Infiltration commandos 3 men at spawn

Does anyone else think that they need to revert this squad to spawning as a 4 or 5 man full health squad from the start? Right now, they're basically just a commando squad that you can call into any building, or from off map, the issue I have with them is that they spawn with only three men.

If I remember, Relic changed it from a 4 man squad to a 5 man squad, but at the same time limited them to spawning with only 3/5 men in the squad, and reduced the price. Right now they're 340 manpower to spawn a 3 man squad. I believe that they should just bump up the cost to 390 and let us spawn them as a 5 man unit like most other infiltration units that spawn with full health. Regular commandos cost 390 so they would be the same price.

No one complains about Fallschirmjagers or Partisans spawning as a full health 4 man squad, what people complained about were infiltration units spawning with the grenade ability not on a cooldown. That was fixed, you can't use grenades right after you spawn infiltration units anymore, but it doesn't make sense to have this handicap on infiltration commandos.

Most of the time I don't even spawn them in buildings because they're simply too weak at 3 men when they spawn resulting in you having to immediately retreat if there's more than 1 squad opposing them in the vicinity. It's just ridiculous that I often just spawn them at my base and immediately have to spend an additional 70mp just to re-enforce them, in addition when you spawn them from an ambient building you're going to have to retreat them to your FHQ or back to base just to get them to their proper squad size wasting a lot of time doing so.

So my suggestion is to just bump up the price to ~390mp like the regular commandos and simply have them spawn as a 5 man squad, or simply revert them to what they were before, a 4 man commando unit and have them spawn full health. It simply doesn't make sense that only infiltration commandos have this weird penalty while no other infiltration units are affected this way. After all, as I said above, it was grenades being the main issue before.

You can't just expect them to come out at 3 men and expect them to take on an army. When they first jump out use it to harass support teams, after that get them to full strength and ambush camo with them. They're one of the best units for doing ambushes.

Falls are paratroopers now, not infiltration. Partisans become near useless aside from their initial shock impact. Commandos remain relevent.

I think another reason it may have been lowered to 3 is so you can't just spawn in a unit and steal a weapon team that maybe you just weren't able to recrew.

The issue before was the they were used to cheese retreating units and could easily kill support teams and crew them. Partisans don’t really compared in any way to commandos imo as they become a mp drain right after they spawn.

It does seem odd in light of the new buffs and utility of stormtroopers being able to crew weapons with 4 men and do all of their upgrading out in the field. 370 mp with less utility and vet required to throw smoke as well. Storms pop at 1 cup earlier cost less and have more abilities at their disposal none requiring veteran ranks, then two on field upgrades. So although I was happy to see the commando restriction on planting demos within capture points I think more is gonna be needed once storms start showing them up as better for cost and initial effect which is meant to be an infiltration units purpose.

They did that, because commandos still start with their stens, all other non partisan infiltrators need to upgrade to smgs.

You can't just expect them to come out at 3 men and expect them to take on an army. When they first jump out use it to harass support teams, after that get them to full strength and ambush camo with them. They're one of the best units for doing ambushes.

Falls are paratroopers now, not infiltration. Partisans become near useless aside from their initial shock impact. Commandos remain relevent.

I think another reason it may have been lowered to 3 is so you can't just spawn in a unit and steal a weapon team that maybe you just weren't able to recrew.

Meh I just spawn them off map to reinforce there and manually infiltrate enemy lines. If you spawn at 3 men behind their lines already, then you lose quite a bit of dps, meaning you should use nades, but nade is (completely rightfully so, mind you, for real) on cooldown, so you have to wait anyway. At that point you might as well capitalize on the element of surprise with full dps and spawn them offmap. It annoys me that they spawn offmap at 3 men (making them one of the most expensive infantry squads in the game to initially produce at 370 plus 35x2 manpower) for absolutely no reason though, especially when new stormtroopers spawn at full size even from buildings even though they do have to upgrade mp40s (for free).

Meh I just spawn them off map to reinforce there and manually infiltrate enemy lines. If you spawn at 3 men behind their lines already, then you lose quite a bit of dps, meaning you should use nades, but nade is (completely rightfully so, mind you, for real) on cooldown, so you have to wait anyway. At that point you might as well capitalize on the element of surprise with full dps and spawn them offmap. It annoys me that they spawn offmap at 3 men (making them one of the most expensive infantry squads in the game to initially produce at 370 plus 35x2 manpower) for absolutely no reason though, especially when new stormtroopers spawn at full size even from buildings even though they do have to upgrade mp40s (for free).

If commandos spawned with rifles instead of stens then you could actually compare them with storm troopers, they do not and thus the comparison is misleading. Both Storm troopers and JLIR carry very little punch when they spawn since both come with rifles equipped.

If commandos spawned with rifles instead of stens then you could actually compare them with storm troopers, they do not and thus the comparison is misleading. Both Storm troopers and JLIR carry very little punch when they spawn since both come with rifles equipped.

True true. But commandos spawn with 3 men. I actually wish they spawned with rifles instead of stens and 60% of a squad but it is true that they aren’t comparable, something I did articulate. It’s also an irrelevant detail when they spawn off map (as it’s not like there’s going to be enemy units in your base for your commandos to surprise), which was what I was discussing. Not actual infiltration spawns. Sorry if it wasn’t clear but my original point was it’s silly that spawning them off map still only spawns them as 3 men, which, again, makes them one of the most (or the most, but idk for sure) expensive squad to initially produce in the game, even costing more than a lot of tanks.

Another thing to note is that JLIs are very good at killing snipers. Pop them out and you’re almost guaranteed to get at least a couple rifle hits and then the g43 crit will finish it off at 70% health or whatever. Other than that, yes, the surprise factor of JLIs isn’t very high but they are I think actually one of the only infiltration squads that infiltration spawns at full combat power.

True true. But commandos spawn with 3 men...

I have suggested on many occasion that infiltration units should be available in two ways.

Build able from HQ at normal price and spawning from ambient buildings with paying a premium for the instant production and on field deployment.

Think that would fix the issues with infiltration Commandos.

Commandos might as well receive the Stormtrooper treatment, spawning at full strength but with rifles with a free upgrade to Stens. This would solve all problems at once. No ludicrous MP cost, no cheesy retreat wipes. Infiltrating behind enemy lines at full strength (upgrading to Stens) would require planning and cunning.

Commandos might as well receive the Stormtrooper treatment, spawning at full strength but with rifles with a free upgrade to Stens. This would solve all problems at once. No ludicrous MP cost, no cheesy retreat wipes. Infiltrating behind enemy lines at full strength (upgrading to Stens) would require planning and cunning.

Sounds cool

Commandos might as well receive the Stormtrooper treatment, spawning at full strength but with rifles with a free upgrade to Stens. This would solve all problems at once. No ludicrous MP cost, no cheesy retreat wipes. Infiltrating behind enemy lines at full strength (upgrading to Stens) would require planning and cunning.

I believe that would also make commando weapon teams, manned by infiltration commandos, armed with their default rifles instead of STENs. Personally I like this as a change, except I would give them M1 carbines instead of Lee-Enfields as it is more suitable as a commando weapon and it is highly likely that special troops like Commandos would have access to US weapons like the M1 carbine. This way infiltration commandos get a mid range weapon that isn’t OP and can still upgrade to their really strong SMGs later. When manning a weapon team they would revert to their Carbines and thus be less dangerous to flanking squads. Additionally, and I think most importantly, it would allow 5 man infiltration commandos to be sneaky, dangerous and still survivable while not being too strong. This would encourage aggressive commando spawning because they would be survivesnle at 5 men, but not be too strong with just M1 Carbines.

Basically it’s a win-win. Axis doesn’t get clobbered by OP commandos popping out of buildings, but Allies still gets to try commando pops without being heavily punished by the risk.

Also if you want to make the infiltration commandos even more interesting, you call them SAS infiltration squads or SOE infiltration squads and make them upgrade from M1 Carbines to having three or four Thompsons plus Carbines. This would make them thematically different but still filling the same role as they currently do, while also satisfying the desire for Commandos to have tommy guns.

(Historically Commandos really favored the Thompson, although for them it was usually the earlier M1928A model, not the M1A1 in game and it was primarily because the Thompson was commercially available from the US at the time and STENs we’re still not yet in mass production. )

I believe that would also make commando weapon teams,...

Since commandos have access to 2 "super brens" having M1 rifles or Thompson (with profiles similar to USF ones) will simply make them OP.

Being able to built from HQ for a normal price is a simpler solution.

I have suggested on many occasion that infiltration units should be available in two ways.

Build able from HQ at normal price and spawning from ambient buildings with paying a premium for the instant production and on field deployment.

Think that would fix the issues with infiltration Commandos.

I like that. I think having rifles upon infiltration spawn is a better solution than a 3 man squad though. That way the infiltration spawn still takes planning and thinking ahead but doesn’t punish the British player for using it.

I believe that would also make commando weapon teams, manned by infiltration commandos, armed with their default rifles instead of STENs. Personally I like this as a change, except I would give them M1 carbines instead of Lee-Enfields as it is more suitable as a commando weapon and it is highly likely that special troops like Commandos would have access to US weapons like the M1 carbine. This way infiltration commandos get a mid range weapon that isn’t OP and can still upgrade to their really strong SMGs later. When manning a weapon team they would revert to their Carbines and thus be less dangerous to flanking squads. Additionally, and I think most importantly, it would allow 5 man infiltration commandos to be sneaky, dangerous and still survivable while not being too strong. This would encourage aggressive commando spawning because they would be survivesnle at 5 men, but not be too strong with just M1 Carbines.

Basically it’s a win-win. Axis doesn’t get clobbered by OP commandos popping out of buildings, but Allies still gets to try commando pops without being heavily punished by the risk.

Also if you want to make the infiltration commandos even more interesting, you call them SAS infiltration squads or SOE infiltration squads and make them upgrade from M1 Carbines to having three or four Thompsons plus Carbines. This would make them thematically different but still filling the same role as they currently do, while also satisfying the desire for Commandos to have tommy guns.

(Historically Commandos really favored the Thompson, although for them it was usually the earlier M1928A model, not the M1A1 in game and it was primarily because the Thompson was commercially available from the US at the time and STENs we’re still not yet in mass production. )

I like the idea of the SAS infiltration squad, but giving them M1 carbines with the same stats as paratroopers and rangers upon spawning from infiltration would still be a bit strong (keep in mind that these M1 carbines are different from the rear echelon ones and are straight up better than the riflemen’s garands). I would suggest still making them spawn with Lee Enfields, which are worse on the move and shoot slower, and then give them an upgrade that gives them 3 Thompsons and 2 M1 carbines, but that locks out brens because their brens would be OP in conjunction with Thompsons.

Since commandos have access to 2 "super brens" having M1 rifles or Thompson (with profiles similar to USF ones) will simply make them OP.

Being able to built from HQ for a normal price is a simpler solution.

Well if they were given Thompsons it should lock out both weapon slots assuming there were 3 Thompsons and 2 carbines in the squad total.

TL; DR of the various opinions in my responses:

Make commandos buildable from HQ at normal cost as vipper said, but let infiltration spawns spawn at 5 men with Lee enfields and have a free upgrade to stens.

Alternatively, and (IMO) more interetingly, as GI John 412 wrote, rename them as SAS infiltration squads and give them Lee enfields upon spawning (including from infiltration) and give them an upgrade for like 60 muni that gives them 3 Thompsons and 2 M1 carbines and locks out both weapon slots. Spawning from infiltration with 5 M1 carbines would be a bit OP though.

I like that. I think having rifles upon infiltration spawn is a better solution than a 3 man squad though. That way the infiltration spawn still takes planning and thinking ahead but doesn’t punish the British player for using it.


I like the idea of the SAS infiltration squad, but giving them M1 carbines with the same stats as paratroopers and rangers upon spawning from infiltration would still be a bit strong (keep in mind that these M1 carbines are different from the rear echelon ones and are straight up better than the riflemen’s garands). I would suggest still making them spawn with Lee Enfields, which are worse on the move and shoot slower, and then give them an upgrade that gives them 3 Thompsons and 2 M1 carbines, but that locks out brens because their brens would be OP in conjunction with Thompsons.


Well if they were given Thompsons it should lock out both weapon slots assuming there were 3 Thompsons and 2 carbines in the squad total.

TL; DR of the various opinions in my responses:

Make commandos buildable from HQ at normal cost as vipper said, but let infiltration spawns spawn at 5 men with Lee enfields and have a free upgrade to stens.

Alternatively, and (IMO) more interetingly, as GI John 412 wrote, rename them as SAS infiltration squads and give them Lee enfields upon spawning (including from infiltration) and give them an upgrade for like 60 muni that gives them 3 Thompsons and 2 M1 carbines and locks out both weapon slots. Spawning from infiltration with 5 M1 carbines would be a bit OP though.

I don’t really think they would be OP with Carbines to be honest. But it would be good to check the stats on that before I make any grand declarations. Lol

I don’t know how to pull stats, could someone compare Commando STENs to Paratrooper M1 Carbines to RE M1 Carbines to Lee Enfields to Paratrooper Thompsons? I know that’s a tall order, but I’m sure that there’s some combination of 5 rifles that would roughly equal 3 commando STENs at close range. It’s ok if they’re better at long range, that just makes the idea of upgrading them less of a no-brainer and more of a tactical choice. (Should I go Carbines and BRENs or get the SMGs? Maybe stealthy PIATs with Carbines? One of each, PIAT and BREN? Should I use the munitions on something else entirely? Etc.)

I don’t really think they would be OP with Carbines to be honest. But it would be good to check the stats on that before I make any grand declarations. Lol

I don’t know how to pull stats, could someone compare Commando STENs to Paratrooper M1 Carbines to RE M1 Carbines to Lee Enfields to Paratrooper Thompsons? I know that’s a tall order, but I’m sure that there’s some combination of 5 rifles that would roughly equal 3 commando STENs at close range. It’s ok if they’re better at long range, that just makes the idea of upgrading them less of a no-brainer and more of a tactical choice. (Should I go Carbines and BRENs or get the SMGs? Maybe stealthy PIATs with Carbines? One of each, PIAT and BREN? Should I use the munitions on something else entirely? Etc.)

So uhhh, Para carbines are much better than RE carbines...for perspective, they're also better 1 for 1 than rifleman garands. Para carbines aren't better at long range compared to lee enfields, but I think most would agree that para carbines are still just better overall. I won't compare them to silenced stens or thompsons since I wouldnt say its a comparison that adds much given the previous information.

All said, if their weapons were any stronger at range than RE carbines (and even then...), their DPS would go from insane to broken. Of course, there are mitigating factors in the issue of why rifle + bren armed commandos may not be used anyway, but it's probably best to avoid encountering a potential problem to begin with.

Finding a balance point for rifles on commandos if they did ever get them and spawn full size wouldn’t be challenging. They cost more than stormtroopers and have less utility so their stats for combat should remain above storms even on spawn. From the patch I don’t believe storms have that bad of a rifle stat themselves not sure what their present values are compared to gren K98.

I don’t really think they would be OP with Carbines to be honest. .....

try this:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7gwy65JLbSRMEJ3M2ZPandMMW8/view

Finding a balance point for rifles on commandos if they did ever get them and spawn full size wouldn’t be challenging.

The best approach would probably be to just give them tommy rifles and nerf their commando brens.

try this:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7gwy65JLbSRMEJ3M2ZPandMMW8/view

Tightrope actually looked into getting the spreadsheet actual hosting, so no downloads needed now!

https://coh2db.com/stats/