Neither of those videos show good flanking or movement of squads. I mean serously two Conscripts vs Grenadier + MG42 + Unknown unit and your expecting to win?
How about rushing two Conscripts from the exact same side to deal with an MG42? Clever. Let's not buff Molotovs they hurt enough when people use them correctly.
Sick/bored of MG42 -.-
2 Sep 2013, 20:09 PM
#21
Posts: 176
Posts: 267 | Subs: 8
I would agree, those videos didn't really illustrate the issue too well. That said, the main argument was still valid and something we've seen quite a bit of internally.
2 Sep 2013, 21:06 PM
#23
Posts: 627
2 Sep 2013, 23:23 PM
#24
Posts: 21
2 Sep 2013, 23:37 PM
#25
Posts: 22
3 Sep 2013, 03:17 AM
#26
Posts: 101
Can someone link to a replay or stream of someone beating decent MG use in a 2v2? I don't need to hear about how 2v2 isn't manly enough because it isn't 1v1... I get that. I play about half and half, and the tactics required for each are totally different. When you can't just go around them and cap other parts of the map like 1v1, what do you do? Play defensively? Hope they leave it unguarded? Rush in with a clown car so it can get fausted? I enjoy playing 2v2 with my friend, and seeing every game start out with 4xMG42 (2 each, obviously) is frustrating us both. Once they get you with the initial suppression, they just have to keep walking them up and covering each other with their mile wide radius. Flaming clown car comes out at almost the exact time as the .222 scout car, then it's all downhill from there.
3 Sep 2013, 05:21 AM
#27
Posts: 934
I truly hope this is fixed next patch. Flanking is my favourite part of CoH and it has never been strong in CoH2, but every single patch has directly or indirectly nerfed the core tactic. I recently played CoH1 again and man do I miss the early game. It actually makes me sad 
I am generally so calm when I am playing/streaming but I have noticed lately an ever increasing sense of anger with the game. It is stupid that I get angry over a game, but man this is something I want to enjoy.
Watch this from 11:00. It sums up CoH2 for me. All it needs is some Benny Hill music to accompany the MG42 being chased across the whole map. -.-
Oh and the thing with Molotovs, I don't even view them as something which to actively hurt MG42's in the current game. For me they are simply used as a deterant for an MG42 to setup or to get Ostheer out of buildings.
I am generally so calm when I am playing/streaming but I have noticed lately an ever increasing sense of anger with the game. It is stupid that I get angry over a game, but man this is something I want to enjoy.
Watch this from 11:00. It sums up CoH2 for me. All it needs is some Benny Hill music to accompany the MG42 being chased across the whole map. -.-
Oh and the thing with Molotovs, I don't even view them as something which to actively hurt MG42's in the current game. For me they are simply used as a deterant for an MG42 to setup or to get Ostheer out of buildings.
3 Sep 2013, 05:27 AM
#28
Posts: 69
I would agree, those videos didn't really illustrate the issue too well. That said, the main argument was still valid and something we've seen quite a bit of internally.
Is it possible to make it so soldiers do not stay pinned for as long after the MG stops firing on them?
3 Sep 2013, 06:58 AM
#29
Posts: 79
german mg has too much health, quick suppression, an nigh invincible to nades of most sort, except penal bundle.
3 Sep 2013, 07:11 AM
#30
Posts: 622 | Subs: 1
That chase was ridiculous.. where are dps, range, bars, 3 men squads, red cover gone ? I never understood why coh2 is that easy and simple to play. This is a ww2 rts game right ? shits should die, and fast.
And btw, It amuses me to see vcoh maps being put into the game. I mean.. a pretty balanced map on vcoh like Semois - in which flanks, buildings, nades, close range, dps, wires have a MEANING - must be a total wtflol ostheer fest right ?
In the other hand, having Semois and Langres in coh2 perfectly confirm what's wrong with the mechanics right now.
And btw, It amuses me to see vcoh maps being put into the game. I mean.. a pretty balanced map on vcoh like Semois - in which flanks, buildings, nades, close range, dps, wires have a MEANING - must be a total wtflol ostheer fest right ?
In the other hand, having Semois and Langres in coh2 perfectly confirm what's wrong with the mechanics right now.
3 Sep 2013, 10:31 AM
#31
Posts: 29
Watch this from 11:00. It sums up CoH2 for me. All it needs is some Benny Hill music to accompany the MG42 being chased across the whole map. -.-
Wow, that really is atrocious, tagging behind him all the way across the map and it still has half health. Pursuing an MG42 is so time-consuming as well, since if you pay any attention elsewhere it might set up and immediately pin you.
3 Sep 2013, 10:42 AM
#32
15 
Posts: 786
Is it possible to make it so soldiers do not stay pinned for as long after the MG stops firing on them?
that's kind of the main issue the video portraits and makes me go nuts every time it happens.
I am generally so calm when I am playing/streaming but I have noticed lately an ever increasing sense of anger with the game. It is stupid that I get angry over a game, but man this is something I want to enjoy.
what's really frustrating to me is simply walking into capture points early game:
just to find out what the german player is fielding there you have to sacrifice a unit (getting it pinned and retreating it). After you've lost this much time you can start countering it (there's no hard counter tho, just soft counter which is sniper and will take a lot of time, especially if the mg is garrisoned)
3 Sep 2013, 10:54 AM
#33
Posts: 934
what's really frustrating to me is simply walking into capture points early game:
just to find out what the german player is fielding there you have to sacrifice a unit (getting it pinned and retreating it). After you've lost this much time you can start countering it (there's no hard counter tho, just soft counter which is sniper and will take a lot of time, especially if the mg is garrisoned)
The reason this occurs is due to the MG42 having the exact same LOS as a conscript squad. Combine this with how an MG42 fires instantly upon sight it is impossible to avoid an MG42 which is simply facing the right way. In CoH1 you had like 0.5 second window to react and pull your rifles back from the MG42, unless the MG42 had a forward scout. It no longer works like that as you will just be instant supressed/pinned at max range and forced to retreat on most occasions.
You must use buildings for your full sight advantage as Russia, however there are many maps where this isn't always possible. Finding the location of MG42's is half the battle when flanking and then positioning and execution follow up. It just easier to get a m3/flamer or sniper in the end unfortuantely, especally on open maps that lack buildings.
3 Sep 2013, 11:27 AM
#34
Posts: 1439
Can someone link to a replay or stream of someone beating decent MG use in a 2v2? I don't need to hear about how 2v2 isn't manly enough because it isn't 1v1... I get that. I play about half and half, and the tactics required for each are totally different. When you can't just go around them and cap other parts of the map like 1v1, what do you do? Play defensively? Hope they leave it unguarded? Rush in with a clown car so it can get fausted? I enjoy playing 2v2 with my friend, and seeing every game start out with 4xMG42 (2 each, obviously) is frustrating us both. Once they get you with the initial suppression, they just have to keep walking them up and covering each other with their mile wide radius. Flaming clown car comes out at almost the exact time as the .222 scout car, then it's all downhill from there.
I use 120 mm mortar (or a couple) when opponents go MG42 heavy in 2v2 mode recently and I am having some success. The game is pretty static for a while but I can cause some manpower losses and destroy Germans fortified positions. This will let me to catch up and tech to T3/T4. After that MG42 role is meaningless.
3 Sep 2013, 11:30 AM
#35
Posts: 396
In the other hand, having Semois and Langres in coh2 perfectly confirm what's wrong with the mechanics right now.
While I agree with your other points, the two maps are not mirror images of each other at all. I mean the basic design is the same but the points, buildings, pathing, etc are all different (AND HORRIBLE). Whoever designed those bushes you can't walk through therefore screw up the pathing/pace of the map tremendously fully failed to realize the genius of the original semois. This is a problem I have with a lot of "sequels" to good games. Most good multiplayer games take a great design that's pretty much simplistic (ie the free flowing movement of vcoh) and let the players play - almost like a custom sandbox. This allows for strategic diversity/development.
3 Sep 2013, 11:32 AM
#36
15 Posts: 786
I use 120 mm mortar (or a couple) when opponents go MG42 heavy in 2v2 mode recently and I am having some success. The game is pretty static for a while but I can cause some manpower losses and destroy Germans fortified positions. This will let me to catch up and tech to T3/T4. After that MG42 role is meaningless.
that can work but you still need to get lucky since you still need to get your fuel somewhere and by going mortar you are sacrificing AT and capping power
3 Sep 2013, 13:45 PM
#37
Posts: 123
Please remove all Bulletins they are so stupid or remove only the more suppression bulletins. Its no fun to be instant Red Pinned with one brust. another opion is to make the mortar more accurate when u use the fire ability. I just can agree with Steph this game feels so boring because there is no real early game. The game is to slow, very static and no one is carring about cover, because when u go in cover u get a Rifel-; or granate in your Face, ...Sorry Relic but u failed...
Waiting for Company of Heroes 3
3 Sep 2013, 14:03 PM
#38
Posts: 644
jeesuspietari vor 23 Stunden
If you fail at flanking with Russians. You are obviously doing something wrong. also. use smoke
5 OP OH tanks in front of your base
blow one up, slap it around
7 OP OH tanks in front of your base
blow one up, slap it around
7 OP OH tanks in front of your base
3 Sep 2013, 14:09 PM
#39
Posts: 2425
Permanently Banned Need to be careful with the nerf, or oorah +/- molotov will take the cake.
3 Sep 2013, 14:38 PM
#40
Posts: 22
Need to be careful with the nerf, or oorah +/- molotov will take the cake.
Hopefully an HMG nerf will promote the first few units being grenadiers, to encourage the establishment of a base army before "support" teams come onto the field. In this case, oorah/molotovs won't be so bad as grenadiers can cut down conscripts as they rush in/dodge molotov easier. Also, it has already been a bit harder to use the combo early game because it now costs 25 munitions every time you use it (not a big deal later, but in the first engagement or two that's pricy). Wish they would increase the cost of all MG's so they come onto the field a little later, but we'll see what the devs can do.
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