Volks are disgustingly good, need toning down.

Volks are being spammed precisely because they can deal with most threats. That and absolute state of allied MG's

Try the MG34

Three volks and then one piece of each...
Other units might need some buffs though...

You can't only have 3 volks because you get run over lategame if you don't have more volks to rifles/tommies etc.

to me no need to directly nerf volk stats. just put a tech cost to incendary nade and have volk as starting unit. it's enough to fix their op early without hurting mid/late or breaking the faction. it's all about not having a free 300 mp choc troop as starter and not having free tech nade forcing early hospital. volk do not feel op once i survived the early phase of the game. a direct nerf would be too much.

Try the MG34

Try Conscripts in comparsion to Volks

Try Conscripts in comparsion to Volks

So your arguement to nerf volks is make them as bad as the worst mainline DPS unit ingame. I can see this going nowhere.

So your arguement to nerf volks is make them as bad as the worst mainline DPS unit ingame. I can see this going nowhere.

Scroll page back and you'll see my point. Volks make any other OKW unit including elite infantly pointless because it's more cost effective to just spam Volks. It's obvious STG upgrade is to blame to for this BS and the reason it's here is double BARs. Except it made Volks OP against anything else aside of 2xBARmen

Scroll page back and you'll see my point. Volks make any other OKW unit including elite infantly pointless because it's more cost effective to just spam Volks. It's obvious STG upgrade is to blame to for this BS and the reason it's here is double BARs. Except it made Volks OP against anything else aside of 2xBARmen

Obersoldaten still have their place in OKW´s infantry roster. Not sure why they get underrated so much. They are a bit underwhelming until vet 2 but they are still pretty good IMO.

They are needed in games when your Volks aren´t enough to cut it late game vs vetted, upgraded Allied infantry. Volks are strong early but don´t scale as well and need support to hold their own in late game. That´s why there are Obers in OKW T4. Seems pretty fair to me.

I just switched OP's post with Riflemen. Am i a balance forum Expert now?



Riflemen are disgustingly good, need toning down!

They are too cheap, too spammble, consistent damage, they throw those Frag grenades like pro baseball players, plus they make the entire garrison/cover play style look like a joke and toward mid-late game are like terminators. Either do something about the BAR upgrade/Frag nade or make them more expensive to reinforce and call it a day.

pathetic

pathetic

what?

Try Conscripts in comparsion to Volks

Cons win in every fair scenario but long range unless OKW spend ammo for STG.
It has been tested several times after during cons rework.
That while cons cost less to reinforce and as a whole.

Your point ?

Scroll page back and you'll see my point. Volks make any other OKW unit including elite infantly pointless because it's more cost effective to just spam Volks. It's obvious STG upgrade is to blame to for this BS and the reason it's here is double BARs. Except it made Volks OP against anything else aside of 2xBARmen

Oh yeah..nope.

LET'S FINALLY DEBUNK THAT "VOLKS OVERSHADOW INFANTRY" BS
According to GCS2 stats, a total of 187 "elite" okw infantry squads have been built. That's 20% of the infantry built.
That means that every 4 volks an elite infantry squad has been called in/built.
And that doesn't even consider the 240 mg34 that surely shows that volks alone rarely work against allies infantry.

Besides, with your last statement you are implying that stg-less volks can put a fight against penals and cons ppsh, which is wrong.

GCS2 showed that soviets are the strongest faction, being the only one with >50% win rate in any matchup, and that surely volks aren't an issue.

cons beat volks without upgrades? Pretty sure every game since the release of the omw says otherwise but OK... So until okw place their first truck cons are viable against then that's great to know! The problem with "okw has to spend munitions!" and "cons are fine against up upgraded volks" is that the former doesn't matter if you yourself do not have the option to escalate, and there is LITERALLY not a single reason aside from not YET having the munitions to not upgrade your volks to STGs. Not a single reason. There is no trade off no drawback no incentive to not upgrade. At. All. Ever. As obnoxious as double BAR is there is at least a modicum of thought required in getting them.you have to decide when you can spare the fuel (vs decide when you want to start progressing towards tanks) you need to decide to allocate fuel away from a shock unit (vs getting them on the road to said shock unit) then you need to give up map control and pressure by retreating to base (vs being able to upgrade on the front, on the way to the front, at your FRP, while in combat, in the enemies base, on a different map!) then you have to shell out an off map worth of munitions and can still lose the weapons and possibly have to do it again! Volks STG is like the kindergarten of infantry upgrades. You don't have to do a damn thing but show up and get massive benifits with zero drawbacks. While other mainline are taking tests and learning algebra volks are shitting themselves and fingerpainting. Or so to speak. The only way to make the STG any easier would be just to simply have them start with them. It's literally the only way.


Oh and also 5mp per model doesn't mean shit when cons are harder to hit, don't get a vet 1 rec acc buff and have the shittiest support options in the game, with the exception of penals who simply replace cons because cons don't bring anything to the table as support themselves really.

cons beat volks without upgrades?

Cons vs grens is all about RNG and who sniped model first.
Volks have gren DPS, weapon prifle and 20% higher squad health, so its pretty much one sided fight by a long shot, unless cons get lucky and snipe 2 entities fast, which is unlikely.

come on, 5 Men Bren Tommy Blobs are a much bigger Problem

Both OKW and OST have Stock rocket artillery to deal with blobs, blobbing as allies, especially UKF, is extremely unwise. Also Tommy blobs are more expensive both in manpower and munitions and hence should be better. They are both better as they should be and counterable as they should be so I wouldn't say they were a problem at all.

Their veterancy was nerfed and the bonuses are currently lower than other mainline infantry like conscript.

Lmgs for 5 men squad is problematic because the unit's DPS does not drop fast enough when losing models.

Conscript vet is awesome, especially with PPSH's, perhaps it's too good and a problem I don't know. it doesn't make volks not a problem though.
It's the Vet combined with everything else that's the problem.
Osttruppen get MG42s and no one complains about that and they're 6 man squads and not even terrible in cover. I don't mind if Volksgrenadiers become more powerful with an MG34/42 at range and their dps doesn't drop properly, my issue is that assault infantry don't counter them. It makes them much weaker to assault infantry which should counter them. Also STG-44s still have the same problem with the 5 man squad, the only difference being the DPS doesn't drop until the 4th model is dead rather than the 5th.

Also, wiping the vet of Allied infantry is pretty simple as rocket artillery is stock for axis and very effective, wiping veterancy of Volksgrenadiers is not so simple for anyone other than soviets, they are 5 man rather than 4 like Grens which gives them much better survivability. Although you can kill volks pretty easily, especially for USF, you can struggle to get the wipes like Axis and soviets can due to the lack of prevalent allied rocket arty. A decent player will not let you wipe their infantry unless you kill them before they can react i.e.- rocket artillery.

... and there is LITERALLY not a single reason aside from not YET having the munitions to not upgrade your volks to STGs. Not a single reason. There is no trade off no drawback no incentive to not upgrade. At. All. Ever...

Although I do not disagree with post in general, I have to point out that ST44 take all weapon slots (contrary to PPsh/LMG42) the VG can not pick up weapons. Usually I tend to leave 1 VG squad without ST44 in case I come up to a dropped weapon.

...
It's the Vet combined with everything else that's the problem.
...

I was simply pointing out that their vet bonuses are not that great any more.

Actually I would test removing the ST44 upgrade and improving their veterancy. It would also fit them thematically since they represent a mix of green and experienced troops.

Cons vs grens is all about RNG and who sniped model first.
Volks have gren DPS, weapon prifle and 20% higher squad health, so its pretty much one sided fight by a long shot, unless cons get lucky and snipe 2 entities fast, which is unlikely.

Bullshit, volks rifle has 12 damage and less accuracy than grens rifles.

Cons straight up win and has been proved multiple times

Although I do not disagree with post in general, I have to point out that ST44 take all weapon slots (contrary to PPsh/LMG42) the VG can not pick up weapons. Usually I tend to leave 1 VG squad without ST44 in case I come up to a dropped weapon.


I was simply pointing out that their vet bonuses are not that great any more.

Actually I would test removing the ST44 upgrade and improving their veterancy. It would also fit them thematically since they represent a mix of green and experienced troops.

Volksgrenadier division standard 10 men fireteam were issued with 2 of either G43, STG or Mp40. They were pretty much known for enphasizing the use of automatics.

Bullshit, volks rifle has 12 damage and less accuracy than grens rifles.

Cons straight up win and has been proved multiple times

Bullshit, Grenadiers have some of the worst accuracy in the game for bolt actions but the most damage.

Get out of here with your straight up lies.

Volks always win long range against Cons. And if Cons close range against Volks they obviously lose too due to losing models on close up. Heck even if they did beat them STG upgrade makes Cons redundant as they simply lose in every situation, which is why everyone goes Penals vs OKW anyway.

Bullshit, Grenadiers have some of the worst accuracy in the game for bolt actions but the most damage.

Get out of here with your straight up lies.

Grenadiers
Damage per shot: 16
Accuracy: 0.65/0.52

Volks
Damage per shot: 12
Accuracy: 0.62/0.55

Get your facts straight

How does the slightly less accuracy and damage translate to DPS considering the extra model?