USF radical design changes ideas

After many thought and reading opinions, I came to the conclusion USF faction is flawed by design and moving units from a tier or another without changing the Free officer system and tiering wouldn't do anything great. So I started thinking of how officers could be re-used and how teching could works.

Teching is now linear.
- Free officers are removed, T1 price is reduced, ambulance fuel cost removed, some prices and stats adjusted.
- 1st sherman (without spending side upgrades or building Lvs) comes 10 fuel later than with the current design but upgrades and Lvs are now cheaper on fuel making the use of them less punishing from techning.
- T1 comes much sooner increasing BO diversity, the idea is that one of the unit present from T1 becomes what old officer system was providing as 4th or 5th unit on the field.
- M20 also comes much sooner (with a mp cost reduction) giving more room to apply pressure and counter early sniper. It also force the opponent to react to it by teching T2 faster or to build an early raketen.
- T2 is more a pressuring Tier if you want to delay your armor but applying earlier pressure. As mentioned, Lvs are cheaper in fuel so less punishing. At the end the fuel cost of having one Lv before sherman is almost the same as with the current design.
- Officers (lt and cpt) are exclusive, one is a dedicated Close quarter squad and the other a long range support, the aim is to combine them with your doctrine selection to complement your choices. They are not mandatory to tech T3.
- Major cost 20 fuel, there is maybe room to improve his functionality on the field to better reflect his cost.

- Grenades are much more accessible, as the ambulance is not fuel free players can invest on grenades without having too much drawback.

T0
Rear Echelon 200mp
Riflemen 270mp
M1 81mm Mortar 240mp
Ambulance 200mp
Grenades 100mp / 15fuel
Bars&Zooks 100mp / 15fuel

T1 100mp / 30fuel (30sec delay)
HMG.50 280mp
ATG M1 270mp
M20 280mp / 20fuel

T2 100mp / 60fuel (40 sec delay)
M15 halftrack 270mp / 30fuel - base Health from 320 to 360 to survive 2 shots.
M5A1 Stuart 270mp / 50fuel
Pak howitzer 340mp
Lieutenant 320mp / 30fuel - comes with 3 thompsons, exclusive with captain, vet3 sprint, no weapon slot and can’t drop weapon.
Captain 340mp / 30fuel - comes with 2 M1919, exclusive with Lieutenant, on me ability and supervise, no weapon slot and can’t drop weapon.

T3 200mp / 90fuel
M4A3 Sherman 340mp/110fuel
M8A1 Scott 260mp/75fuel
M36 Jackson 400mp/140fuel
Major 200mp / 20fuel - Reco plane, Barrage, FRP

Modification for the most impacted doctrine with this change:

Airborn Doctrine
CP0 - Pathfinder - 300mp
CP02 - Paratroops - 380mp
CP03 - Ressource drop - Munition crates are dropped a cost of manpower
CP06 - Strafing run
CP08 - Bombing run

Reco Doctrine
CP0 Raid Tactic
CP0 I&R Pathfinder - 300mp
CP02 Paratroops - 380mp (no thompson)
CP04 M8 Greyhound
CP08 Cluster bombs

That's more of an idea for a mod as nothing radical will happen to USF.

That's more of an idea for a mod as nothing radical will happen to USF.

Sadly, yes I know.

I am not entirely satisfied with the officers but everything else I agree with.

Something else could be done with the officers in my opinion we just have to find the best option.

Sorry for the double post but I just wanted to elaborate further.

One way of doing it as it was suggested was making the officers more like the British ones from CoH, where they're a 1 man squad focused more on utility rather than combat.

So for instance the Lt could be the combat support officer with an aura around it buffing other units, the Captain could be the more defensive oriented officer with a defensive aura of some sort and the Forward retreat point and the Major could have the building supervision instead but recon and artillery as well, make it a risk vs reward unit which is both useful on the frontline and at the base, keeping in mind the risk of course.

I am not entirely satisfied with the officers but everything else I agree with.

Something else could be done with the officers in my opinion we just have to find the best option.

Simply add the ability to promote infantry to LT and Captain.

It could work a bit like refit, the ability is activated by the corresponding tent in the base removing the infantry and returning an officer for the cost difference.

(mechanism can also be used to train doctrinal infantry)

Shared veterancy and passive sprint should be removed from fighting officers.

I think you can make USF competitive again with a pretty straightforward teching cost reshuffle.

• Lieutenant: 200 MP 50 FU -> 280 MP 35 FU
  
• Captain: 200 MP 60 FU -> 280 MP 45 FU
  
• Major: 240 MP -> 160 MP 135 FU
  
  
• Grenade Unlock -> 150 MP, 15 FU (discounted to not further disadvantage grenades)
  
• M20 Utility Car, AAHT, Stuart -> requires Grenades, Racks, or a second officer to build
  

This is essentially what was done with Ostheer in DBP: shift the teching costs around to make the tech fork less painful.

» The total cost to unlock Major is unchanged, as is the unlock cost for any USF light vehicle.

» As the first officer comes out 15 FU sooner, USF is no longer forced into building three Rifleman squads. This allows USF to diversify their builds. Getting their first Thompson Officer out sooner also helps repel early game OKW rushes.

» Double teching becomes a realistic option: getting Lieutenant and Captain will cost you 560 MP 80 FU rather than the 400 MP 110 FU it costs on live. As you're no longer forced to build three rifles before your first officer, it also won't force you to field an excessive number of mainline infantry squads.

Sorry for the double post but I just wanted to elaborate further.

One way of doing it as it was suggested was making the officers more like the British ones from CoH, where they're a 1 man squad focused more on utility rather than combat.

So for instance the Lt could be the combat support officer with an aura around it buffing other units, the Captain could be the more defensive oriented officer with a defensive aura of some sort and the Forward retreat point and the Major could have the building supervision instead but recon and artillery as well, make it a risk vs reward unit which is both useful on the frontline and at the base, keeping in mind the risk of course.

Aura are promoting blob in fine, I'm not fan of it. Now what to do with officers is an open topic, my ideas were mostly elaborated with Elite infantry in mind, to complement them with one or the other officer.

I think you can make USF competitive again with a pretty straightforward teching cost reshuffle.

• Lieutenant: 200 MP 50 FU -> 280 MP 35 FU
  
• Captain: 200 MP 60 FU -> 280 MP 45 FU
  
• Major: 240 MP -> 160 MP 135 FU
  
  
• Grenade Unlock -> 150 MP, 15 FU
  
  • M20 Utility Car, AAHT, Stuart -> requires Grenades, Racks, or a second officer to build
  
  

This is essentially what was done with Ostheer in DBP: shift the teching costs around to make the tech fork less painful.

» The total cost to unlock Major is unchanged, as is the unlock cost for any USF light vehicle.

» The 15 FU reduction to the first two officers makes double teching less painful in terms of fuel, but it no longer confers a hefty manpower advantage.

» As the first officer comes out sooner, USF is no longer forced into building three Rifleman squads. This allows USF to diversify their builds. Getting their first Thompson Officer out sooner also helps repel early game OKW rushes.

Don't really like this, USF LVs come too late in my opinion, they are less effective than other factions counter part, being field earlier is a way to make them work again.

Don't really like this, USF LVs come too late in my opinion, they are less effective than other factions counter part, being field earlier is a way to make them work again.

Removing that would result in USF LVs coming out 15 FU faster than on live, assuming the reshuffle has no extreme effects on early map control. It'd be a neat buff to the sidelined M20 and Stuart, but I think it'd make the AAHT a bit too effective against Ostheer, who need their T2 to fight it.



I'd instead cut the Captain's cost by 10 FU to be the same is Lieutenant: it isn't stronger and shouldn't cost more now the Stuart's a primarily AT vehicle rather than a super T-70. That'd accelerate the Stuart by 10 FU and further reduce the fuel cost of double teching.

That doesn't help the M20 at all, but that one probably needs some rebalancing as a unit.

Simply add the ability to promote infantry to LT and Captain.

It could work a bit like refit, the ability is activated by the corresponding tent in the base removing the infantry and returning an officer for the cost difference.

(mechanism can also be used to train doctrinal infantry)

Shared veterancy and passive sprint should be removed from fighting officers.

Promotion infantry to officers also sounds like a good idea, I agree.

Aura are promoting blob in fine, I'm not fan of it. Now what to do with officers is an open topic, my ideas were mostly elaborated with Elite infantry in mind, to complement them with one or the other officer.



Don't really like this, USF LVs come too late in my opinion, they are less effective than other factions counter part, being field earlier is a way to make them work again.

Alright how about this, you have a limit of 3 Lts which can be "merged" to squads in order to "support" them. They will effectively be squad leaders then.

the tech fuel reduction is a bit too much but nice idea

At the end, first sherman is hitting the field around the same fuel price than today.

10 fuel more if no upgrade, no callin ligth vehicles.
less expensive in case of teching upgrades or/and callin light vehicles.

I'd just like to point out current tech costs per faction (minus starting resources):
Ost: 920/205
OKW: 900/235
Sov: 1005/220
USF: 940/255
UKF: 1160/250

Also, USF and OKW have to pay fuel for healing.

I think it would be a good idea to change costs before trying something drastic. It may seem minor, but the following change brings the total tech cost down to 230 and makes side teching easier.

Grenades: 20
Weapon Racks: 15
LT: 40
CPT: 50
MAJ: 120

I'd just like to point out current tech costs per faction (minus starting resources):
...

Total fuel cost is not really comparable since only UKF and Ostheer have linear tech lines. Soviet UKF and USF are designed to skip techs.

Total fuel cost is not really comparable since only UKF and Ostheer have linear tech lines. Soviet UKF and USF are designed to skip techs.

Not linear isn't equal to total cost.

Total fuel cost is not really comparable since only UKF and Ostheer have linear tech lines. Soviet UKF and USF are designed to skip techs.

I think it's worth bringing up because it shows why USF players have to be more stingy about getting all of the tools their army has to offer. It's not a very big deal for a Soviet player to get T1 and T2, because those tiers are inexpensive, along with the rest of their tech. A USF player who gets their weapon upgrades, ambulance, a lieutenant, and a major has spent 205 fuel. That's the same as an Ostheer player who has everything.

I think it's worth bringing up because it shows why USF players have to be more stingy about getting all of the tools their army has to offer. It's not a very big deal for a Soviet player to get T1 and T2, because those tiers are inexpensive, along with the rest of their tech. A USF player who gets their weapon upgrades, ambulance, a lieutenant, and a major has spent 205 fuel. That's the same as an Ostheer player who has everything.

But that is by faction design...

But that is by faction design...

But up until last December, Wehr's tech cost was 1020/250. Both factions had access to everything if they paid a similar amount.

I'm just saying that USF weird teching is one of their main problems, and I think the solution is to lower the costs a bit.

But up until last December, Wehr's tech cost was 1020/250. Both factions had access to everything if they paid a similar amount.

I'm just saying that USF weird teching is one of their main problems, and I think the solution is to lower the costs a bit.

That would mean that USF get access to everything and the faction would have to be redesign so that either their infantry or the support weapon would need to be toned down.

Not like it was already the case. Or where does come the fact USF was an early dominating faction a year ago to what it is today.