Artillery Flares of OKW's Special Operations Commander

It's almost like a map hack. It can give sight anywhere at considerably low cost with very short cooldown. And there's nothing can counter it. It can also be devastating in team games when used with Zeroing Art and other barrage or air strike ability.
And the similar ability of USF Rifle Company only give Rifles access to flares.
It's unfair that an ability that give continous sight so far behind the line with nothing to counter it.
How about replace it with recon overflight or making it only give volks access to flares like USF.

The cooldown is really sort. I would start with increasing CD and go from there.

I see no harm in replacing it with the recon plane. Same effect, more obvious to newer players who don't know what to look for and has some counterplay.

Recon with smoke and thats it easy fix

Soviet mortars have it too, I dont see you complaining about them.

Maybe shorter lifespans could be a good solution. You know where they are, you cant "aim" at them, just force fire to their position.

Edit: I read the argument of infantry rifles. Thats a bad idea. Stop making factions simmetryc and boring. Remove flares from all factions. Ez.

Soviet mortars have it too, I dont see you complaining about them.

Maybe shorter lifespans could be a good solution. You know where they are, you cant "aim" at them, just force fire to their position.

Edit: I read the argument of infantry rifles. Thats a bad idea. Stop making factions simmetryc and boring. Remove flares from all factions. Ez.

The focus is the range not the lifespans. It could give sight too far behind the line.

The focus is the range not the lifespans. It could give sight too far behind the line.

Brits have borderline flares. SU has cheap flares and really easy to use (Damn! they already have the mortar im position to use it too!). USF has rifle flare as you stated.
OKM has flare -> OP! need nerf! #Alliefanboysunite!
How many times must i say this: Balance its not in each unit nor ability, its in each faction/commander overall design.
If you team up with someone to use flares+skillbomb. Thats not OP, you just wasted so many options and resources to one specific "combo" and a real expensive one.

want rifle flare on OKM?? OST jaeger have them, they are rarely used. you want that? Already Pzfusiliers have them too, not original change at all. Still want flares nerfed?? NERF THEM ALL.

What I said earlier, many flares gives you sight for so much time, even mortars get accurate shots, i mean thats cheessy and sort of "maphack". Make them last a few seconds, buildings light up with it will remain "visible" but not targetable, sort of like what tracking does.

Edit: Damn i want a revamp on all flares now! No more Fog of War revealing! Thats cheaty! Now they only do reveal invisible units inside their range. Same lifespan. Costs to be considered.

Brits have borderline flares. SU has cheap flares and really easy to use (Damn! they already have the mortar im position to use it too!). USF has rifle flare as you stated.
OKM has flare -> OP! need nerf! #Alliefanboysunite!
How many times must i say this: Balance its not in each unit nor ability, its in each faction/commander overall design.
If you team up with someone to use flares+skillbomb. Thats not OP, you just wasted so many options and resources to one specific "combo" and a real expensive one.

want rifle flare on OKM?? OST jaeger have them, they are rarely used. you want that? Already Pzfusiliers have them too, not original change at all. Still want flares nerfed?? NERF THEM ALL.

What I said earlier, many flares gives you sight for so much time, even mortars get accurate shots, i mean thats cheessy and sort of "maphack". Make them last a few seconds, buildings light up with it will remain "visible" but not targetable, sort of like what tracking does.

Edit: Damn i want a revamp on all flares now! No more Fog of War revealing! Thats cheaty! Now they only do reveal invisible units inside their range. Same lifespan. Costs to be considered.

With Mortars/Riflemen have a much smaller range and the unit can be countered to an extent. AA soft counters plane recon.

But call in flares need to go. Including the ones in the Royal artillery commander (although that is self balanced by being the worst commander in the worst faction at the moment).

But call in flares need to go. Including the ones in the Royal artillery commander (although that is self balanced by being the worst commander in the worst faction at the moment).

LOL

I agree, that spec ops commander is good and a flare call-in give quite much. Still recon planes are the opposite to a "spec-op" style

The easiest fix is to make ability function like UKF artillery commander ability
Or just give flares to leigs or volks

It's almost like a map hack. It can give sight anywhere at considerably low cost with very short cooldown. And there's nothing can counter it. It can also be devastating in team games when used with Zeroing Art and other barrage or air strike ability.
And the similar ability of USF Rifle Company only give Rifles access to flares.
It's unfair that an ability that give continous sight so far behind the line with nothing to counter it.
How about replace it with recon overflight or making it only give volks access to flares like USF.

have even seen the british map hack that is free and lasts for the entire match artillery flares?

Or the soviet morter flare?

Brits have borderline flares. SU has cheap flares and really easy to use (Damn! they already have the mortar im position to use it too!). USF has rifle flare as you stated.
OKM has flare -> OP! need nerf! #Alliefanboysunite!
How many times must i say this: Balance its not in each unit nor ability, its in each fac

tion/commander overall design.
If you team up with someone to use flares+skillbomb. Thats not OP, you just wasted so many options and resources to one specific "combo" and a real expensive one.

want rifle flare on OKM?? OST jaeger have them, they are rarely used. you want that? Already Pzfusiliers have them too, not original change at all. Still want flares nerfed?? NERF THEM ALL.

What I said earlier, many flares gives you sight for so much time, even mortars get accurate shots, i mean thats cheessy and sort of "maphack". Make them last a few seconds, buildings light up with it will remain "visible" but not targetable, sort of like what tracking does.

Edit: Damn i want a revamp on all flares now! No more Fog of War revealing! Thats cheaty! Now they only do reveal invisible units inside their range. Same lifespan. Costs to be considered.

OKW flares are more like a spell from dungeon keeper than any other flare ability

you just click half way across the map into the FoW and instant, pinpoint, long lasting recon that can't be shot down like aircraft can. Rifleman flares and british arty flares will never see past the frontlines in 4vs4 so all those juicy targets like retreat points and howitzers are safe in the rear lines.

great job ignoring why the ability is problematic, your logic is basically "well the old tiger ace wasn't OP because the soviets get a heavy tank too..." FACEPALM

great job ignoring why the ability is problematic, your logic is basically "well the old tiger ace wasn't OP because the soviets get a heavy tank too..." FACEPALM

I love the fact that there were many post in response of the one before and you just jumped to conclusions because you read the last one. ha. And Im the one ignoring things...
I know the ability and its strong aspects. What you ignore blatantly its OP just want a nerf for the sake of it.

And just to shut your mouth up, making the ability to target a neighbour terrain in order to send flares could be a good way to fix it. Yet you prefer to attack the messenger.

If you got triggered by the #Alliefanboysunite! I cant help you. Sorry.

Edit: can you pls show the ammu cost of all flares? Maybe thats why one can be cast all the other way of the map.

Soviet mortars have it too, I dont see you complaining about them.

Maybe shorter lifespans could be a good solution. You know where they are, you cant "aim" at them, just force fire to their position.

Edit: I read the argument of infantry rifles. Thats a bad idea. Stop making factions simmetryc and boring. Remove flares from all factions. Ez.

When is the last time a Soviet mortar flare light up your back line like an Xmas tree so the enemy could nuke arty or a retreat point? Same goes for the brit FRONTLINE flares. Other flares are Frontline or SLIGHTLY behind the front, not anywhere yuu want Andy time you want. Orbital flares are a cancer in team game. You can have unshootdownable recon and a buddy can go unshootdownable bomb strike. It's bad design.

I love the fact that there were many post in response of the one before and you just jumped to conclusions because you read the last one. ha. And Im the one ignoring things...
I know the ability and its strong aspects. What you ignore blatantly its OP just want a nerf for the sake of it.

And just to shut your mouth up, making the ability to target a neighbour terrain in order to send flares could be a good way to fix it. Yet you prefer to attack the messenger.

If you got triggered by the #Alliefanboysunite! I cant help you. Sorry.

Edit: can you pls show the ammu cost of all flares? Maybe thats why one can be cast all the other way of the map.

The issue is not with the flares themselves, but how often you can use them. Soviet mortar sniper and usf rifle flares can be used only so far you want to push that unit to reveal the area. With recon flares of okw you can pretty much instantly show certain portion of the map, without microing or risking your own unit, while costing only 60. It also cannot be shot down as the recon planes can be and it has quite short cooldown. British flares are limited to sector borders and cannot be extended much beyond that. It will show the combat area and unoccupied zones, but not much else.

I don't personally want to change it to just recon plane or turn it into over 100 munition dump. But there is not much choices around. The increased cooldown is by far imo the least radical and the most working option.

Maphack abilities and units in general are lame.
222 with spotting scopes was OP as hell.
T70 revealing the frontline and deep into enemy territory is still just dumb and should be nerfed.
Arti flares should be nerfed also.

Maphacks are just as bad of a design decisions as unitwipers like AVRE and out of fog of war Sturmtiger before its nerf.

You should have to rely on game sense and awareness instead of having a stupid units and abilities light up the battlefield without repercussions.

The easiest fix is to make ability function like UKF artillery commander ability
Or just give flares to leigs or volks

Leigs with flares sounds cool and balanced

One vote for this.

There is just no way to counter flare + artil skill fired from nowhere.
It's not a big deal on 1vs1, but as it goes to 3:3 or 4:4, it surely works like a maphack. Only thing you have to do is just click anywhere you want to see with low cost, low CD. rifleman or soviet mortar or Brit skill does not work like that. You only can see near frontline and unit must be present near the position.