My solution to this:
here's this chart showing pre and post patch, i'd reduce it to half, see what happens, i agree that pre patch rifles were kind of bad but now they overperform in every matter
Rifles overperforming?
24 Sep 2019, 11:17 AM
#1
Posts: 2807 | Subs: 6
Recently i really struggle fighting USF rifles, even when my volks are in green cover and rifles are charging them i'm losing this battle, and even then, volks got their cost increased, i also tried going fussiliers but it's even worse, they are similar to volks, cant build sndbags, they might be good in late game but when you lose early game you've already lost it, USF playstyle now is like 90% going 3 rifles, LT, m20, that's the best combo against OKW nowadays, falls seems to counter them but they come too late against this.
My solution to this:
here's this chart showing pre and post patch, i'd reduce it to half, see what happens, i agree that pre patch rifles were kind of bad but now they overperform in every matter
My solution to this:
here's this chart showing pre and post patch, i'd reduce it to half, see what happens, i agree that pre patch rifles were kind of bad but now they overperform in every matter
24 Sep 2019, 11:29 AM
#2
Posts: 591 | Subs: 1
Ah yes. Their marginally better results specifically between the distances of 4 and 10 make them mad OP.
You know, the distance they *already* thrashed Volks at.
You know, the distance they *already* thrashed Volks at.
24 Sep 2019, 11:33 AM
#3
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Well they were already good before the last buff. They only struggled with OKW early game dominance and Volks+Sturm combo.
Now that OKW early game power was reduced they are just too good considering they always bullied Grens anyway.
It's true that they always beat Volks in close to mid-range but now the margin is so big that even if they have to close in they often end up winning. Plus Sturmpioneers are terrible against Riflemen now, before they could get a lot more work done in the early minutes prior to bar upgrades.
Now that OKW early game power was reduced they are just too good considering they always bullied Grens anyway.
It's true that they always beat Volks in close to mid-range but now the margin is so big that even if they have to close in they often end up winning. Plus Sturmpioneers are terrible against Riflemen now, before they could get a lot more work done in the early minutes prior to bar upgrades.
24 Sep 2019, 11:34 AM
#4
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Well they were already good before the last buff. They only struggled with OKW early game dominance and Volks+Sturm combo.
Now that OKW early game power was reduced they are just too good considering they always bullied Grens anyway.
It's true that they always beat Volks in close to mid-range but now the margin is so big that even if they have to close in they often end up winning. Plus Sturmpioneers are terrible against Riflemen now, before they could get a lot more work done in the early minutes prior to bar upgrades.
OKW early game power is unchanged.
Following volks simply arrive 1-2 seconds later. Nothing else changed.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
24 Sep 2019, 11:34 AM
#5
Posts: 2807 | Subs: 6
not to mention the USF gain really quick access to M20, which just rekts OKW, and so you either go rush light veh which with good control you get it at 7th min mark or you go raketen, it's all about timing, M20 comes at around 4-5 min?
24 Sep 2019, 11:35 AM
#6
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
OKW early game power is unchanged.
Following volks simply arrive 1-2 seconds later. Nothing else changed.
How can it be unchanged when they start with less MP and Volks cost more? These timings are important for early game engagements.
24 Sep 2019, 11:36 AM
#7
9 Posts: 1094 | Subs: 20
To be honest the bigger problem in my opinion is the power spike when the extra LT squad + M20 + Stuart hits the field. Rifles before felt awkward and now them are worth their price.
24 Sep 2019, 11:37 AM
#8
Posts: 4474
To be honest the bigger problem in my opinion is the power spike when the extra LT squad + M20 + Stuart hits the field. Rifles before felt awkward and now them are worth their price.what are u talking about don't u know that having a free LT is actually a draw back
katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
24 Sep 2019, 11:39 AM
#9
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
How can it be unchanged when they start with less MP and Volks cost more? These timings are important for early game engagements.
1st volk arrives at exact same time.
2nd volk arrives ~6 seconds later.
Following ones arrive ~1-2 seconds later.
Its not going to make or break the early game, especially since teching was made cheaper and in return, absolutely nothing was changed as by 2nd truck deployed, you have MORE MP then you'd have pre-changes, assuming you don't do more then 4 volks.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
24 Sep 2019, 11:40 AM
#10
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
Ah yes. Their marginally better results specifically between the distances of 4 and 10 make them mad OP.
You know, the distance they *already* thrashed Volks at.
You missed the part where everyone playing UKF is revolting because sections, the best mainline by far prenerf, got a 0.1 target size debuff out of cover.
24 Sep 2019, 11:40 AM
#11
Posts: 1002 | Subs: 2
1st volk arrives at exact same time.
2nd volk arrives ~6 seconds later.
Following ones arrive ~1-2 seconds later.
Its not going to make or break the early game.
And increasing riflemen close range from 3 to 6 isn't going to make or break the early game either... Oh wait.
Editing to be more productive: The point is that even seemingly small changes can have large impacts. Sections saw a ~10% durability decrease outside of cover, and around 5% less DPS all around (due to overkill) and some people are saying they're too weak now (and keep in mind they were considered pretty strong prior...).
24 Sep 2019, 11:41 AM
#12
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
To be honest the bigger problem in my opinion is the power spike when the extra LT squad + M20 + Stuart hits the field. Rifles before felt awkward and now them are worth their price.
You mean making every usf unit better than their counterparts AND giving them free squads makes them overperform?
Woah
24 Sep 2019, 11:44 AM
#13
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
I’m just hopeful that the balance team will take a good hard look at the usf and realize free officers are a meme and should be paid for. I also hope riflemen don’t get nerfed, as crutching on call ins and REs is not desirable. Now that rifles are good it’s time to fix the usf tech structure.
24 Sep 2019, 11:46 AM
#14
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Another thing I personally don't get is the mine laying speed. Why can Rifles lay mines as fast as pioneers/engineers now? I thought it was supposed to be a trade-off between speed and available squads that are capable of laying mines. Why not just give RE proper mines instead?
24 Sep 2019, 11:49 AM
#15
Posts: 3032 | Subs: 3
You mean making every usf unit better than their counterparts AND giving them free squads makes them overperform?
Woah
Can rank 500+ players please stop sharing their opinion on balance?
24 Sep 2019, 11:50 AM
#16
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
Can rank 500+ players please stop sharing their opinion on balance?
Agreed they are quite annoying.
Meanwhile I’m happy with my lv16s to share my opinion, even if it’s wrong.
24 Sep 2019, 11:51 AM
#17
Posts: 1002 | Subs: 2
You mean making every usf unit better than their counterparts AND giving them free squads makes them overperform?
Woah
USF had similar performance for most units during GCS2. Stuart was the same, AA HT the same, 50 cal (iirc) the same, m1 AT gun the same, sherman the same, mortar was the same, REs were nearly the same (same DPS anyway), pack howitzer was stronger, the jackson was stronger, scott was stronger, LT was stronger by virtue of the fact that it came with weapon upgrades, and the m20 was much costlier though I would say better performing.
Considering USF's performance and presence in GCS2, I'd say having "every usf unit better than their counterparts AND giving them free squads" isn't quite the issue as you paint it to be.
(Also consider that a lot of the units the above would be compared to were the same or weaker - mg42 was the same, maxim was weaker; AT guns unchanged + raketen buffed; p4 and cromwell buffed; indirect fire was the same; TDs were the same, etc.)
24 Sep 2019, 11:55 AM
#19
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
USF had similar performance for most units during GCS2. Stuart was the same, AA HT the same, 50 cal (iirc) the same, m1 AT gun the same, sherman the same, mortar was the same, REs were nearly the same (same DPS anyway), pack howitzer was stronger, the jackson was stronger, scott was stronger, LT was stronger by virtue of the fact that it came with weapon upgrades, and the m20 was much costlier though I would say better performing.
Considering USF's performance and presence in GCS2, I'd say having "every usf unit better than their counterparts AND giving them free squads" isn't quite the issue as you paint it to be.
(Also consider that a lot of the units the above would be compared to were the same or weaker - mg42 was the same, maxim was weaker; AT guns unchanged + raketen buffed; p4 and cromwell buffed; indirect fire was the same; TDs were the same, etc.)
Yeah I worded it wrong, I was thinking of current rifles.
I think rifles held back usf quite a bit before since everyone crutched on assault engineers then ir paths, so a lot of firepower was not properly supported. Now with how good rifles are again the faction is better, which is why in my opinion the next thing to be considered/reworked for usf is officers, which hopefully mean they become something you have to pay for, meaning the balance team will have the opportunity to make them stand out as squads instead of slightly different riflemen.
I don’t know, does this seem fair or am I speaking crazy?
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