@ Sherlock
Those are some interesting findings. I had no idea about all those other bugs. Its clear the recon commander was slapped together at the last moment before WFA release and promptly forgotten about.
I disagree with you suggestion about airdropped combat. They are really only useful if they have atleast vet1 that late in the game. It makes sense to right - I think the idea is kinda that these are vet troops jumping in behind the lines in force. At least that's the way I see it.
I agree with you in terms of the fact that veterancy should always be EARNED, however since there are already several other abilities/callins(elite troops, ostruppen reserve, elite rifleman, vet PIV etc) that grant vetted units there's no sense in limiting one ability for a value that has already been compromised. I'm not saying your wrong, just that practically the Relic will not make that change. I'm suggesting things that I hope will actually be put in the game. |
This list is not an exhaustive change log suggestion for the next patch. Merely a suggestion for changes I would like to see within USF - mainly aimed at improving lackluster commander abilities in the already limited USF commander lineup. I expect these changes to be paired with various buffs and nerfs for other factions. I have made some of these suggestions since the Alpha for WFA - namely #1. Change comes slow with Relic but I hope you will agree these would be positive changes.
USF List of Changes
1. Elite Vehicle Crews (USF armored commander) 2 CP/90MU PER CREW. This ability grants vehicle crews 4x Thompsons for 90MU. This is almost completely useless. I think relic’s idea here was that if you manage to bail a crew out you can send them back into the fray with Thompsons. First, I would never blow 90 MU on a fragile as hell squad for CQC fighting with smgs with no grenades, second it’s entirely duplicate since this is commander already has excellent CQC infantry in the form of combat engineers. This ability is expensive and virtually useless. Needs to be overhauled.
Simple suggestion: Make elite vehicle crew a passive ability that grants your vehicle crews a 50% chance of bailing out of a vehicle once that vehicle is destroyed. Whereby you could start cultivating some veteran crews that could ultimately be manning lvl 2-3 tanks late in the game. Exceptions to this would be M20 and Ambulance – since neither of these are manned by typical vehicle crews.
2. Forward Observers (USF Recon Commander) 1CP passive ability granted to rifleman. I’m still not 100% the exact stats on this ability. I think it increases rifleman vision by 5-10% while they are garrisoned/in cover. Great so you can see like +3 range? It is not even noticeable.
Simple suggestion: It should be a base vision increase of +10. Especially considering this only applies while the unit is in cover/garrisoned. Perhaps add a timer to this so that it would take 5 sec or so while in cover/garrison before the bonus kicks in.
3. Air Dropped Combat Group (USF Recon Commander) 7 CP 900MP. Drops two paratrooper squads with random weapons. These paratroopers do not have any of the combat abilities associated with airborne company paratroopers but have light AT mines instead. Also drops unmanned AT gun. Ok there’s a lot going on here. The biggest issue is dropping an unmanned AT gun. Dropping an unmanned weapon behind enemy lines is just ludicrous. And why do these paratroopers have to be different from the others? I mean what’s the point of the light AT mines that late in the game??
Simple Suggestion: Lower MP to 700. Drop two paratrooper squads with a random amount of experience, they will be just like the airborne commander paratrooper and can upgrade weapons. They do not have light AT mines.
4. WC51 Truck (USF Mechanized Commander) 0CP 240MP/20FU. This is a fairly effective unit but I still think it just a tiny tad underpowered mainly because it dies quite easily to gunfire from frontal shots – especially when considering its high fuel cost for a scout car.
Simple suggestion: Increase HP from 180 to 200.
5. M3 Halftrack (USF Mechanized Commander) 3 CP 520MP/35 FU. Given the cost and timing this halftrack is surprisingly incredibly weak. In fact its stats are on par or less than nearly all scout cars and definitely all half-tracks. One other part of this is that I find that the CE deployed are somewhat irrelevant at this timing – demo is nice sometimes but on the whole a single CE squad is a tad lackluster.
Simple suggestion: Increase frontal armor from 5.4 to 11 and increase HP from 200 to 240 or possibly even 320. Also, considering that it currently doesn't have an upgrade why not allow it to upgrade armor plates similar M8/M20, which would further increase armor/HP.
Dream suggestion: Deploys with cavalry rifleman instead of combat engineer. I mean come on those guys were awesome in the campaign! And they would fit well in this commander.
6. 75mm Pak Howitzer. Here’s a unit that under the right circumstance can be pretty handy. However, its base cost of 480 MP is FAR too high. The barrage function is also rather lackluster. There is also a bug with the reinforce cost that doubles the reinforce cost of the unit manning the weapon – so if a RE squad re-crews the weapon reinforce cost will be 40MP, when it should only cost 20.
Simple suggestion: decrease MP cost from 480 to 380. Increase barrage shells from 3 to 4. Fix reinforce cost bug.
7. +25% received accuracy penalty for weapon crews. Now I understand that all weapon crews have this de-buff. The problem is just that it hits the USF hardest for several reasons. – First USF weapon teams arrive much later than their counterparts due to tech structure so they have no chance to get any bet before the heavy stuff hits the field. Axis tend to have better long range DPS so it is fairly simple for them to de-crew USF weapon team (soviets don’t have this problem as bad because their teams are 6 men).
Simple Suggestion(s): Remove the +25% received accuracy penalty from USF weapon teams OR Add a 5th man to the weapon team OR reduce it by 15% at the very least.
8. M9 Bazooka. This weapon is pretty lackluster. Against certain tanks (namely PIV) and in enough numbers it can be effective. However, in most cases they are just a waste of MU. For one thing the neither have enough accuracy nor do enough damage to effectively counter fast light vehicles – Luchs in particular. They also do not have enough penetration/damage to really threaten heavy tanks.
Simple suggestion(s): Increase damage to 120 OR reduce MU cost to 50.
Thanks for reading!
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This is partially a balance discussion partially just a game design. I think OKW and USF need some pretty big tweaks. They are both quite different from the whermact/soviet in what I think is a bad way. I think its possible that a lot of the balance issues we are seeing can be traced back to the tech speed and availability of the WFA and vanilla factions and how they mix poorly or all too well in some cases. This certainly isn’t a complete suggested changelog (please let’s not talk about Jagdtiger/ISU152/B4 or the host of other broken units…)
OKW
OKW is argued to be the “best designed faction”. In a way that may be true, but I think their early game design just doesn’t really fit in with the other factions. I know, I KNOW – Asymmetrical balance. I know that different factions are different, but there has to be some continuity. Besides, the changes I’m suggesting would fall more in line with the faction’s ‘eliteness.
- MG34 swapped with Kubel wagon. Defensive tactics and Luftwaffe ground forces can now deploy kubel - instead of MG34 and MG34 takes the place of Kubel at OKW HQ.
- Changes to MG34 – Increase cost to 240, lower its dps but increase its suppression. Basically I’d - like it if it suppressed one burst slower than MG42 but had somewhat more DPS.
- Sturmpioneers now can now be equipped with Panzerschrek.
- Volksgrenadier and Panzerfusiler swap slots. Panzerfusiler now available from OKW HQ,volksgrenadier is now a CP0 call-in for breakthrough commander. They now have a passive panzerfaust, but no longer can upgrade to panzershcreck. Cost reduced to 220mp.
Volksgrenadiers should exist for the OKW – as a doctrinal spammable unit, similar to ostruppen. Panzerfusilers fit in much better with OKW’s primarily elite design. Panzerfusilers as I understand it were basically the recon units of panzer regiments – so it would make sense for them to be the core, starting infantry, of an elite vehicle oriented faction. It also grants OKW a light AT snare. The switch for sturms to upgrade to panzerschreck balances the panzerschreck out – it does not change its early availably, but it is now equipped on a more expensive and slightly more vulnerable (4 man) squad so it wouldn’t be as spammable.
USF
For a faction that’s supposed to be based on adaptability and combined arms it sure is strange that the starting options are so limited for USF. By granting the USF 50 fuel at start they could immediately begin teching a LT. Or wait a bit and then start building captain. This would do so much to open up the USF early game. While it would grant access to powerful units like stuart/AA halftrack/M20 I nerfed their build times – either you’d have to get a captain to negate the long build times or just wait. To keep things a bit balanced the officers would no longer be deployed with special weapons – this also opens up the options for what units they can pick up. I also increased the tech cost for major to offset the increased early game fuel.
- Now starts with 50 fuel.
- Captain structure cost reduced to 70FU from 80.
- Major increased from 90 to 120 FU.
- Captain and LT are no longer deployed with weapons. As a result the cost of the units are both - - reduced to 280 (for subsequent call-ins if they are killed).
- M20 building increased from 45 to 70s.
- AA halftrack build time increased from 60 to 90 seconds.
- M5 ‘Stuart’ build time increased from 50 to 90 seconds.
- Cooldown for WC51(mechanized commander) would be doubled (I think it’s 30s now, so 60s after this - change) – to avoid spam now that there is more starting fuel for USF.
Clearly these changes would adversely affect soviet/whermact. On the one hand their teching is a bit more costly, but usually opens up more options than OKW/USF. I’m simply suggesting a slight decrease in teching cost for both factions. This may not be the proper answer, but it’s the best I’ve got for now.
Wehrmacht
Battlephase tech all require 10 less fuel for each battlephase.
Soviet
All base structures cost 10 less fuel.
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Mmmh. I think most people get confused about how the M10 works. You need to use them in groups, hopefully with an M4 nearby. And be extremely aggresive - roll up point blank behind whatever armor you're trying to take out. You have to be opprotunisitc. Don't roll in while the schreck horde is A-moving across the map and don't go "tank hunting" when you know there's pleanty of AT pointed at out. Not saying it's easy, but it's effective when done right.
I use M10s pretty regularly and find them to be very effective against certain types of Axis armor - I'd much rather have M10s over M36s when fighting Jagdtigers/Elephants, It's very easy to roll in 2-3 M10s to Jagds flank and wipe it out. M10 is also really useful for going deep behind the lines and taking out pesky walking stukas.
When fighting KT/Tiger I prefer Jackson, with range and speed it's usually pretty effective vs those.
Where the problem really arises is when dealing with panther. It's too hardy for either either M10 or M36 to deal with and it's too fast for either one to flank it.
The changes I would like to see.
M10
- Scatter reduced from 7.5 to 6.5
- Vision increased from 35 to 50
- CP reduced from 7 to 6
M36
- Increased penetration from 160/180/200 to 200/220/240
- Increase cost to 135 or 140FU to compensate for penetration buff.
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I think the real question we should all be asking.
Why does the Jagdtiger TWO shot every US vehicle from 85 range through any type of shot blocker, including and not limited to an ENTIRE FREAKING FACTORY.
Vs mine, you use OKW uber mine detector.
Vs Jagdtiger you surround it with rifleman, damage engine (after 2-3 at nades bounce off and a lucky hit gets through), call in artillery barrage, attack the flank with jackson till it dies, throw more AT grenades at it (all of which bounce off), throw another tank at it (which then also dies), and finally your teammate shows up with ISU152 and destroys it.
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Its a weird unit. Honestly, I've seen it wipe 3-4 blobbed up squads. Other times it barely hits anything - like some people have already stated.
The only real issue I have with it is that is so dang hard to kill. It moves fast, has 320HP, and is well armored against small arms. If an enemy unit looks at a Katy the katy goes boom. Priest is slow and easy to hunt down. I haven't seen a p-werfer in an age so I don't know lol.
Oh the other thing. Why the flip does it have a creeping barrage as default lol? This was probably the single most inaccurate artillery system every designed. There was litterally 0 control over where the rockets went. Just strap the rockets onto a wooden frame at a set angle and point in the general direction of the front line. Such a joke that it can fire from each side of the vehicle and the rockets end up in a straight line. LOL |
You all think $40 is a lot for AA? Well it is. It's basically a single player DLC campaign. However good it is, and it probably will be good, fact is that it's just a campaign. Most people these days blow through the first 2 missions and get bored and start playing multiplayer.
Relic understands this. They also understand how online game sales work these days. With Steam and Green Man Gaming in death grips to figure out how to sell people games at a fraction of its market price Relic may have been feeling the pinch.
So Relic got one step ahead of everyone this time. First, Release the game mid November at $40. Second, that happens to to be almost exactly one month till the steam winter sale - when it will inevitably go on sale. Boom. Instead of marketing at $20 add-on that sells for $10 bucks, now sells for $20 on sale. On top of that, they are going to net a few morons who actually will buy this at $40.
You're welcome. |
I hate the walking stuka. It's supposed to be "anti-blob right?".. but it insta wipes any sort of weapon team, or MG in a building, or fighting position. Once a walking stuka comes out USA simply cannot have a defensive position anymore.
When it comes to 3v3/4v4 you BETTER have a couple soviets on your team to spam katyusha. Otherwise you'll just be pummeled to death by rocket artillery.
Whats even more frustrating is that USA doesn't have any kind of reliable anti-emplacement on the level of rocket artillery. |
changing them to CP0 is a step in the right direction but they need more.
IMO they are probably the least cost-effective infantry in the game. Sure they have "decent" long range firepower but it doesn't scale well.
The biggest issue is they have no abilities, neither combat nor defensive. If they could reinforce from the beacons that could also be another help.
Even beacons are of questionable value. I mean USF already has Ambulence, which you certainly build build anyway. I can see a few, rare, situations where be beacons would help keep your paras in the fight, but chances are they'll be fighting with the rest of your infantry so they will probably just retreat to ambulence to get healed as well.
Basically, I'm just saying that pathfinders need to do "more". Not pressing for any one thing. Just some abilities, or the ability to reinforce from beacons. Having them at CP0 would be nice too. |
hmm. deleting the temp rec seems to work for me. i played three 1v1s and five 2v2s without a DC so far. i advice anyone who voted "yes" to try the same. maybe it works for you too
if it does crash again, ill make use of that email address. thanks again, ipkai
Where is this temp rec file you deleted? |