Feedback for Commander Revamppatch

Maybe instead of giving retreat point to Comissar and wasting a squad with lots of utility like that you could give retreat point to ZiS-6 truck?

Normally this truck would act the same way Opel Blitz does from Firestorm - you can ride in it and reinforce from it, but at certain CP it unlocks FRP and allows you to either spawn medics (cannot be controlled, like HQ medics) while its in immobile or just heal nearby units like USF ambulance. If you deactive FRP it goes back on long CD like Major FRP and medics run away

I don't know where you got that from but I suggested something similar not long ago.

However, that would mean another call in so something will need to be either replaced or combined.

And with that comes the fact that I think the Ost commanders are left down in the mud, only the 5th man squad upgrade is new and unique, Stormtroopers are present in 2 other doctrines and aren't generally worth it right now, Arty officer is in I don't know how many other doctrines.

Forward Supply Station and Urban Assault Panzergrenadiers would be fine new and unique additions to German Infantry.

Then both Armies would have a forward retreat and some brand new units to use, win-win.

Wouldn't mind Ost also getting that repair pioneer upgrade for their bunkers as well since they're basically stuck with the shittiest repair rates in the entire game.

Give Elite Armor the Hetzer. Keep Signal relay, but merge emergency repairs with HEAT since they both add abilities to tanks. EZPZ

AT Hetzer? Would be cool. This merge is a nice way to open up another ability slot. If AT Hetzer is a no-go, I'd keep suggesting either a Panzerfusiliers or Panzergrenadiers call-in.

Pgrens have the advantage of offering OKW a unique hand-held AT option to fight TDs while Panzerfusiliers would give a nice opportunity to fix their CP requirement (which Breakthrough would also benefit from) and to see them used more often.

AT Hetzer? Would be cool. This merge is a nice way to open up another ability slot. If AT Hetzer is a no-go, I'd keep suggesting either a Panzerfusiliers or Panzergrenadiers call-in.

Pgrens have the advantage of offering OKW a unique hand-held AT option to fight TDs while Panzerfusiliers would give a nice opportunity to fix their CP requirement (which Breakthrough would also benefit from) and to see them used more often.

Yeah the AT Hetzer. Either as a call-in or buildable from the HQ when you have any two trucks setup.

If they go the call-in infantry route, I'd prefer to see Panzerfusiliers since PGrens overlap with Sturms too much in my opinion.

I, for one, am against AT Hetzer, mainly for the reason in that it presents little unique role. For OKW AT options, there's Puma, Jagdpanzer IV, and Panther. The AT Hetzer would be almost entirely outperformed by the Jagdpanzer IV in practically all stats.

I also dislike the M10 Wolverine for much the same reason. I think that Wolverine/Jackson should've had the same HP to begin with for realism reasons but I get that in-game the M10 had to have some sort of advantage. Now, though, that the M36 Jackson also takes 4 hits, there's not really a reason to choose M10 over M36.

The only potential upside to the AT Hetzer is the flexibility of going both MedHQ and MechHQ and still have a stopgap, but I also dislike the idea of having 2 casemate call-ins (Sturmtiger being the other one.)

Just to throw out an idea to solve the dilemma with Siignal delay OR call-in unit:

- Replace Signal Relay with the 223- Radio scout car and GIVE THE CAR the vehicle detection ability. That would fit in extremely well to the actual role of the 223 in the war, players who like signal relay can use it and the others would get a decent call-in unit to give the doctrine more punch in the early stage of the game!

Lots of good feedback guys.

Regarding the Hetzer ideas: Major overlap issues with JP4 aside, it's not something we are able to tackle with current limitations.

However, we really like Smartie's idea for a 223 in this doctrine. Apparently, a model exists. Here are a few designs we are thinking about.


1) Regular 223. This unit costs approx 250/ 20. Combat ability similar to a 221. Signal Relay and healing are upgrades, which can be mutually exclusive. Approximately 50MP + 10/15 fuel extra each

2) Stock signal 223, same combat ability. Signal relay comes as stock. Healing is a purchasable upgrade. Base cost 250/ 25. Healing cost 100 MP - 15 fuel

3) Full 223: Comes with signal and healing as stock. This option would likely cost Mp 325 Fuel 35/40

All options would be cp1.

Base signal range would be approx 100, with increased range with vet.

Additional Notes: We envisage signal relay being a passive in this instance.

There is also the advantage that there is counterplay to this version of Signal relay, by hunting the 223. Some people do not like the current version due to no counterplay/ interactivity.

Yes, in isolation, the signal relay itself will be weaker. However the trade off is this could be a cool utility vehicle, with good early game dps.

It would offer a more interactive and less cheesy way of using signal relay, whilst also offering t3 OKW builds a different form of healing.

Cost and pop cap 100% subject to change



Thoughts?

Some concept and ideas of icons for new soviet abillities:

Infantry buff from KV-8/2 (a.k.a. Soviet combined arms)
To prevent the endless usage of "For Mother Russia" icon, i've created new variant KV-8 and KV-2


M-42 canister shot
To make it match with AP rounds it should use this ingame icon:


Currently it used by Jagdtiger super-piercing abillity, but this problem can be solved by 17-pounder shell icon for the same abillity.

adding a 223 is pretty much a straight up nerf to elite armored. you have to not only pay manpower and fuel but it also takes up pop cap, which further decreases manpower income, and then the signal relay ability itself will probably cost munitions? and have limited range? how is this better than having a 45 muni ability that shows u the location of every vehicle on the map

adding a 223 is pretty much a straight up nerf to elite armored. you have to not only pay manpower and fuel but it also takes up pop cap, which further decreases manpower income, and then the signal relay ability itself will probably cost munitions? and have limited range? how is this better than having a 45 muni ability that shows u the location of every vehicle on the map

I was just about to post that, there is no need to rework whats not broken. Why would I want a scout car that eats popcap and costs me fuel and mp to just use Relay, plus "healing" 223 is just silly

223 naysayers are forgetting one thing. At CP1, the use of a super-kubel when there are relatively few counters on the field could be pretty powerful.

My idea of a powerful, relevant 223: Passively reveal vehicles within normal sight radius. Signal Relay comes as a stock 223 ability. Signal relay boosts it to map-wide like current ability. Suppressive Fire ala Bren Carrier as vet 1 ability.

I agree that healing seems strange though, since Sturmpios can already do that.

It's creative certainly, but the 223 idea sounds like a straight up nerf to the commander. Since Hetzer isn't going to happen, I'd just like to see Panzerfuss added instead.

Lots of good feedback guys.

If you give the NVKD commander a KV1 I promise I'll buy every single decal in the in-game store.

I have bad premonition that balance team is doing exact same mistake from last year, Osttrupen got hit with EXACT same thing going on with Elite Armored now, replacing working stuff with unneeded/semi-useless abilties

The 223 sounds interesting, but you'd have to be careful not to make it worse than Signal Relay.

Have the 223 work like Tank Hunter Sections used to (Signal Relay with a limited range but passive) and surely that's a buff?

You'd still be forcing an OKW player to spend MP/Fuel, and more importantly limited popcap, just to access signal relay which is honestly fine as-is in my opinion.

The ability that should be re-worked is the self-repair. Compare it with Soviet or Brit self-repair abilities and the flaws become obvious. Merge it with another commander ability or just straight up replace it with call-in infantry is my vote.

Lots of good feedback guys.

Regarding the Hetzer ideas: Major overlap issues with JP4 aside, it's not something we are able to tackle with current limitations.

However, we really like Smartie's idea for a 223 in this doctrine. Apparently, a model exists. Here are a few designs we are thinking about.


1) Regular 223. This unit costs approx 250/ 20. Combat ability similar to a 221. Signal Relay and healing are upgrades, which can be mutually exclusive. Approximately 50MP + 10/15 fuel extra each

2) Stock signal 223, same combat ability. Signal relay comes as stock. Healing is a purchasable upgrade. Base cost 250/ 25. Healing cost 100 MP - 15 fuel

3) Full 223: Comes with signal and healing as stock. This option would likely cost Mp 325 Fuel 35/40

All options would be cp1.

Base signal range would be approx 100, with increased range with vet.

Thoughts?

Psssst allow it to lock down territory a.k.a. OKW caches (mechanic used by Ostheer's Opel trucks). Perhaps fuel only to stay in the commander's armor theme. This would greatly extend its use into the late game.

But I kinda agree with the others. The 223 would have to come straight up (0CP) so it can act the same as a UC or a Scout Car as an early game harassment unit. Otherwise it might become more of a burden than an improvement.



What are the team's thoughts about the suggested Panzergrenadiers/Panzerfusiliers call-in ability instead?

Lots of good feedback guys.

Regarding the Hetzer ideas: Major overlap issues with JP4 aside, it's not something we are able to tackle with current limitations.

However, we really like Smartie's idea for a 223 in this doctrine. Apparently, a model exists. Here are a few designs we are thinking about.


1) Regular 223. This unit costs approx 250/ 20. Combat ability similar to a 221. Signal Relay and healing are upgrades, which can be mutually exclusive. Approximately 50MP + 10/15 fuel extra each

2) Stock signal 223, same combat ability. Signal relay comes as stock. Healing is a purchasable upgrade. Base cost 250/ 25. Healing cost 100 MP - 15 fuel

3) Full 223: Comes with signal and healing as stock. This option would likely cost Mp 325 Fuel 35/40

All options would be cp1.

Base signal range would be approx 100, with increased range with vet.

Thoughts?

I actually suggested the 223 be added for Elite Armor back in the OKW Revamped Command topic that Sturmpanther made, difference was that I didn't think about giving it Signal Relay like Smartie did.

What I imagine is this:

It comes out as a 221 Scout Car that can capture territory.

223 is an upgrade (Antenna), can lockdown territory to provide Signal Relay passively. Limited range so it's not entirely map hax?

Another option is for it to be an active ability like it's now but as a passive, so you actually have to scout around with it behind enemy lines to find that USF Ambulance, provides a bit of counter play so to speak and a risk and reward system.

I don't know what you mean exactly by "healing", it's a scout vehicle meant for reconnaissance largely, or at least should be.

Edit:

I forgot to mention that the lockdown would boost an income of the territory similar to that of the Ostheer Opel Blitz Truck as well as the CoH PE 223 Scout/Command Car, so it would provide a little bit more of a utility in the long run and nullify the arguments made against it that it would cost unneeded manpower and fuel.

I couldn't really care less about HEAT rounds (which historically were actually garbage and LESS pen than the normal PzGr.39) and crew repairs. I think Panzerfusiliers would be my biggest wish for Elite Armor, although I like the 223 because it would be a good shock unit early game that can still be relevant late game, either with my ideas or with A. Soldier's. I'd be ecstatic if both changes make it in though

Guys, after reading feedback, I've added some extra context in bold above.

Passive Signal Relay? We're running back and forth between OP and useless right now, it might turn into a better Infrared half-track at this rate
Will said Relay provide 24/7 tracking of all vehicles on map?