You can always change the officer's build time, that what the modding did, nerfing it at max so USF had the later powerspike possible, not even being a powerspike anymore.
The USF tech revamp was a buff to the faction allowing easier access to support weapon and not nerf as you are trying to present it.
rifle/gren matchup was ok until for some reason sandbags have been given as stock to everyone except USF. If the Oshteer player has some not-too-bad APM skills, he'll simply spam sandbag everywhere.
There a huge difference between playing vs someone not using sandbag and someone using it even if both player are bad at everything else.
We commonly say mines win game, but sandbags more than often also win game on the long run.
USF where completely dominating Ostheer as for sandbags USF have tank traps.
As for "spam sandbag everywhere" ostheer pioneers are one of busiest units and it far easier for Soviet/UKF/OKW and even USF to spam tank traps than for Ostheer to spam sandbag. |
Rangers have 26.5 DPS at 20 range where Obers have 28.4 . But you are not factoring in that the rangers have to move in to that range where Obers rip your guts out and can always answer you with a Blendkörper. Rangers suck at what they do due to absolutely 0 utility and not having amazing durability and smoke like shocks do.
Glad to see that acknowledge that the post in questions was false.
On the other hand, Rangers are fine and Obers are fine.
Now if in your opinion infatry could walk up to Obers and dislodge, feel free to explain what would be the reason to even build them in the first place.
But this thread you started is about riflemen and not Rangers or Obers so I suggest we stick to the topic of this thread. |
Where did these numbers come from?
That is per sqaud not per weapon.
Comparing a weapon that one entity of squad has with a weapon 3 entities of squad have is rather misleading to begin with.
Based off serelia the LMG does 12 DPS at 20 range while the Thompson do 5.8 DPS. At VET3 LMG does 20 while the Thompson do 7.7. There damage is good if they had a way to close in.
The original claim that "ober LMG long range DPS is the same as ranger tommies close range DPS" since each Thompson has around 113% more DPS at range 10 than Lmg34 has at range 35.
Thompson ranges and Paras have good DPS even from MID range (15-20)
Still that in not really related to riflemen which are the topic of this thread. If one thinks that obers are OP or Rangers are UP one should probably start a thread about. |
While I agree that volks are useless late game. Truth be told, they do scale poorly.... but then again, OKW does have obers. And 280 MP 120 Muni vet3 rifles will maybe take down one vet2 LMG ober in longer ranges, while the obers on average will kill 2-3 models.
Hence why scotts are popular vs them. I mean, they have around 1/2 of the target size with veterancy. Good luck hitting that with BARs on anything beyond point blank. Not to mention that ober LMG long range DPS is the same as ranger tommies close range DPS. Sure, obers get one LMG, but rangers need to close in.
If volks scaled well late, then obers would need a price buff and a big performance nerf.
Only Thompson (tommy gun) Rangers have good DPS even at MID range.
They have around 93% DPS of LMG obers at range 20 and up to 138% higher DPS closer.
But is that is not really related to Riflemen. |
Pretty much, yeah.
As a person that plays USF competitively exclusively, I can tell you that you do not want to fight long range with rifles. Not even medium range.
Against OKW you preferably need luck with the model drops against the sturmpio, otherwise, the sturmpio will dominate the echelon and you'll have a spio + volk + kubel vs rifle + rifle; which will lose hard.
Against OST, you want to force the pio away as early as possible. While pios are squishy, they do have a lot of firepower close range. I've provided proof that pios can charge, over neutral cover, to green cover REs and win the engagement easily. First fight is pio vs RE with rifles coming and an MG42 most likely; and pios just have to charge. REs can be in the perfect green cover, pios will still win if they charge over anything BUT red cover. REs would have to spend muni to win this.
And you definitely don't want to go medium/long range vs OST. Rifles don't have enough DPS to contest the MG42 behind the perfect green cover. Hence why USF needs to be played extremely aggressively.
Biggest problem is that the USF mortar is downright sh*t. It's basically a smoke dispenser. You might get a few lucky hits on clumped up squads, but in terms of bleed/dmg, it's just a population hog. It's better to try and play around and wait for pak howi than to go for a mortar.
That's from a 3v3 perspective, where MG42s can lock down a sector easily and spios can be close to a kubel whilst not losing any capping (as the ally is capping other points). Since 3v3 is basically a 1v1 on "lanes", a lot of the OST/OKW weaknesses disappear in a heartbeat.
Balance team knew it, but they still decided to nerf rifles close range power, whilst not buffing rear echelons. But hey, then Sander wouldn't have an easy time in 3v3s, spamming his favourite fussies. Or Sturmpanther in arranged team 4v4s....
This yet is another false post about Riflemen having their close DPS nerfed.
It time to ask the question is this habit of complaining about things that are false (and bushing the MOD team about them) intentional or accidental? |
I actually tried this strategy on ladder yesterday in 2s and it was actually pretty good.
Finally someone who tried instead of theory crafting.
That being said, the space you gain isn't exactly game winning, and it locks in your doctrine. It's pretty similar to kubel pushing while sturms close. I don't think it's unbeatable, and comes with its downside of instantly selecting a commander.
That is less of an issue since in 3vs3 and 4vs4 since both rore commanders are are quite good for those modes.
It also be used with 4 different commanders (2 rore/SMG IS/ Raid section).
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Yes it make sense that M8 should have similar detection radius as the M20.
Personally I would rather see the unit be upgrade to the m20 available to mechanized but that is another story. |
So in your opinion, the combine of UC and RRo.e are broken or not ? You said they are not game breaking before so are you going against your own word now ?
PLS stop trying to derail this thread with your word games.
I have not posted a single post saying that this tactic is "game breaking".
Thanks. |
Ost is designed to be a defensive faction and they have access to 0Cp aggressive call in infantry (so dose UKF).
And they do not have a transport and it would be broken if they had.
Okw is designed to be an aggressive fation and their mainline infantry can immediately dig in with sandbags.
And they do not have access to HMG because it would broken if they had
USF is designed to be an aggressive fation and doctrine ability allow them to dig in as well.
And they do nto have access to HMG becuase it would be broken if they had
Thus, saying OKW having early game superiority is not an issue while UKF having the same (with doctrine) is an issue because "faction is designed to be like so" is nonsense. Those two are either issue, or none of them is.
Nope your conclusion is completely wrong different faction play differently and a something that perfectly fine in one faction can be broken in another.
That is why Cav riflemen are CP 1 and IS are CP 0 although the two units have similar stats.
If you wish to debate the matter any further I suggest you start another thread though. |
cooldown infantry universally got nerfed for one and only one reason: assault grenadiers, which would let you get 3 squads absurdly fast
...
That is simply false and off topic. If the problem was limited to assault grenadier the CD penalty would also only be limited to them. |
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