Profile of JohanSchwarz

So your arguement is about personal preference you do not then deny the fact the german faction has better AT.

How do you define better AT? Because they have better raw dps numbers on a spreadsheet? Last I recall this game really isn't all about that.

Fyi at parts cost 250 mp and have a small chance to get a single shrek or a better chance ro get two ptrs. You brought them up i am doing an infantry at comparison. So point being even if i get a lucky roll and dont get ptrs AND i spend the muni for mark target i would still do 40% less damage then german at infantry.

AT partisans come out of unoccupied houses and cost no munitions. Panzergrenadiers cost 110 more manpower, come out of your base, and have to upgrade to shreks with 120 munitions. Why is this comparison even being made? They are completely different units with completely different situations of use.

Also i am glad you decided to bring up burst vs sustained dps. Yes a mark can hurt in surprise by a whole dedicated at force. Bur this is why german armor tends to have higher armor and hps for their relative class.

Last I recall T34s and P4s have the same HP, just the latter has more armor. I don't believe the P4 has enough frontal armor to block a Zis shot but correct me if I'm wrong.

Mark target will instantly cause a tank to have to retreat for the entire duration of the effect unless it wants to get lit the fuck up. Even just by taking it out of the fight for a while and not destroying it immediately allows you to have an advantage over the enemy assuming equivalent starting forces.

I am also glad you brought up target weakpoint as being bugged cahse guess what? So is self repair! Not being abke to cancel it because a pio is attacking you is good times for all!

Learn to position. That is not even close to the same level of "bugged." One involves a need to retreat a bit further, which isn't even a problem considering most Soviet vehicles are very fast, and the other is a non-functioning ability. I have never had a problem with getting caught on self-repair and I wouldn't have even noticed it was "bugged" until I read it in a thread a week or two back.

I am also glad you explained vehicle combat dynamics to me because i was very confused....since losing vehicles is more painful then i am sure you agree having higher hps facing at most equal at and at worst inferior at then having higher hps smoke and blitz is an exponential advantage in the armor game.

If you're going to assume the Germans have smoke, then I'm going to assume that the Soviets have Mark Target. Now refer back to what I said above about Mark Target being useful despite a tank initially getting away and the basic T3 tanks having the same HP.

Also i would like to point out your whole arguement about soviets even having equal at is centered around a single ability that isnt in every doctrine. Me i personally prefer doctrines with shocks...

Soviet play is highly concentrated around picking the right doctrine for the job and using it to gain the advantage by specializing your arsenal. They are not a generalist jack-of-all-trades faction like the Germans. That's just the core faction design of the game and it's not going to change. If you auto-pick shocks at CP1 and decide to use those every game then it's your fault, not mine nor the game's.

@JHeartless: Fine, we will save Guards for the other topic.

I'm not saying its hard to get to vet1, all I'm saying is that it takes longer for Germans to get the ability than Soviets and it costs around the same to use. So basically you're just trading the initial 60 munitions for earlier availability, and there is nothing wrong with that. Also, the stun ability in the current patch is broken as it no longer tracks the target, but I assume that will be fixed.

Partisans cost how much compared to Pgrens? Why are you even making that comparison? You realize Germans have to pick between flame halftrack and panzershreks, right? These are not cheap upgrades, not to mention the Pgrens lose 50% of their AI capabilities. If they're able to spam shrek squads, you've clearly been outplayed.

DPS is not the end all argument, especially for AT combat in this game. It's all about the burst damage in the initial volley when using Mark Target. 2 Zis + Mark Target will one shot a Panzer and that is infinitely more useful than any "AT DPS" the Germans can come up with. If you're taking sustained fire from a Pak40 with the faster Russian tanks, you probably got caught. The Pak43 is a good choice but also easily countered with artillery.

Mechanics for vehicle combat also work differently than infantry combat. Generally, you lose resources for damage taken to infantry as it costs manpower to reinforce. However, you don't lose resources for damage taken to vehicles - you just lose time in the form of repairs. There is no direct loss to your bottom line. Therefore, a vehicle kill is worth so much more than dealing however much damage to a tank but letting it get away in the end, especially when Soviets also have potential to access auto-repair (also in several doctrines) in which case 30 munitions is their only loss, even if their tank took 99% damage.

I'd much rather have higher burst potential than higher dmg over time for AT.

Wow, people honestly think Guards are bad.

I give up.

German AT is stronger if you compare it with Soviets' AT in a vaccum and individually, but Soviets have much more stronger combined arms options. Button + Mark Target + anything with a decent cannon = good night to anything short of a Tiger, and none of that requires veterancy. The Guards Motor doctrine is a very commonly picked one for a reason. Think about larger games where more than one Mark Target may be available; how can AT ever be a problem then? (Note: Mark Target will make even a Tiger Ace cry and that has 2xhp of a regular Tiger, so think about how much it affects regular Panzer IV's)

Sure, 40 munitions per button seems like a lot, but keep in mind Soviets save on munitions easier than Germans, with no upgrades on basic infantry and light vehicles, and no muni cost for healing station. If the munitions being saved is put to good use killing enemy panzers, I don't see why this is necessarily a "disadvantage." Also, cheaper mines.

The only exception to the above conditions is the Elite Troops doctrine which can give veterancy, alleviating the need for vet1 to stun, and also pop smoke, countering buttoning. Other than this clearly broken doctrine, Germans have a lot fewer "OP" combos than Soviets, especially as the number of players increase.

TL;DR: Elite Troops OP. Germans not so much.

I don't think Germans would be so hard pressed if their Pak guns weren't so vulnerable, as they are quite good at killing enemy armor when they don't miss every other shot.

The problem is everything in the Soviet arsenal is good at killing Paks - Shocks, snipers, precision mortars, Zis barrage, Katyushas, you name it. Those things are also all good at killing everything that can protect a Pak and everything that can substitute a Pak.

This problem gets exponentially worse as the game mode gets bigger, so while might not feel like a big issue in 1v1, it is quite easy to feel it in 2v2+. Germans are only winning in team games due to broken Tiger Ace and Opel Blitz spam.

I think we need to do some sort of challenge: play Germans without using Elite doctrine in all game modes and see how many games you can win.

And inb4 accusations of neo-nazism, I play both sides.