking group of armor and deny any DMG from the heavy tankdestoyer... a wolfs pack from 3-5 Easy8 with combine arms make fish foot from any front defense.

1. M4A3E8 isn't in a doctrine with the combined arms ability, and if they are being used in a wide flank they wont be near any infantry in order to acquire the bonus anyway.

2. If someone actually manages to pull off a proper flank like that in this clustergarden of a game, particularly with medium tanks, and they aren't immediately raped by mines or snare infantry then by all rights they deserve to win.

id like to see JT get a flare ability, similar to 17p and remove the barrage ability.

What I didn't mention in the OP but find very annoying about the JT is that it can't even reliably kill two Allied TDs from the front. A pair of vet 1 Jacksons always beat it even if you just let them sit AFK in front of the JT. With the SU85 it is more RNG because they don't have 300+ penetration but still often not in favour of the JT.

Well maybe that's why JT outranges them. If you're within Jackson range you're using it just as wrong as people who put jacksons in panther range.

Yea the problem is multiple things such as OST Ele in a OP commander, game mode and constant baby sitting in small game modes. In 3 v 3 and 4 v 4 JT is pretty tough to beat!

Well maybe that's why JT outranges them. If you're within Jackson range you're using it just as wrong as people who put jacksons in panther range.

That's ridiculous. The JT is slow and the range difference is just 10. How are you going to always keep it between 61-70 range against WAY faster vehicles.

That's ridiculous. The JT is slow and the range difference is just 10. How are you going to always keep it between 61-70 range against WAY faster vehicles.

By supporting it. That's how. Raks are cheap. Volks are cheap. Mines are cheap. You are paying for long range and no chance to bounce not the ability to go afk. Just because you paid a lot doesn't mean you can stop playing and still win

By supporting it. That's how. Raks are cheap. Volks are cheap. Mines are cheap. You are paying for long range and no chance to bounce not the ability to go afk. Just because you paid a lot doesn't mean you can stop playing and still win

Exactly, the doctrine even has a perfect tool you need to support the JT: Pfusis have flare for spotting, and a pair of shrecks to keep TDs away
If you can't be bothered to micro your JT or to support it properly then yes, it will go down to a pair of
vetted M36's with HVAP on. They also cost more so there's that.

id like to see JT get a flare ability, similar to 17p and remove the barrage ability.

The JT comes in a doctrine with Panzerfussiliers, which already have flares.

By supporting it. That's how. Raks are cheap. Volks are cheap. Mines are cheap. You are paying for long range and no chance to bounce not the ability to go afk. Just because you paid a lot doesn't mean you can stop playing and still win

Sure, because you pay 270 fuel for a heavy TD and then sink more MP and pop cap into Raketenwerfer just to support your heavy TD from getting frontally raped by Jacksons on HVAP

Sure, because you pay 270 fuel for a heavy TD and then sink more MP and pop cap into Raketenwerfer just to support your heavy TD from getting frontally raped by Jacksons on HVAP

260 fuel and I dont think there's any tank you should be able to buy that suddenly allows you to ignore the importance of combined arms and planting mines

2 Jacksons is 30 more fuel btw, and it has no AI ability unlike the JagD. You also had no problem making the Jacksons spend extra muni on HVAP

Sure, because you pay 270 fuel for a heavy TD and then sink more MP and pop cap into Raketenwerfer just to support your heavy TD from getting frontally raped by Jacksons on HVAP

Yea. That's how the game works. Now that you have figured that out I reckon you will have a much easier time. JT Is the most powerful AT unit in the game, outnumbered and unsupported it WILL die. That's how the game works. If you don't want to support it then suffer. Don't whine the balance is bad because you can't walk away from the game and win.

I really like how in these imaginary scenarios there's always a single, unsupported JT agains multiple allied vehicles, abilities, combined arms etc.

To be honest, people complaining about its performance and vulnerability, use it exactly that way.

id like to see JT get a flare ability, similar to 17p and remove the barrage ability.

Ummm.... panzerfusiliers? You know, the doctrinal infantry in that very doctrine with access to flares.

Yea. That's how the game works. Now that you have figured that out I reckon you will have a much easier time. JT Is the most powerful AT unit in the game, outnumbered and unsupported it WILL die. That's how the game works. If you don't want to support it then suffer. Don't whine the balance is bad because you can't walk away from the game and win.

Reading comprehension is literally 0/10. Please quote where I said I want to call-in a JT and go afk and win.

I also never claimed I want to let my JT unsupported either.

I guess it's pointless to argue about units that are only viable in 3v3 and 4v4 with players that only play these game modes because they don't understand 1v1 and 2v2 exists too. That's why I said I am talking about 2v2 btw, just to avoid 4 digit rank 4v4 players from feeling the need to educate on how good the JT is. But fine keep the JT as it is and enjoy Tiger gameplay every game.

/Thread

That's why I said I am talking about 2v2 btw, just to avoid 4 digit rank 4v4 players from feeling the need to educate on how good the JT is. But fine keep the JT as it is and enjoy Tiger gameplay every game.

I only agree its unusable in 1v1, idk why you think its unusable in 2v2. Dominates on a map like Rails

I only agree its unusable in 1v1, idk why you think its unusable in 2v2. Dominates on a map like Rails

Can you please learn to read? I never said it's unusable in 2v2. There are situations where calling in a JT can be ok but in 95% of games it's not worth it. If you think that makes the unit balanced, then ok. Up to you.

Regarding the dominance of JTs that you claim: I can not remember having seen even ONE dominating JT since the big heavy TD nerf (mainly 300 damage per shot reduction). And that is in hundreds of 2v2s that I played around rank 50-150. Not one. Elefant and ISU dominate many 2v2s and are used frequently.

Unless you want to meme you will always go for Tiger or even KT over JT. A combination of KT/Tiger+JP4+Stuka works well in late-game 2v2 meanwhile JT+P4+Stuka doesn't. As Ost you can use the Brummbär as an AI tank and keep the Ele behind it to protect it but OKW P4 can't fulfil that role.

Jagdtiger have two using scenarios from 2v2 to 4v4
First one: single JT with some vetted infantry and some unvetted fresh replacement, since stalling for JT was hard and you lost a lot during it. Your JT is screwed by those who already prepared for it's coming, you maybe hold the line and kill 1/2 mediums with it, (nah, actually you will zone em from ur nerfed range and they will team up on other flank)
but end is always the same: you will lose or you win been carried by teammate.
Second scenario: you are well prepared to secure your super heavy. You have plenty of everything to cover it, literally played by the books.
JT does not fit into the popcap or when you think a little more you understand that KT will be a better choice literally always. 21(or 23?) popcap superheavy which has very long cooldown, ability to zone enemy armor (being meh at chasing it at the same time), extra vulnerable to flanks, underperforming vet1 ability.
So the problem is that there is just no reason to get it. There is more better choices against everything what OKW stands against in teammgames.

Regarding the dominance of JTs that you claim: I can not remember having seen even ONE dominating JT since the big heavy TD nerf (mainly 300 damage per shot reduction). And that is in hundreds of 2v2s that I played around rank 50-150. Not one. Elefant and ISU dominate many 2v2s and are used frequently.

And what is it that makes the elefant so much better? That doesn't make any sense, Sander asked you the same question on the previous page with regards to your dual jackson scenario. JagD has more armor so it should only do better than elefant in your test scenario

I would argue its the commander it comes on that is so much better, not the unit. Both elefant options are great imo

And what is it that makes the elefant so much better? That doesn't make any sense, Sander asked you the same question on the previous page with regards to your dual jackson scenario. JagD has more armor so it should only do better than elefant in your test scenario

- 222 and/or spotting scopes for recon
- Brummbär as a partner for AI
- better mobility in combat (where it actually matters)
- bigger gun traverse and faster tracking
- being able to shoot on the move

- 222 and/or spotting scopes for recon
- Brummbär as a partner for AI
- better mobility in combat (where it actually matters)
- bigger gun traverse and faster tracking
- being able to shoot on the move

1 and 2 have nothing to do with the unit, like I said the ele cmdrs are better

Agreed on other 3, except maybe #4, I thought recent patch buffed tracking to be the same?

Its a trade-off though, Jagd has more armor and health, and a solid AI ability