tellers could deal 320 damage and a random crit on top of engine critical? its a buff late game but a nerf mid game. keeps em unique (although the only detonating on vehcles is already pretty strong)
however it remains a buff to the stuart who can self heal, granted it would have to do it 2x now....
Teller mines and OHKs
1 Oct 2018, 15:04 PM
#101
Posts: 5279
#stalinwept
1 Oct 2018, 15:47 PM
#102
1 
Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4
I don’t see how the answer to something strong in the meta is literally just OHK. I don’t think it’d be gamebreaking so much as less frustrating and cheesy to make tellers not OHK 60-70 fuel light vehicles. IMO it’d be fair if it left the vehicle with engine damage and enough health to die to a faust.
Despite the fact that it’s much easier to sweep for tellers, losing a light in the midgame to tellers is much worse than losing one of your six infantry squads to a demo. And demos have been nerfed so hard that you’d have to be senile to walk over one with infantry (they literally get countered by a moving and due to small arms) because people said it was cheesy and stupid to lose a squad to one click. You don’t even have to click on a teller to detonate it.
You will see a t-70 in every soviet matchup, and a puma 4/5 times to counter it. Nerfing the teller would buff the t-70 and indirectly make the puma even more necessary as a LV counter for Ostheer. Nerfing the teller would negatively impact the meta and build diversity.
I would like to see the OHK removed from the teller. Soviets and Ostheer are fairly evenly matched right now, and both exploit light vehicles as a significant part of their meta. The meta balance right now means you shouldn't just change the teller without also readjusting other light vehicles. I'd be all for making the teller not OHK the t-70, AEC, and stuart if the t-70 and flame halftrack damage on retreat was toned down.
Tobis "Complete Throw"
Someone asked what my avatar was from... I really don't know.
Defeated Paula and knocked him out of 2v2 Anniversary Cup
Someone asked what my avatar was from... I really don't know.
Defeated Paula and knocked him out of 2v2 Anniversary Cup
1 Oct 2018, 23:07 PM
#103
Posts: 3053
You will see a t-70 in every soviet matchup, and a puma 4/5 times to counter it. Nerfing the teller would buff the t-70 and indirectly make the puma even more necessary as a LV counter for Ostheer. Nerfing the teller would negatively impact the meta and build diversity.
I would like to see the OHK removed from the teller. Soviets and Ostheer are fairly evenly matched right now, and both exploit light vehicles as a significant part of their meta. The meta balance right now means you shouldn't just change the teller without also readjusting other light vehicles. I'd be all for making the teller not OHK the t-70, AEC, and stuart if the t-70 and flame halftrack damage on retreat was toned down.
So therefore it should be a problem of those units and not of the mines. I see what you’re saying and agree with the sentiment for sure, so the solution is toning down both in the same patch at the same time, not just not nerfing tellers but also not just nerfing one and leaving the other either.
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1 Oct 2018, 23:31 PM
#104
Posts: 1979
You will see a t-70 in every soviet matchup, and a puma 4/5 times to counter it. Nerfing the teller would buff the t-70 and indirectly make the puma even more necessary as a LV counter for Ostheer. Nerfing the teller would negatively impact the meta and build diversity.
I would like to see the OHK removed from the teller. Soviets and Ostheer are fairly evenly matched right now, and both exploit light vehicles as a significant part of their meta. The meta balance right now means you shouldn't just change the teller without also readjusting other light vehicles. I'd be all for making the teller not OHK the t-70, AEC, and stuart if the t-70 and flame halftrack damage on retreat was toned down.
Hmm now thats a convincing argument... i concur it would ruin the balance between sov and ost and moreoften than not force a panic puma leading to monotonous strategies...provided
1. Tellers are used alot in both high and low level games
2. High level sov players playing more cautiously with the T70 against wehrmacht than vs okw at flanks (which would be a sign of a fear of tellers)
3. Heavy engine damage doesnt convince people to use an AT gun over a puma...
If all 3 premises are correct then yes nerfing tellers will break the balance
2 Oct 2018, 16:51 PM
#105
Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6
I think Tobis is right and that the core of the T-70 balance problem is its ability to wipe units on retreat on top of being able to dislodge infantry across the map. The wiping is what makes the T-70 so dangerous.
Toning this down (and the flame 251's damage against retreats too while we're at it) would probably be enough to compensate for the change to the teller mine removing its OHK.
Toning this down (and the flame 251's damage against retreats too while we're at it) would probably be enough to compensate for the change to the teller mine removing its OHK.
2 Oct 2018, 17:10 PM
#106
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
You will see a t-70 in every soviet matchup, and a puma 4/5 times to counter it. Nerfing the teller would buff the t-70 and indirectly make the puma even more necessary as a LV counter for Ostheer. Nerfing the teller would negatively impact the meta and build diversity.
I would like to see the OHK removed from the teller. Soviets and Ostheer are fairly evenly matched right now, and both exploit light vehicles as a significant part of their meta. The meta balance right now means you shouldn't just change the teller without also readjusting other light vehicles. I'd be all for making the teller not OHK the t-70, AEC, and stuart if the t-70 and flame halftrack damage on retreat was toned down.
This only applies to 1v1 which very few people are actually still playing so I don´t think it´s the best benchmark. No one gets panic Pumas in 2v2 unless they are heavily losing. You can counter T70s rather easy with At-guns and mines since the movement is much more predictable and you usually only fight for a few key locations.
3 Oct 2018, 15:09 PM
#107
Posts: 518
Because being able to win a match instantly via a T70 hitting a teller just isnt balanced at all
How likely is it to get hit by a teller? How likely is it to get hit by an old demo?
The one is mostly on roads or narrow-passpoints on therefore easy avoidable(and sweepable) the other one could be used effectively almost everywhere and was even with sweepers hard to counter without loosing models or even troops ... and was decent against vehicles too
Do you even play as the soviets? Do you understand how useless the demo is now?
I do. The question is if you do even play axis. Because what you said so far is basically: "Nerf Tellers because OHK and bring back old Demos because I can't easy kill 2 squads with it anymore"
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
Playing with randoms
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
The idea that the Jackson needed ANY nerfing is so laughable. It only serves ONE task, how dare it be good at that. If it were a good against infantry like the Panther, King Tiger, Panzer IV, Jagtiger, Elefant, I could see how it might be a problem and need a nerf but it's not
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
I don't play this version of EZ mode very often because it's so boringly simple. But it is funny to see the Axis circle jerk with people complaining that the one faction with every crutch in the book is some how underpowered lol.
The idea that the Jackson needed ANY nerfing is so laughable. It only serves ONE task, how dare it be good at that. If it were a good against infantry like the Panther, King Tiger, Panzer IV, Jagtiger, Elefant, I could see how it might be a problem and need a nerf but it's not
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
u deserve to lose if u don't have an Ele when there's an ISU.
Just stay out of topics u have no knowledge of, Latch.
Ranked, I only play USF. Wouldn't be caught dead playing Nazis with some sort of record being taken
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you, and wouldn't be surprised to be hit again, but I'm fed up with this bullshit and honestly, the sole fact that I'm not permad is what keeps me here having discussions about the game I like and yes, I do question myself why I still go back here to this free range insane asylum so often.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
3 Oct 2018, 15:18 PM
#108
Posts: 518
At 65 mu and self revealing it better have potential..
You didn't read my post at all did you?
I wasn't complaining about Demos versatility but pointed out why demos should not be made less visible.
I would put money on nearly any Soviet player being willing to trade the garbage that is a demo charge for a way to lock down flanks that also happens to be cheaper...
If soviets only also had mines which could be triggered by infantry ...
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
Playing with randoms
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
The idea that the Jackson needed ANY nerfing is so laughable. It only serves ONE task, how dare it be good at that. If it were a good against infantry like the Panther, King Tiger, Panzer IV, Jagtiger, Elefant, I could see how it might be a problem and need a nerf but it's not
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
I don't play this version of EZ mode very often because it's so boringly simple. But it is funny to see the Axis circle jerk with people complaining that the one faction with every crutch in the book is some how underpowered lol.
The idea that the Jackson needed ANY nerfing is so laughable. It only serves ONE task, how dare it be good at that. If it were a good against infantry like the Panther, King Tiger, Panzer IV, Jagtiger, Elefant, I could see how it might be a problem and need a nerf but it's not
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
u deserve to lose if u don't have an Ele when there's an ISU.
Just stay out of topics u have no knowledge of, Latch.
Ranked, I only play USF. Wouldn't be caught dead playing Nazis with some sort of record being taken
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you, and wouldn't be surprised to be hit again, but I'm fed up with this bullshit and honestly, the sole fact that I'm not permad is what keeps me here having discussions about the game I like and yes, I do question myself why I still go back here to this free range insane asylum so often.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
3 Oct 2018, 15:24 PM
#109
Posts: 1527
Permanently BannedGbem just admitted to being mainly a 4v4 player. You know CoH2 was NEVER balanced around 4v4. It's good to hear that you've transitioned yourself to play some 1v1 where the REAL players are at. Yes offense, to the players that main 4v4. Maybe then your views of the game won't be so distorted.
Mr. Matrix is right. Though losing a light vehicle is more expensive than losing a squad, it's far less likely to lose the vehicle to a teller than losing a squad to a capping circle demo.
Mr. Matrix is right. Though losing a light vehicle is more expensive than losing a squad, it's far less likely to lose the vehicle to a teller than losing a squad to a capping circle demo.
"I wish THQ was still alive and made CoH2. Ostheer for life."
PLAYERCARD: https://www.coh2.org/ladders/playercard/steamid/76561198287328305
PLAYERCARD: https://www.coh2.org/ladders/playercard/steamid/76561198287328305
3 Oct 2018, 15:29 PM
#110
Posts: 1979
Gbem just admitted to being mainly a 4v4 player. You know CoH2 was NEVER balanced around 4v4. It's good to hear that you've transitioned yourself to play some 1v1 where the REAL players are at. Yes offense, to the players that main 4v4. Maybe then your views of the game won't be so distorted.
Mr. Matrix is right. Though losing a light vehicle is more expensive than losing a squad, it's far less likely to lose the vehicle to a teller than losing a squad to a capping circle demo.
the majority of my games... around 1000+ games are in 4v4s but i have considerable 1v1 experience... id be willing to give you a firsthand demonstration if you so wish...
also the only one who has a distorted view here is the one with the IGN of FanaticallyFuriousFuhrer.... which eyy presto turns out to be you... i bet you are just one of those 1000+ rank noobs screaming about balance like a little kid arent ya?
mr matrix has an ostwind in his profile picture and has been accused of bias several times..
3 Oct 2018, 15:31 PM
#111
Posts: 1979
You didn't read my post at all did you?
I wasn't complaining about Demos versatility but pointed out why demos should not be made less visible.
If soviets only also had mines which could be triggered by infantry ...
demos are entirely useless atm if you think they shouldnt be made less visible then you are definitely biased...
AHAHAHAHAHHAA the TM-33 is a waste against infantry...
3 Oct 2018, 16:17 PM
#112
Posts: 1979
How likely is it to get hit by a teller? How likely is it to get hit by an old demo?
The one is mostly on roads or narrow-passpoints on therefore easy avoidable(and sweepable) the other one could be used effectively almost everywhere and was even with sweepers hard to counter without loosing models or even troops ... and was decent against vehicles too
I do. The question is if you do even play axis. Because what you said so far is basically: "Nerf Tellers because OHK and bring back old Demos because I can't easy kill 2 squads with it anymore"
1. both are very likely but the being hit by the demo usually occurs at cap points not flanks or chokepoints... most of the time sweepers always clear those out... cap points on the other hand especially VPs.... well thats a different story
2. i play as OST... does that answer your question?
3. did i ever say bring back the old demo? because your arguing with your own stupidity at the moment... i was aiming for a slight teller rebalance but you have not once given a convincing argument
you know if you werent completely braindead and biased would have made a much more convincing argument like tobis who actually points out potential changes in meta over bitching about how axis must be number 1...
3 Oct 2018, 16:21 PM
#113
Posts: 4183 | Subs: 4
The new demo sure was useless in GCS2 when it got free wipes behind buildings when a squad decided to get inside.....
3 Oct 2018, 16:23 PM
#114
Posts: 1979
The new demo sure was useless in GCS2 when it got free wipes behind buildings when a squad decided to get inside.....
i find it inconsistent at destroying buildings... some it oneshots others it doesnt... not exactly sure what makes up this trend...
3 Oct 2018, 16:40 PM
#115
1 Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4
i find it inconsistent at destroying buildings... some it oneshots others it doesnt... not exactly sure what makes up this trend...
I think it will crit all the units in the building even if it doesn't collapse, but could be wrong. Destroying the actual building is like any other explosive where it needs to take out enough walls to lower the health. If you put it on an already destroyed side of the building it wont do as much damage.
Tobis "Complete Throw"
Someone asked what my avatar was from... I really don't know.
Defeated Paula and knocked him out of 2v2 Anniversary Cup
Someone asked what my avatar was from... I really don't know.
Defeated Paula and knocked him out of 2v2 Anniversary Cup
3 Oct 2018, 16:48 PM
#116
Posts: 104
if i spend 50 munis to make a spot on the map deadly to your vehicles, a spot of the map representing 0.01% of the total map area, and you still hit the mine, i feel you deserve to loose your vehicle.
dont push whitout sweeping, its that simple. if the mine was not there to kill your tank, you would have followed my squad to base and killed it.
dont push whitout sweeping, its that simple. if the mine was not there to kill your tank, you would have followed my squad to base and killed it.
3 Oct 2018, 18:15 PM
#117
Posts: 1289
if i spend 50 munis to make a spot on the map deadly to your vehicles, a spot of the map representing 0.01% of the total map area, and you still hit the mine, i feel you deserve to loose your vehicle.
dont push whitout sweeping, its that simple. if the mine was not there to kill your tank, you would have followed my squad to base and killed it.
Where is your at gun in this scenario? Or other at options such as snares and shrecks? Only if your squad is completly isolated does this scenario apply.
90 muni on a obvious location on the map capable off wiping 1 of your 4 infantry squads in an instant wich needs a second click. Is no excuse not to sweep and clear or avoid once detected.
3 Oct 2018, 18:37 PM
#118
Posts: 518
2. i play as OST... does that answer your question?
Could I see your playercard ... or at least your real in game name?
3. did i ever say bring back the old demo? because your arguing with your own stupidity at the moment...
soo lets bring back the old demo and make it even?
hence why it was nerfed? the current demo is soo useless it cant even kill a grenadier squad...
i was aiming for a slight teller rebalance but you have not once given a convincing argument
you know
Teller is already easy to avoid, costs lots of ammo and is one of the few options you have when it comes to fight T 70 as OST ... and it is not mobile like satchel.
But if you want to make the Teller only deal 99% damage to T70 but instead do critical engine damage to tanks, then go ahead
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
Playing with randoms
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
The idea that the Jackson needed ANY nerfing is so laughable. It only serves ONE task, how dare it be good at that. If it were a good against infantry like the Panther, King Tiger, Panzer IV, Jagtiger, Elefant, I could see how it might be a problem and need a nerf but it's not
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
I don't play this version of EZ mode very often because it's so boringly simple. But it is funny to see the Axis circle jerk with people complaining that the one faction with every crutch in the book is some how underpowered lol.
The idea that the Jackson needed ANY nerfing is so laughable. It only serves ONE task, how dare it be good at that. If it were a good against infantry like the Panther, King Tiger, Panzer IV, Jagtiger, Elefant, I could see how it might be a problem and need a nerf but it's not
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
u deserve to lose if u don't have an Ele when there's an ISU.
Just stay out of topics u have no knowledge of, Latch.
Ranked, I only play USF. Wouldn't be caught dead playing Nazis with some sort of record being taken
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you, and wouldn't be surprised to be hit again, but I'm fed up with this bullshit and honestly, the sole fact that I'm not permad is what keeps me here having discussions about the game I like and yes, I do question myself why I still go back here to this free range insane asylum so often.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
3 Oct 2018, 19:32 PM
#119
Posts: 3053
Could I see your playercard ... or at least your real in game name?
Teller is already easy to avoid, costs lots of ammo and is one of the few options you have when it comes to fight T 70 as OST ... and it is not mobile like satchel.
But if you want to make the Teller only deal 99% damage to T70 but instead do critical engine damage to tanks, then go ahead
Old demo costed way more and it’s not like it took up the entire cap circle. I used to just put them on the middle of out of the way points because people would get lazy and just right click the point, making all their units bunch up on it. That or I’d stick it on the most likely angle they’d come from and try and detonate it while they’re still walking. If you come in from a different angle or just make it so one guy stands on the point instead of clumping the whole squad up demos are just as avoidable as tellers.
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3 Oct 2018, 19:58 PM
#120
Posts: 5279
You didn't read my post at all did you?
I wasn't complaining about Demos versatility but pointed out why demos should not be made less visible.
I read it, I was agreeing with you. For the garbage they are at literally anything at least they have utility...
If soviets only also had mines which could be triggered by infantry ...
That's the thing tho, triggered by infantry is a drawback. You don't need minesweeper everywhere to sweep for Soviet mines, just some of those pios that already provide recon. If you find one you pay 50mp, try that with a CE and you lose your T70. Hell I've had fleeing weapon crews detonate Soviet mines. Kill the zis and have it sweep for mines for me! Dead men no less!
#stalinwept
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