- Pz 4 wiped a squad of Riflemen (dual bar) with a single shot. It's first shot.
OP? Of course notIt's not even that rare, to be honest.
Op nerf pls kappa
The age-old double soviet sniper conundrum
14 Mar 2018, 20:28 PM
#61
Posts: 224 | Subs: 1
Op nerf pls kappa
15 Mar 2018, 06:39 AM
#62
Posts: 2243
I'm going to be a bitch here and say what Vipper says:
The proof of claim is a responsibility of person making the claim, not his opponent in the discussion.
You made a claim, you pointed out "source", it is within your responsibilities to provide the context as well as a proof to the claim.
Without that I can only say this:
HelpingHans is amount THE very best players in game, yet he still parks his own tanks on his own teller mines. Top players make mistakes as well, but one mistake does not define the player nor the units or scenario involved.
I am not going to trust your claim, because my own experience in the game says it was not possible unless additional factors were present, which you deliberately avoid to present.
its funny that you often show us not a proof from your theses....
i do it.
and i was lucky that this szenario was in one of the first games:
https://youtu.be/Du0lLF-ca_A?t=279
there was 2 szenarios more on the same map where the sniper killed by USf light verhicles in short time.
now on you again...have the 222 the same kill power vs sov sniper??
look the stats from m2 and 222 and try to kill a sniper with both verhicels and come back to proof your theses that m2 is bad against sniper / or 222 is on the same lvl.
15 Mar 2018, 07:09 AM
#63
Posts: 5279
222 is ineffective vs the sniper plain and simple. I PERSONALLY would love to see a 221 in t1 WHEN bp1 is teched, maybe allow to upgrade into a 222 once t2 is built OR bp2 is teched (should the player for some reason skip t2) the 222 would still be available as is atm in t2 as well. This gives ost some flexibility and a proper sniper counter (and a natural vehicle progression too)
The 221 was removed because the 222 was a no brainer upgrade, the game has changed and the 221 would again have a role
The 221 was removed because the 222 was a no brainer upgrade, the game has changed and the 221 would again have a role
#stalinwept
15 Mar 2018, 07:40 AM
#64
Posts: 224 | Subs: 1
its funny that you often show us not a proof from your theses....
i do it.
and i was lucky that this szenario was in one of the first games:
https://youtu.be/Du0lLF-ca_A?t=279
there was 2 szenarios more on the same map where the sniper killed by USf light verhicles in short time.
now on you again...have the 222 the same kill power vs sov sniper??
look the stats from m2 and 222 and try to kill a sniper with both verhicels and come back to proof your theses that m2 is bad against sniper / or 222 is on the same lvl.
What? You say at the beginning of m3, and send video of the m20. How to understand this?
15 Mar 2018, 08:16 AM
#65
Posts: 5279
Why not just increase the price of the soviet sniper? In this instance durability trumps all other stats due to forgiveness. Only thing i would suggest outside that would be a readjustment to the health distribution.
Something like 420mp
Sniper model has 82 health, spotter has 46. Same amount of health as now but it cant be wiped by a random mortar AND is more likely to inflict bleed as the second model would be easier to kill off.
Something like 420mp
Sniper model has 82 health, spotter has 46. Same amount of health as now but it cant be wiped by a random mortar AND is more likely to inflict bleed as the second model would be easier to kill off.
#stalinwept
15 Mar 2018, 08:39 AM
#66
Posts: 224 | Subs: 1
Why not just increase the price of the soviet sniper? In this instance durability trumps all other stats due to forgiveness. Only thing i would suggest outside that would be a readjustment to the health distribution.
Something like 420mp
Sniper model has 82 health, spotter has 46. Same amount of health as now but it cant be wiped by a random mortar AND is more likely to inflict bleed as the second model would be easier to kill off.
And at the same time equalize reloading, aiming and swapping abilities?
15 Mar 2018, 12:39 PM
#67
Posts: 2243
What? You say at the beginning of m3, and send video of the m20. How to understand this?
my failure. i cant remember all details from game months ago
15 Mar 2018, 14:06 PM
#68
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
my failure. i cant remember all details from game months ago
That is kind of massive mistake there, not 'detail'...
One have massive CQC dps and scales well, other barely does anything.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
15 Mar 2018, 14:36 PM
#69
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
The Soviet M3A's MG is quite lethal and it actually better than m20's in most ranges.
M3a1 DPS Ranges 5/10/20/35
14.7/14.7/8.6/3.2
M20 DPs
14.2/12.1/7.9/3.3
M20 has also higher cost and higher tech cost.
M3a1 DPS Ranges 5/10/20/35
14.7/14.7/8.6/3.2
M20 DPs
14.2/12.1/7.9/3.3
M20 has also higher cost and higher tech cost.
15 Mar 2018, 15:43 PM
#70
Posts: 224 | Subs: 1
The Soviet M3A's MG is quite lethal and it actually better than m20's in most ranges.
M3a1 DPS Ranges 5/10/20/35
14.7/14.7/8.6/3.2
M20 DPs
14.2/12.1/7.9/3.3
M20 has also higher cost and higher tech cost.
How often do you build snipers(especially two) after seeing the soviet T1?
Yes, the soviet can go to t0 and then to go in T1, but in this case, you'll have 2-3 squad with a Faust, and you can use one to protect the sniper, right?
15 Mar 2018, 15:58 PM
#71
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
How often do you build snipers(especially two) after seeing the soviet T1?
Yes, the soviet can go to t0 and then to go in T1, but in this case, you'll have 2-3 squad with a Faust, and you can use one to protect the sniper, right?
Just a suggestion but can you Pls do not use the quote button if your answer is going to be completely irrelevant to what you are quoting.
If you have any comment about the DPS of M3 (that is quite high actually) or of the DPS of M20 feel free to quote me and add it.
If you are interested in my build order, usage of snipers and Faust pls contact me via PM, it is completely irreverent to the subject of this thread.
15 Mar 2018, 16:09 PM
#72
Posts: 607
M20 you get for more than just hunting snipers and it's on the meta tech path for USF.
M3 requires the opportunity cost decision of going special rifle instead of team weapons.
Never mind that Ullumulu's whole point goes out the window since he wasn't even referring to the right army.
M3 requires the opportunity cost decision of going special rifle instead of team weapons.
Never mind that Ullumulu's whole point goes out the window since he wasn't even referring to the right army.
15 Mar 2018, 16:28 PM
#73
Posts: 224 | Subs: 1
If you are interested in my build order, usage of snipers and Faust pls contact me via PM, it is completely irreverent to the subject of this thread.
Really, it is completely irreverent, It makes more sense to compare only the DPS, or HP units
15 Mar 2018, 16:55 PM
#74
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
Really, it is completely irreverent, It makes more sense to compare only the DPS, or HP units
You can see what I compared on post 29, if you do not like my analysis or can offer a better one go ahead. Also feel free to add your suggestions. (the DPS comparison was made to clarify certain things)
My request would be that you focus on the subject of this thread and not to what I do or do not do.
Until then, can you pls answer the question if 222 in your opinion is a good counter to snipers?
15 Mar 2018, 17:54 PM
#75
14 
Posts: 10665 | Subs: 9
Posts #59 and #60 invised
Tempting as it may be to write vat en, I will confine myself to asking that you only post in English.
Should you feel tempted to express yourself in your native tongue to another poster, please either PM them, or provide a parallel English translation.
Back to topic
Tempting as it may be to write vat en, I will confine myself to asking that you only post in English.
Should you feel tempted to express yourself in your native tongue to another poster, please either PM them, or provide a parallel English translation.
Back to topic
15 Mar 2018, 18:10 PM
#76
Posts: 4474
laughing all the way to the base with kubels
Also, don't play okw.
katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
15 Mar 2018, 19:48 PM
#77
Posts: 5279
And at the same time equalize reloading, aiming and swapping abilities?
Why? Soviet sniper can still come faster than others and clearly your reading comprehension is ass because it would still have 2 models.1 sniper isnt the problem, its ass hats who double or triple up. The only way to make that more risky without butchering single sniper use is to make it more expensive.
#stalinwept
15 Mar 2018, 22:04 PM
#78
Posts: 606
Posts #59 and #60 invised
Tempting as it may be to write vat en, I will confine myself to asking that you only post in English.
Should you feel tempted to express yourself in your native tongue to another poster, please either PM them, or provide a parallel English translation.
Back to topic
Ultimately I'll leave this decision up to you, but I personally feel that I have gotten all the constructive feedback out of this that I can get, so if you have a feeling that this is turning into a shitfest, then feel free to shut it down
16 Mar 2018, 04:16 AM
#79
Posts: 1930
The Soviet M3A's MG is quite lethal and it actually better than m20's in most ranges.
M3a1 DPS Ranges 5/10/20/35
14.7/14.7/8.6/3.2
M20 DPs
14.2/12.1/7.9/3.3
M20 has also higher cost and higher tech cost.
still using cruzz's forumla?
here's the value from relic's mod tool
m20 (last value is for range 40)
22.40574506 15.59927647 10.27828349 6.169168803 4.501391438 3.061637534
soviet m3a1
18.89101338 18.89101338 11.16641783 5.945397635 4.028953002
I actually like the soviet sniper team design wise, because it means you can inflict partial manpower cost on the soviet.
Instead of the all of nothing game play on the british and german sniper, the soviet sniper allow the enemy to inflict manpower cost on the enemy without completely junking the 360 mp investment.
If you deal 64 damage on the german sniper, he can heal the damage "for free" once he's back at base.
if you kill one of the sniper model on the soviet, it means he needs to pay for the 90 reinforce cost.
the reinforcement cost just need to actually sting more, maybe 135-180. or lower the 64 hp on the soviet.
16 Mar 2018, 04:51 AM
#80
Posts: 224 | Subs: 1
You can see what I compared on post 29, if you do not like my analysis or can offer a better one go ahead. Also feel free to add your suggestions. (the DPS comparison was made to clarify certain things)
My request would be that you focus on the subject of this thread and not to what I do or do not do.
Until then, can you pls answer the question if 222 in your opinion is a good counter to snipers?
222 ineffective for this purpose, the same as the m3 because of its fragility, especially if you went to the T2 return T1, very painful for soviet, unlike the ost, the output of T2 is needed, at least for AT
But nobody forbids you from doing 251, which I'm doing against snipers, by the way.
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