Are we really going to compare SU-76 barrage to stuka barrage?
SU-76 is weaker ZiS-3 on threads. I don't know what all the fuss is about here.
The SU-76 IS a ZiS gun on treads, it has the same pen and a similar barrage. |
Instead of being a tier 4 requirement, what of T1 & T2 to upgrade to the quad? T3 can still be built with T1 OR T2 but if you want that amazing quad... But regardless I do like the damage nerf but keep the suppression considering Cons need support with fighting veteran OKW and MG42 Grenadiers.
The damage deffo needs to be reduced, it can easily kill light vehicles in seconds even further negating OKW Mech play and makes the 222 essentially irrelevant. Also all small arms fire give main gun destroyed crits which makes the Quad mount even more deadly. |
I disagree with most of these actually. The pak howie is pretty RNG dependent but it performs well as long as you keep it in firing range and don't idle it behind your lines like a mortar all game. The .50 cal is a beast now (although 280 mp might be a tad expensive) the M20 has some really nice counter play versus the .222 with the bazooka crew and smoke. IMO that matchup actually comes down to who micros the engagement properly. The rifle scaling is only weak compared to vet 2 lmg grens, but with the vet 2 rifle nade range nerf the .50 cal can help mitigate this.
I have no idea where the comments about OST t2 shutting down all of the LT tech, because the AAHT absolutely shits on everything that can be produced from there aside from a pak, and as long as you don't eat a TWP/faust you shouldn't be losing your AAHT to a pak.
The ATG is actually pretty reliable, yes major arty is a joke against anything with treads or legs, but it does enough damage to reliably cripple or wipe a pak 43, and can do enough damage to OKW base buildings to finish them off quickly with a supporting ATG or jackson, same goes for the time on time arty. The doctrinal light vehicles are pretty niche and not worth it in most cases, i'll give you that, and bazookas aren't really worth it either, except MAYBE on a RE squad against OKW mechanized if you've already tech'd for bars.
I think most of the issues with the faction are wildly overstated. Yes starting 3 rifles every game is pretty lame, but the faction isn't without options. Armor company against OKW is just outright broken. You can trade vehicles so cost effectively it's not even funny, and the combined arms of LT and CPT gives you the flexibility to deal with just about any threat.
Don't even get me started about Rifle company. Now that the flamers don't explode that is easily the most forgiving commander in the game. Just lost a rifle? No biggie, call in a new vet 2 squad and equip with flamer, bam, you've got your elite infantry replacement.
Calling in Armor Company Artillery on an OKW players medic truck can cost the OKW player the game due to the hi AoE of the shells and the fact they do death crit damage instead of normal damage. It essentially creates a no go zone for a significant portion of time. Also dozer shermans are good for wiping Obers and other elite infantry. |
Maybe we've been playing the USF wrong this entire time.
Well OKW plays a lot differently than it used to, I can say that for sure. |
Is there anything really that wrong with Volks getting less useful as the game goes on? The same thing happens with conscripts. Both can build sand bags. Volks at least have the potential to become potent against tanks - they are the largest shrek wielding squad in the game.
Later in the game when facing heavier armor shreks kinda fall off in how useful they are because you need to close with the tank which is easier said than done. But honestly I don't really find Volks to be that useful in numbers early or mid game outside of just being cap monkies since you can't get a cheaper squad like engies or pio's to do it.
5 MP 40 are not worth 70 ammo.
This, MP-40's in this game are horrible. |
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USF by design encourages lots of blobbing ---> Blob counters become extremely common ---> USF meta shifts in the extreme ----> ??? |
Sorry to break it to you but, top 200 as okw ONLY is easy as fuck!
Why the hell would i play a 2v2? There are way too many factors. Then i gotta make sure one of my m8s is willing to play.
All i know is he needs to practice if he wants any chance.
*top 100 |
Exactly, that was in my initial post but Alex ignored it altogether. For the most part Allies rely on one-shots to wipe squads while axis as Alex said can sustain more reliable dps which means more reliably killing retreating squads.
The fact is Soviets 1-shots seem so bad to a lot of Axis players because that is mostly how they lose the squad. Demo charge at this point is the only really cheap thing soviets have in that regard atm.
1 shot squad wipes over bleed impact Axis very hard because OKW/Ost rely very heavily on veteranacy scaling in order to keep up with Allied elite infantry. If an enemy player just "bleeds" me when I'm playing OKW I can still stay in the game because my infantry will be able to scale and then deal with Shocks/guards/rifleblobs.
I'm all for making Allied "damage" more consistent, but 1 shot squad wipes lay mostly in the hands of Soviets which is why they are so amazing this patch. I really don't think it's debatable that in the competitive modes that the extremely powerful artillery capabilities of Soviets don't make for a fun match when countering is impossible as OKW.
Unit formation spread changes are necessary, but honestly OKW getting evened out into all 5 man squads/weapon teams (while keeping the same overall DPS of the squad and durability by adjusting recieved accuracy) things would be more consistent, same for USF. |
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A Sturmtiger represents a massive investment of resources by the OKW player. Adjusted for fuel income a Sturmtiger is worth 240 fuel is enough for an IS2 or a Tiger. If your not on the ball using it then it will probably cost you the game because you dumped all your fuel into it when you could have gotten a PIV or Panther or JPIV, ect.
The new Sturmtiger is fine were it is, it comes much later than it used to, it's limited to one doctrine (a mediocre one at that) and it's already a niche unit. |
Well now you've just upgraded the Volksblob being cheap versions to Sturms, to superior versions of Sturms.
The Sergeant idea, however: perhaps we can make it where Volks start out at 4-man squad, but along the way to teching this upgrade adds the 5th member to the squad, similar to vet2 RETs? Could be found in T3 so that you choose between forward retreat + medics or no ISG/ JP4 and bigger Volks squads.
Or just give them an alternate AT Rifle upgrade (can't also upgrade to panzerschreck, so you get better AI vs better AT meta). Such an idea can also instead be a doctrinal unlock. Each upgrade grants one weapon, and instead has the Volks improved long-range firepower rather than replacing Sturms.
You know all the weapons in the game aren't the same squad to squad? You could easily give Volks a StG upgrade that comes after you convert your first truck or have it as a purchasable upgrade in the HQ (like a global upgrade such as AT nades) that means it doesn't overshadow Sturms at the start and gives Volks more punch later into the game.
On top of that you could make the StG 44 Volks get be less accurate and as such do less DPS at long ranges (it's not like Volks are that great anyway at any point AI wise). This patch was just kinda the nail in the coffin for how useful Volks are now that the Shrek isn't going to save your ass when facing Quad mounts.
EDIT: And blobbing Volks WILL lose you the game, as you have no smoke to negate MG's so you will just get suppressed and crushed (literally crushed). |
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