Panzerfüsilier Squad VS Volksgrenadier

Hey there !
As title says Panzerfüsilier Squad VS Volksgrenadier whats best?
I played some team fights 2v2 3vs3 with Breakthrough doctrine to test Panzerfüsilier Squad upgraded to G43's (I think its 1 per squad?) supported with Sturmoffizier + and used intel bulletins :Make every shot counts(+2 accuracy to near squads) Harry up and move(Pzfuss ability 10% faster) learn it it at bootcamp(recharge 2% faster) and i know that they are good in long range but i fell that i lost every encounter against US inf in 2vs2 squads fights ...I like the early AT Grenade i saw the anti-personal grenade very weak ,does this unit is really bad or i am doing something wrong?
encounters i tested was 1vs1 squads and 2vs2 squads
Any ideas ?or should i drop them?Maybe Sturmoffizier works better with volks?
With volks and upgraded with SG44 i have no problem at close mid range ,but if i am gonna use only the core units why i would need a commander?id like to involve more to my gaming style with commanders any tips would be appriciated ty

I've tried several times to incorporate Panzerfusiliers in my gameplay. I don't think they're very good tbh. Feels like an osttruppen squad with a grenade at 2cp. OKW just doesn't need them.

Pfussies > volks if you can. They're basically a stronger 6 man volk squad which can upgrade to 3x G43s and still have 2 slots open for w/e else. Comes with snare, flare is great. The grenade is pretty meh but i'll take it for the other stuff.

I will continue to give them some more tries.. maybe my macro is bad ..

They are pretty good. Although heavily nerfed in last patch.

Problem is how to make them fit into your build order. At 2 CP you usually already have your Volks on the field. And then the Füsiliere are not needed anymore. Some people went double kübel before the last patch, it was easier to get Füsiliere with such builds but now Kübel is bad so people just get lots of Volks early on.

They make sense when you need to replace wiped Volks squads since they are, as Shadow said, a better version of Volks. They are not really elite infantry so obviously not comparable to Falls.

If you like to play with lots of infantry you can also get 2 Füsilier squads at 2 CP but it doesn´t make an awful lot of sense since it would be better to just save up a bit of MP and get two Obers once T4 is set up. Obers help you a lot vs. Allied infantry.

Maybe start with sturm x2 or 3 until get them?and save sturms for Pzshrecks? also Sturmoffizier doesnt have 3 ober with him?

Maybe start with sturm x2 or 3 until get them?and save sturms for Pzshrecks? also Sturmoffizier doesnt have 3 ober with him?

The offizier comes with 3 K98 ober models yes, but most of the ober damage comes from the LMG upgrade or the IR StGs. Also the offizier doesn't vet, and is pretty underwhelming. It has some nice abilities to help in niche situations, but I'd rather just have another fussilier squad over him. The buff he provides isn't even that worthwhile anyways, it's like +10% accuracy buff or something. To be worth while over just adding another pfussie you'd have to have like 8-9 infantry squads all around the officer.

The old Paul strat in 1v1 last patch and previously was open with 2x or 3x kubels, maybe a sturmpio for reps and rush to 2CPs. kubels don't bleed because they're mechanical units and when you hit 2 you just spam pfussies. Usually went into battle group with 2x ISG and 2x rak for premptive armor and scout cars to counter kubels.

This strat may no longer work though since the kubel nerf and prominent light vehicle meta to counter flaktrack.

I ma thinking of 2-3 sturmsfor capping and close combate then 2-3 Pzfuss and if the game goes to t4 replace them with obers

Something that's pretty relevant but that people are neglecting to mention for some reason is that panzerfusiliers are hardly better than volks at long range; 4 man infantry sections have a higher max range dps than panzerfusiliers do. Panzerfusiliers are actually best used by charging up to enemy squads, making use of their excellent on the move performance while getting themeselves to their optimal range. Their large model count allows them to do this without losing too much of the squad's overall dps by the time they reach close range. That said, they're still decent at long range, but again, their optimum range is around 5 units/point blank. This means that you want to charge in against most units if possible, unless theyre smg equipped.

As for their spot in the meta...they don't really have one. As others have stated, the best pfusi build involved using kubels as your early game core infantry, and thats just not really possible anymore. By the time you hit 2 cp, you have all of the core infantry you need, so pfusis just arent needed. You could do a double sturm start, but that really hurts your armies' flexibility since the only way you can play a fight is by charging in. The only other thing I can imagine is a double kubel start (as opposed to the 3-4 kubels of last patch), but even then, I'm not sure how well that would work.

I just played a 2vs2 with double sturm start and a kubel ...struggling...
Nah.....cant be done anything....changing commander ... was good but not that good..
PZfuss case closed for the moment.-

Panzerfuzilers are like Riflemen except their worth their man power cost.

Pzfussiliers are excellent at long range , especially vet ones .
Save them for late game .

Pzfussiliers are excellent at long range , especially vet ones .
Save them for late game .

When was the last time you played? Jae for Jett is on point with the observation that they perform better on short range and their g43s aren't that bad while moving. The majority of their long range performance came from their veterancy that got toned down (was normalized) in one of the latest patches.

I would say they can be useful but usually aren't worth the commanderchoice.

If you are interested in them you could watch CaptainSPrice replays, I think nobody else uses them regulary.

???? oh god what a bloody changes .....
Well , i havnt played since 2years ago .
G43 always is good for shooting while walking , moreover vet fussiliers with 6squad seems appropriate infantry for late game ,anyway what happened to them after patches?

Could someone please address this question again in relation to the current meta.

1. Panzerfüsilier Squad VS Volksgrenadier with no upgrade
2. Panzerfüsilier Squad VS Volksgrenadier with upgrade (G43 and MP44/MP40)

Which is seemingly better?

Could someone please address this question again in relation to the current meta.

1. Panzerfüsilier Squad VS Volksgrenadier with no upgrade
2. Panzerfüsilier Squad VS Volksgrenadier with upgrade (G43 and MP44/MP40)

Which is seemingly better?

Speaking from a 3v3/4v4 perspective.

No upgrades, they are pretty much even. The volks fire grenade comes earlier while the Panzerfusilier grenade requires 1 HQ truck to be setup. Volks (faust) tank snare feels more reliable than the anti-tank grenade.

Upgraded, Panzerfusiliers (PF) are more versatile than Volks. Their G43 upgrade is superior to the STG44 upgrade as it provides additional sight range and an extra model. Extra model = more dps. The vet1 flare ability is quite powerful as it provides scouting/early warning so you can take good fights.

If you are encountering a lot of tank destroyers which you likely will. You can get a PF squad and equip them with the shrek upgrade which gives them two shreks. This squad really reminds me of the volk shreks blobs back in the day. They lose their tank snare with the shrek upgrade though.

The downside to PFs is that you can't build sandbags. That means you have to be more careful with the fights you take.

Close range, both squads will lose to pretty much everything. They start winning at mid/long range.

Volks, I would use like cons. Build sandbags and hold a position. They only exist to hold the line until I can bring up my other units.

PFs with G43s I play as a light skirmisher unit. Poke and prod enemy defences until I find a weakness and push through. I use the flare often to scout for good places to attack.

PF is a better choice imo.

But it comes with some risks if you decide to go only PF. They are terrible in early game so if you face a competent player you will probably have to fight an uphill battle against their mainline infantry.
My tip is as following.
2 Volk Squads Early + 1 PF
Then tech of choice
1 More PF and spend muni to upgrade to g43 for both your PF squads
For me this works well becaouse the PF scales better late game and the Volks is better early. More safe tac.

Could someone please address this question again in relation to the current meta.

1. Panzerfüsilier Squad VS Volksgrenadier with no upgrade
2. Panzerfüsilier Squad VS Volksgrenadier with upgrade (G43 and MP44/MP40)

Which is seemingly better?

I boil it down as a personal preference as follows:

If USF blobs are likely -> Get PF and blob them back with better inf. Your G43 PFs outscale their riflemen quickly and even the Captain runs into major issues.

If anything else -> Volks

Still can someone answer with actual numbers and stats. I once learnt that PF with g43 arenot snipers they are more SMG.in my experience they are smg not long range at all. Actaully g43 make them worse than volks long range. They annihilate at close rane. Get numbers pls

If you are comparing them as mainline infantry; there's no question; Fusilers are better.

More units, only 20 more manpower, hold their own all the way into the late game especially vetted.

And you can have one running around with double schrecks, model 24 and AT grenade.

Their negatives are they are more to reinforce, and 80 muni for G43's and 100 muni for Schrecks aren't cheap.

Their G43's are good at medium range and on the move. Occasionally they'll snipe a unit retreating.

Volks with STG44's get a good power spike in a relatively small window.

Fusilers may not necessarily pour out DPS and wreck Shock Troops/Rangers, but neither do Volks, but they do a lot better against other mainlines in the late game.

I use Fusilers quite a bit with Sturm Offizer, that mark target really turns them on.