StuG life not viable

1 it has more armor 2 it deals ton of damage, so no it's anti inf just cause it supresses them it does not make it not anti inf

1. this doesnt make sense... its going to die to AT guns just as quickly as the flametruck

2. it deals alot less damage than the flametruck does... granted it does suppression

a the pw wefer the unit that only has 160 range and has lower aoe and is an hit or miss , while the katy can fire from 200 range and can saturate and area leaving no chance to get away with 1 or 2 models , either u instant retreat or they are dead

Irrelevant... all rocket arty is fired at minimum range lest they have almost no effect
and no the pwerfer wipes much much better than the katy does... at any range

pwefer is not bad but why rant about it ? i didn't say anything about it

because you wanted a katy-pwerfer comparison... im sorry but the Pwerfer is better

Saying kt is long range anti inf and the p4 and not listing the t 34 76 is pure bias, why do count basic medium as anti inf but not the t 34 76 ?

the T-34-76 is made of swiss cheese having less HP than the average medium and dies to a sneeze from 2 AT guns... a P4 or a sherman would easily be able to escape death that would fall upon a T-34-76

and lastly this is coming from the faction with THE worst core infantry and machinegun ingame...


just to note however...

the soviets may have the squishiest and probably the least potent core vehicle AI....
but the soviet doctrinal vehicle AI are some of the scariest ones ingame....

ISU-152
IS-2
T-34-85
KV-8
even the KV-1

hence the soviets... even in their vehicles continue to suffer from the "doctrines for viability syndrome".... this has to end... people dont want to be stuck playing guards motor combined arms or armored assault to make up for the lack of good vehicle AI...

TLDR; make core soviet viable...

1. this doesnt make sense... its going to die to AT guns just as quickly as the flametruck

2. it deals alot less damage than the flametruck does... granted it does suppression


Irrelevant... all rocket arty is fired at minimum range lest they have almost no effect
and no the pwerfer wipes much much better than the katy does... at any range


because you wanted a katy-pwerfer comparison... im sorry but the Pwerfer is better



the T-34-76 is made of swiss cheese having less HP than the average medium and dies to a sneeze from 2 AT guns... a P4 or a sherman would easily be able to escape death that would fall upon a T-34-76

and lastly this is coming from the faction with THE worst core infantry and machinegun ingame...


just to note however...

the soviets may have the squishiest and probably the least potent core vehicle AI....
but the soviet doctrinal vehicle AI are some of the scariest ones ingame....

ISU-152
IS-2
T-34-85
KV-8
even the KV-1

hence the soviets... even in their vehicles continue to suffer from the "doctrines for viability syndrome".... this has to end... people dont want to be stuck playing guards motor combined arms or armored assault to make up for the lack of good vehicle AI...

TLDR; make core soviet viable...

armor matter vs inf especially when it's anti inf

and here it is, no they are the same, it's saturation vs alpha (im sorry my ass)

oh yea the less hp of the t 34 76..... do u actually play the game the su 76 has the same hp as any medium, it has just 10 less armor than Sherman (cause it cost 20 less fuel)
btw 2 at-gun will kill any medium

the T-34-76 is made of swiss cheese having less HP than the average medium and dies to a sneeze from 2 AT guns... a P4 or a sherman would easily be able to escape death that would fall upon a T-34-76

While i agree with M5 - it's not proper antiinf tool, because 2 hits from pak and you will lost 30 fuel and 100 muni. It's just AA platform and back line support against stealth or flanking squds. Not frontline unit.

But t-3476. I have bad news for you - it deals 160 damage, same as all mediums in-game, have 640 hp - as all mediums in-game, only armor less - 150 instead 160. t-3476 not for 1vs1 against other mediums. It good against infantry, if you don't forget to keep it front (it hull mg very strong and deal tons of damage to infantry). Also don't forget about ram - it always deal 160 damage (as one shot), you could kill enemy tanks with it and it will be profit for you (90 fuel against 120 for p4).
Want stronger mediums? t-3485 or M4c to your service. It need more skill than for p4 or sherman, but when you know how to use it, all will be good.

armor matter vs inf especially when it's anti inf

and here it is, no they are the same, it's saturation vs alpha (im sorry my ass)

do you know what saturation is? its when you fire alot of rounds in one small area...
sat·u·rate
overwhelm (an enemy target area) by concentrated bombing.

the panzerwerfer is the one that truly saturates an area via concentrated bombardment... the katyusha instead does area denial... its move out of the way or take damage every second or so... the Pwerfer instead is retreat or risk getting wiped... if you think thats really comparable then youre bonkers...

oh yea the less hp of the t 34 76..... do u actually play the game the su 76 has the same hp as any medium, it has just 10 less armor than Sherman (cause it cost 20 less fuel)
btw 2 at-gun will kill any medium

its still squishier than most mediums.. id guess its lower cost offsets that... but unlike the OST P4 it doesnt have combat blitz... unlike the OKW P4 it doesnt have armor (and blitz)... and unlike the sherman it doesnt have smoke...

unlike other mediums it has no escape mechanism or special ability besides ram which is another bucket of worms considering how inconsistent it is vs heavier tanks...

https://www.coh2.org/topic/93537/t34-ram-inconsistency

But t-3476. I have bad news for you - it deals 160 damage, same as all mediums in-game, have 640 hp - as all mediums in-game, only armor less - 150 instead 160. t-3476 not for 1vs1 against other mediums. It good against infantry, if you don't forget to keep it front (it hull mg very strong and deal tons of damage to infantry). Also don't forget about ram - it always deal 160 damage (as one shot), you could kill enemy tanks with it and it will be profit for you (90 fuel against 120 for p4).
Want stronger mediums? t-3485 or M4c to your service. It need more skill than for p4 or sherman, but when you know how to use it, all will be good.

yes its great vs infantry... its also one of the most potent infantry crushers along with the M10... but unlike other forms of vehicle AI it has no escape mechanisms to get it out of bad situations like smoke or blitz, or durability like the brummbar and churchill that makes it stand out...

its only real advantage is its pricetag of 90 fuel... which is great tbh but bleeding 90 fuel to 2 AT guns whereas a sherman can smoke its way out or a P4 can blitz its way out bad is quite the difference to a 90 fuel bleed....


granted i dont think the T-34 should be buffed (except for ram)... but i think the soviets should get more long ranged or more durable core vehicle AI just like other factions... giving the SU-76 a switched static arty mode would be a good change for example

again they have different role saturation and alpha strike, btw u need to retreat from kat too as it has lower spread than pwefer (and has better aoe damage)

again u are now coparing to vet ability and do u expect the okw p4 which cost 60 more fuel to be the same as t 34 76 ? why does the luch lose to t 34 again ?

smoke is doc ? are we comparing doc now ? or is it fit only when u like it ?

btw yes a static AI option for su 76 would not make it cheesy and op, nahhh not like the old su 76 spam nahhhhh totally different

again they have different role saturation and alpha strike, btw u need to retreat from kat too as it has lower spread than pwefer (and has better aoe damage)

ahh yes i forgot... it has lower spread which means it saturates the target less than the pwerfer does...

again u are now coparing to vet ability and do u expect the okw p4 which cost 60 more fuel to be the same as t 34 76 ? why does the luch lose to t 34 again ?

its a vet ability... but it is an escape mechanism nonetheless

and the comparison is there to elucidate the point that the soviets have no durable core vehicle AI

smoke is doc ? are we comparing doc now ? or is it fit only when u like it ?

Sherman smoke is nondoc dumbass

btw yes a static AI option for su 76 would not make it cheesy and op, nahhh not like the old su 76 spam nahhhhh totally different

besides the katy what do the soviets have as nondoc vehicle AI? and what do u propose to remedy this deficiency

ahh yes i forgot... it has lower spread which means it saturates the target less than the pwerfer does...


its a vet ability... but it is an escape mechanism nonetheless

and the comparison is there to elucidate the point that the soviets have no durable core vehicle AI


Sherman smoke is nondoc dumbass



besides the katy what do the soviets have as nondoc vehicle AI? and what do u propose to remedy this deficiency

lower spread means missile will be more tightly packed and will wipe more easily

the t 34 76 is durable,it's just 10 armor less than sherman while being around 80% the cost

what does the okw have aside from stuka for long range ai ? cause kt is not long range and is an heavy tank
and u are not counting t 34 7 so why should u count p4 ?

Do we want them though? They are only 90 fuel. To counter TDs, Ostheer has plenty of options, mainly Pak 40s, Panzerschrecks, Panthers and the Elefant. The StuG is meant to counter medium tanks and it does that very well (especially since the latest buffs). It will have more of a role once heavy call-ins get tied to tech and mediums will (probably) be used a lot more again.

Even in team games I find the StuG very useful just to serve as intermediate AT after rushing an Ostwind. Just don't expect it to go toe to toe with the much more expensive Allied TDs and make sure to transition into the appropriate units if the enemy builds them.

Then give them a T4 upgrade to give them more range. It doesn't matter, the range is the main problem. Change the normal name to StuG 3 F, upgrade is called StuG 3 G field upgrade ( installs longer barrel) etc.

E.g. 10 fuel for 5 more range for, every StuG has to upgrade.



Edit:

That thread is also good to speak about StuG E, it should become T2 with T3 tech requirement.

lower spread means missile will be more tightly packed and will wipe more easily

https://www.coh2.org/topic/49245/nerf-the-panzerwerfer-already

Read mr smiths post... the katy has less scatter at max range and mote scatter at minimum range...

But max range is irrelevant soo no... it doesnt work that way

the t 34 76 is durable,it's just 10 armor less than sherman while being around 80% the cost

Durability isnt about raw stats alone... the T-34 may take the same hits to kill as a sherman... but the sherman will survive situations the T-34 wont because of smoke...

what does the okw have aside from stuka for long range ai ? cause kt is not long range and is an heavy tank
and u are not counting t 34 7 so why should u count p4 ?

Ohh if only i had a medium tank with 187 base armor and combat blitz... ohh wait...

T34/76 is faster than P4 as stock, you need more speed? Road-killing is allii meter -> noob verhicles.

Edit: T34/76's AI is too strong, nerf the MG to compensate the good gun, like I say since years. Maybe give it 20 more HP, so it survives more hits.

since u ointed at that therad u don't mind this quote from mr smith "
The Katyusha is, currently, extremely strong. It only sucks if you are doing max-range barrages into the fog of war.
" so no pwefer is not stronger than kat they are both fine

again it costs 140 fu u can basically have 2 t3 76 , 3 t 34 76 will cost less than 2 okw p4s

and u pay 90 fu not 110 like the sharman, saying it's not durable cause u are biased does not count, as u said before " its going to die to AT guns just as quickly as the flametruck" it's going to die to the same 4 hit form at gun both p4 and Sherman (let me guess u only are allowed to chose what is important and what isn't right ? even if u ur self said it beofre)

T34/76 is faster than P4 as stock, you need more speed? Road-killing is allii meter -> noob verhicles.

Edit: T34/76's AI is too strong, nerf the MG to compensate the good gun, like I say since years. Maybe give it 20 more HP, so it survives more hits.

Lmao this tank wasnt even used prior to its buff and now you want to make it useless again? The T-34-76 is fine as AI... it just doesnt fill the same role as a sherman or an OKW P4 can

Good old day whe STuG horde can murder IS-2 ...

Pls don't touch the things that not broken.
STuG is in the fine spot now, its have own role.
More buff will make Panther obsolate .

since u ointed at that therad u don't mind this quote from mr smith "
The Katyusha is, currently, extremely strong. It only sucks if you are doing max-range barrages into the fog of war.
" so no pwefer is not stronger than kat they are both fine

I said the katyusha is fine... its quite useful in smaller games... its just that the panzerwerfer is BETTER

it is BETTER at killing models
it is BETTER at suppressing blobs
And it is BETTER at doing wipes

The only thing the katyusha is BETTER at is area denial

again it costs 140 fu u can basically have 2 t3 76 , 3 t 34 76 will cost less than 2 okw p4s

Yes but you seem to be incapable of understanding the point.... the soviets lack durable vehicle AI...

and u pay 90 fu not 110 like the sharman, saying it's not durable cause u are biased does not count, as u said before " its going to die to AT guns just as quickly as the flametruck" it's going to die to the same 4 hit form at gun both p4 and Sherman (let me guess u only are allowed to chose what is important and what isn't right ? even if u ur self said it beofre)

As i said... bleeding 90 fuel is worse than bleeding none at all... the issue is the soviets dont have the option of durable AI..

Lmao this tank wasnt even used prior to its buff and now you want to make it useless again? The T-34-76 is fine as AI... it just doesnt fill the same role as a sherman or an OKW P4 can

It will not make it UP, but balance it.

T34 hull MG is broken, it makes as much damage as both MGs of P4. While P4 will shoot at different dargets (most time) T34 wilö focus on one model. If it is a PaK-crew that is like sniping them. Also the animator is broken, it shoot while not indicate the fire.

-> normally that is something nobody has do speak about, it is broken.

Nerfing the MG of T34 will be a reason why P4 is more expensive. It will still have the ebtter AI gun.

It will not make it UP, but balance it.

T34 hull MG is broken, it makes as much damage as both MGs of P4. While P4 will shoot at different dargets (most time) T34 wilö focus on one model. If it is a PaK-crew that is like sniping them. Also the animator is broken, it shoot while not indicate the fire.

-> normally that is something nobody has do speak about, it is broken.

Nerfing the MG of T34 will be a reason why P4 is more expensive. It will still have the ebtter AI gun.

great... lets make core soviet even worse and force the soviets to rely on doctrines even more... note that even with overpowered (guards) and powerful (T-34-85/KV-8) doctrinal units the average soviet winrate is still very close to that of wehrmacht... by nerfing core soviet units you are further aggravating the issue without dealing with the true problem...

TLDR nerf DOCTRINAL soviet units... not CORE units

It will not make it UP, but balance it.

It is balanced.
You not being able to accept it doesn't change the fact.

T34 hull MG is broken, it makes as much damage as both MGs of P4. While P4 will shoot at different dargets (most time) T34 wilö focus on one model. If it is a PaK-crew that is like sniping them. Also the animator is broken, it shoot while not indicate the fire.

Read patch notes.
Alternative was buffing the gun itself. Up for that?

-> normally that is something nobody has do speak about, it is broken.
Nerfing the MG of T34 will be a reason why P4 is more expensive. It will still have the ebtter AI gun.

Normally reading patch notes is a good thing, do it more often to look less stupid and entitled in the future.

P4 is more expensive, because it has much better armor, much better gun(both AI and AT), can shoot at planes and has much better vet.

It is balanced.
You not being able to accept it doesn't change the fact.

Read patch notes.
Alternative was buffing the gun itself. Up for that?


Normally reading patch notes is a good thing, do it more often to look less stupid and entitled in the future.

P4 is more expensive, because it has much better armor, much better gun(both AI and AT), can shoot at planes and has much better vet.

this is not even adding how bad core soviets performed a few patches ago before the guards buffs... even with the penal bull rush they had barely any lategame capability (though penal flamers were amazing early on) and melted like butter to the volksblob and the grenblob... people dont seem to realize that the soviets are only really competing nowadays through doctrines... and this practice has to stop...

core soviet must be buffed up to other faction standards... and these biased axis mains should stop forcing the soviets to rely on band aide just to remedy a deficiency in core units...

I said the katyusha is fine... its quite useful in smaller games... its just that the panzerwerfer is BETTER

it is BETTER at killing models
it is BETTER at suppressing blobs
And it is BETTER at doing wipes

The only thing the katyusha is BETTER at is area denial



Yes but you seem to be incapable of understanding the point.... the soviets lack durable vehicle AI...



As i said... bleeding 90 fuel is worse than bleeding none at all... the issue is the soviets dont have the option of durable AI..

kat has betetr aoe so they both wipe, thanks to the high spread the chance to wipe with pwefer are lower than kat, so kat is BETTER at killing team weapons and SIMILAR for wipes

again ur definition of durable is quite fluctuating, first u say "it takes the same number of at gun hit to die" then u say "a bit more armor is important" mmmhhh seems almost like ur definition of things only suits ur need and are ready to use the opposite of what u just said as along as it fits ur narrative

kat has betetr aoe so they both wipe,

are you meaning to tell me 4 rockets will wipe better than 10 just because they have 6 AOE as opposed to 4?

thanks to the high spread the chance to wipe with pwefer are lower than kat, so kat is BETTER at killing team weapons and SIMILAR for wipes

mr smith already confirmed that the panzerwerfer has a better scatter ratio... stop displaying blatant signs of cognitive dissonance...

soo no it isnt BETTER at killing team weapons unless those teamweapons are stupid enough not to retreat for 6 seconds... (landing 16 rockets instead of 4 at slightly higher dispersion)

again ur definition of durable is quite fluctuating, first u say "it takes the same number of at gun hit to die" then u say "a bit more armor is important" mmmhhh seems almost like ur definition of things only suits ur need and are ready to use the opposite of what u just said as along as it fits ur narrative

i define durable as "the ability of a unit to survive situations"... id guess i should have used the term survivability... anyhoo

OKW P4 = takes more shots to kill and can blitz
sherman = can escape using smoke
ost P4 = can blitz
T-34 = ???

therefore the T-34 is the one with the least durability as it cannot survive situations that ANY OTHER medium can... maybe i should have switched the term out with survivability... regardless my statements stand...