Recon units/abilities are too affordable and available

Fog Of War is one of the key elements of strategy games. And this game specially values flanking, planing and smart use of sight blockers. Recon Overflight abilities and most flare shots negate this concept for a cheap cost. Dedicated scout units are never used for this purpose.

You would argue that unaffordable recon can put the player in a vulnerable position against on map arty such as leFH and B2, but arty is a different topic. Yes, arty seems somewhat lethal and rewarding in team games and they might need a rework.

IMO the more offending recon unit/abilities are:

• OKW Uhu halftrack.
  
• Valentine.
  
• All Recon Overflights.
  
• OKW and UKF/SU Mortar flares.
  
  
  

I would suggest buff the special purpose stock recon units such as m3/kubel/m20/222 and heavily increase the cost forO KW Uhu halftrack, Valentine, All Recon Overflights and Mortar flares.

Agree but change that profile pic.

Agree but change that profile pic.

This.

Valentine is literally T70, which is literally any other scout car range.

Uhu is the REAL actual issue when it comes to too efficient scouting.

Valentine is literally T70, which is literally any other scout car range.

Uhu is the REAL actual issue when it comes to too efficient scouting.

Could tried it with some sort of cool down or something for the UHU

Valentine is literally T70, which is literally any other scout car range.

Uhu is the REAL actual issue when it comes to too efficient scouting.

Uhu has zero combat capability. Ther is a reason why its the least used out of all the options above.

UwU

Uhu has zero combat capability. Ther is a reason why its the least used out of all the options above.

Having a literal map hack and saying "it doesn't fight" isn't exactly a good argument.

Valentine and T70 in recon modes also can't fight, yet both of their scouting abilities were nerfed into oblivion.

Uhu is a bad unit that supports bad and unfair design and its cost is so laughably low that it doesn't matter if it can fight or not.

If you nerf Recon Flights, will the Major receive any changes? I wouldn't mind it being higher cost and requiring vet, if it was less of a "blink and miss it" kind of recon plane, unless you vet to get 2 planes.

Valentine isn't what it used to be, its sight isn't all that great anymore.

I do have issue with recon flares that light up nearly the entire map. I'm fine with directed recon where you call in a plane that loiters and reveals units in one part of the map, but flares are just downright annoying, both the Brit and OKW versions of flares and they need to be reduced to simply targeting a small region of the map rather than lighting up the entire front line.

The UHU is ok for the most part, but its range is pretty insane, idk why more OKW players don't use them, especially in team games where their benefit is much more apparent. I do think considering its capabilities that it could have a price increase, but that's just my opinion, it's far from a glaring issue. I mean it is only 20mp / 5 fuel, which is practically nothing, it's cheaper than a kubelwagen and gives you a massive advantage in knowing enemy troop positions.

Alternatively, the UHU should be made weaker and easier to kill. I believe it takes 2 shots from most tanks to kill, it should be like other vulnerable units that die in 1 hit.

For example, it takes 3 hits from an AEC to kill an UHU. 2 hits from most other allied medium tanks. It's a little too durable considering what it is.

Uhu is a bad unit that supports bad and unfair design and its cost is so laughably low that it doesn't matter if it can fight or not.

Then why does nobody use it?

It's a lame unit but you are overexaggerating its usefulness.

The UHU is ok for the most part, but its range is pretty insane, idk why more OKW players don't use them, especially in team games where their benefit is much more apparent.

The unit has been bugged since OKW release, giving permanent vision on infantry units. This is the reason why it's been banned from recent tournaments.

Then why does nobody use it?

It's a lame unit but you are overexaggerating its usefulness.

Harder to justify it's cost on 1v1. Trickier on 2v2 but no brainer in 3v3.

But because 80% of the playerbase is real bad who doesn't use minimap/tactical map and don't bother with using suppression tools, they don't seem to realise it. Just so people don't get triggered, this also applies to other genres. Call it MOBAS or FPS. I have seen cheaters on Battlefield with constant spotting enemies across the map and no one from the other 31 players in my team, realising what is happening.

Same reason why radio silence is underwhelming. You don't benefit from it, if your opponent doesn't use the minimap in the first place.

The difference in skill is truly a problem when it comes to recon. When the game was first released, literally nobody used recon abilities. So they were constantly buffed in the patches to make them more appealing. After some time the competitive scene realised how OP recon is and started to use it so some nerfs came in, but you can really nerf it too much as it is still totally forgotten by literally 90% of players.

Uhu is cheaper than Soviet mandatory conscript upgrades and shows you the enemy through sight blockers... Why are people complaining? It can't fight? Sure but it's a force multiplier that makes both units in its their more effective by spotting for arty targets and letting you know when they move up AT. no, it can't fight because despite what all the changes to volks would lead you to believe, a single unit shouldn't be able to do each and every little thing you could ever need. Trying another faction where combined arms is not only a thing, but even recommended people wouldn't be bitching about it.

Agreed with the OP on everything except for mayybe recon runs since at least you can shoot them down and they aren't super cheap IMO.

Uhu has zero combat capability. Ther is a reason why its the least used out of all the options above.

IMO its the worst offender of all though. Because it has zero combat capability (I'm guessing), it's literally one of the cheapest units in the game, and then it can always be scanning instead of fighting. Stuff like the valentine is at least decently expensive and its just a sight range boost on the valentine now, instead of a massive maphack that reveals camo units too.

Flares and IR HT could both do with looking at.

As for Recon loiter, it would be nice if the plane had to circle once before it granted the player vision. Allowing some chance of shooting it down first.

Agreed with the OP on everything except for mayybe recon runs since at least you can shoot them down and they aren't super cheap IMO.


IMO its the worst offender of all though. Because it has zero combat capability (I'm guessing), it's literally one of the cheapest units in the game, and then it can always be scanning instead of fighting. Stuff like the valentine is at least decently expensive and its just a sight range boost on the valentine now, instead of a massive maphack that reveals camo units too.

Because valentine has combat capability ffs.

The unit has been bugged since OKW release, giving permanent vision on infantry units. This is the reason why it's been banned from recent tournaments.



Harder to justify it's cost on 1v1. Trickier on 2v2 but no brainer in 3v3.

But because 80% of the playerbase is real bad who doesn't use minimap/tactical map and don't bother with using suppression tools, they don't seem to realise it. Just so people don't get triggered, this also applies to other genres. Call it MOBAS or FPS. I have seen cheaters on Battlefield with constant spotting enemies across the map and no one from the other 31 players in my team, realising what is happening.

Same reason why radio silence is underwhelming. You don't benefit from it, if your opponent doesn't use the minimap in the first place.

If certain units are OP ppl will abuse them. If the uhu was so broken as ur all seem to make out, it would be being abused majority of games but it doesn't. I see it rarely and only in team games.

You guys also need to understand OKW dont have access to other non doc recon overflight like USF, and correct me if i'm wrong only have access to recon in 2 doctrines (luftwaffe and special operations).

In team games (3v3 or higher, but not too uncommon in 2v2 as well) the infrared halftrack is basically a guarantee if the OKW player techs that way.

Dunno why it isn't just a focused sight unit, like what the su-85 gets, have it setup and it gives you normal vision that way. Could make the arc wider than an su-85 by a bit.

edit: I refuse to call it an 'uhu'.

Then why does nobody use it?

It's a lame unit but you are overexaggerating its usefulness.

I see it all the time in 2v2s, no clue what you're talking about

It's 5 fuel. Zero reason not to get one if you went BGHQ

On a separate note spec ops flares and Overwatch territory flares are the most egregious. Spec Ops flares for the lack of counterplay, Overwatch flares because of the lack of micro OR cost to use them.

I see it all the time in 2v2s, no clue what you're talking about

It's 5 fuel. Zero reason not to get one if you went BGHQ

On a separate note spec ops flares and Overwatch territory flares are the most egregious. Spec Ops flares for the lack of counterplay, Overwatch flares because of the lack of micro OR cost to use them.

have you seen the royal arty´regiment early warning? flares over the whole frontline. Much fun.