Profile of braciszek

There is no identical option to old button. The PaK40 is a fragile anti-tank gun, it having a stun makes sense. A anti-light vehicle unit that can also be upgraded to preform against infantry shouldn't have an ability that can instantly shut down any tank in the game.

The Krupp steel meme is even more pointless today, since the only common MBT is the Panther, and despite it's high cost people throw a shitfit when it's counter is 2 AT guns.

60 range. Such a small distance. It has to be at the front line in order to be of an use. Therefore, it must have the ability to seal the death of a tank. The AT superiority of the Pak isnt the 10 extra pen over the Zis. Its the fact its shooting at an average of much softer armor than on its own side! It also has panzerschreck support, and it is at least better than absolutely nothing.

There are many things that shouldnt be today, but the game sure does not center on what you believe should or should not be. Why shouldnt a crappy AT unit scale into the game? Cons got jealous and want to cry with someone else? PTRS is of no use after 10 minutes (and that is why it rarely exists today as it has no use after that) Again, it doesnt matter what should or should not be; i posted for no reason too many times already in this thread, and look how far this thread had gotten (stops at mirgefla's post and vanishes from there).

And LMG's from long range infantry counter AT guns as well as other things (and then we argue all over the place until we get to tanks) "and then panther counters tanks" (then we go to B4 IS-2 and P47 and then OKW stuff and then onto other crap)

Lets finally agree to disagree and resign from ruining this thread.

No, but a good player could shut down a Ostheer player who didn't go elefant's rather quickly because the roaming band of guards could deal with enemy infantry AND make it so your tanks could surround and kill his tanks.

Old Button meant with a minimal amount of micro, as in moving your AT guns and TD's into range, you could button an opponents tank and kill it fairly fast unless it had a largish health pool like a Tiger.

The Ostheer AT gun can't sight for itself, and the stun takes a minimum of 4 seconds before firing because the AT gun needs to reload before firing the stun shot. The Ostheer AT gun is also fragile and can literally not do anything to enemy infantry, while guards with old button could. And the fact that you kept the enemy armor support fleeing meant your own tanks could roam the field with supremacy.



Until WFA came out I had ~30 games as Ostheer, almost all of my pre-WFA hundreds of hours were Soviets. I abused the old button so hard I was accused of hacking multiple times lol.

And even a Guards blob cant simply walk around and destroy all infantry and tanks like it was nothing. They are no obersoldaten, meaning you could suppress them if you had an Mg42 behind cover/inside a building. And the things have a range, and last i checked, tanks drive faster than Guards dance. In the past, the panzerwerfer was actually a thing that fired on the clock and made sure such things never existed in actual tactical play.

Again, such a blob is hundreds of munitions, and buttoning and being avoided by a proper player meant you were sinking way too many munitions into nothing. Price apparently does justify performance, so there is no problem in this.

As for times before WFA, there were the various tides of OP soviets and OP Ost, in which people playing Ost was always much higher, meaning the noobs always played whatever made them win, so it was not surprising to see such noobs whine their ass off once something actually stopped the Moscow drive of their Krupp Steel.

Counter play to stun shot is "Don't drive your tanks into AT guns". The Ostheer AT gun is fragile, and if a tank gets around it it's instantly dead due to the small crew size.

Stun shot isn't OP, it's just a good vet ability and it's good compared to the now total garbage button.

Le sigh.

"Counter play for old button was 'Dont drive your tanks into guards". Guards are 6 men infantry squads that can be suppressed, ran over, smoked, and grenaded, invalidating their use due to it being an infantry squad trying to do its job.

Button wasnt OP. It was just an expensive and effective ability to take out superior Krupp Steel panzers that took forever to kill"

Shall we dig this hole deeper?

Button used to totally lock down a tank and made it stupid easy to kill with AT weaponry.

Sounds extremely familiar with something that is predominant in a large mass...

And button is definitely much crappier than a stun. Blitzing, smoking, waddling out of range, and shooting/causing the Guards to move an inch invalidated the button ability, which wasnt that cheap, especially when you needed to buy the weapon with munitions as well (100+ munitions to stall a tank until forced to cancel compared to a handful of munitions for an AT gun to shoot a sure shotted stun shell in which the tank cant do anything for a few seconds...)

It was all Guards were good for. The only use as to have them be rarer than Su-76's after the nerf... Ive seen Guards used less than a dozen times since that patch.

Mark target used to be even more powerful (as to be the prime option for negating the buff Old TA had). Button and Mark Target were seen as the assymmetry for superior Axis tanks. Having tanks that need to require a lot of force to take down also meant that the enemy can pull something out of their sleeve to even the odds.

And the post before this is a real suggestion to convince someone why to choose Guards.

Being able to hit and kill units in cover would be a pretty big boon for guards, and would make them have a definite roll besides "being shit".

If i wanted to kill units in cover, i would use much cheaper and efficient stock options/choose a commander with units/options that do it 5x better... So id rather have the option to throw it on the ground and bury it forever.

Guards are the infantry version of the su-76. Soft counters dont fit Relic's "soviet faction is a faction of hard counters" description...