It is time for the OH MG bunker to cost popcap

It is the only static weapon in the game not to cost popcap. This is an unfair advantage to OH as it allows them to have more guns on the field without penalty. OKW flak gun, bofors, ML-20 etc... all require popcap.

Like US fighting position ?

If anything a pioneer squad inside should get rifle grenade free =)

Like US fighting position ?

If anything a pioneer squad inside should get rifle grenade free =)

yes US should cost money too

Ost Bunkers cost 60 munitions to get an MG which is a lot for a faction that has gather together every bit of munitions it can.

An MG bunker means one static emplacement more that you can easily go around once you know where it is (because - you know - a bunker can't move) and one LMG42 for a Gren Squad or a flamer for a Pio less.

Every allied faction has more than enough tools to handle MG bunkers. And once even Light tanks appear, most bunkers lose their usefulness. With the indirect fire meta, a bunker is IMO just wasted money most of the times.

I honestly don't know if US fighting positions cost popcap (probably they do) but they give REs rifle nades inside which is a good compensation in my opinion. Still Fighting Positions are more kind of sucky emplacements, not comparable to the Brit counterparts.

But still, the most important thing is that Ost simply does not have enough mun to prefer an MG bunker over, let's say, a Panzer's MG42.

Almost every German unit (I honestly think EVERY German infantry unit) has an upgrade that costs mun and is usually needed in order to stay alive.
There is usually no game where I float more than 50-100 mun at any given time as Ost.

I thinks its more like every faction should get pop free MG nest rather than giving pop cap to those who have.
and yes, Cashe for OKW plz

Sure thing, as soon as they get a non ammo based medical option. You know, every 60 muni spent on a bunker is 60 muni not spent on a med bunker for home.

Just saying

The bunker spam is really frustrating. You have to constantly pressure an OST player or they will just sit there and bunker up. Sure you have the tools to take down a bunker, but it's not always alone and when you're off dealing with a bunker, you're pulling active resources to fight a static spot that isn't really hurting that enemy player that much.

In larger games its a problem, being pop cap'd and just spamming bunkers all over the place. It's a boon, you can protect your flank, a flank that on same maps can't be outflanked and then move your MG42 somewhere else where its more useful.

Fighting positions should also cost pop, but they should also be as hard to kill as an OST one, the riflenade from the RE is rarely used, but i dont care if you get rid of it. Never won me a game personally.... and people talk about munitions starved? HAH... USF needs munitions to do anything, far more than OST does.

AT guns kill bunkers in 3 shots and they never miss.

Unless something changed in the recent patches, at guns dont/can't miss ostheer bunkers.

Ostheer bunkers are useful only in 2 situations:
1. When you need medics
2. When you are popcapped and want to use spare manpower to secure VPs a little bit more.

In both cases, adding population to bunkers is out of the question.

Ostheer bunkers are useful only in 2 situations:
1. When you need medics
2. When you are popcapped and want to use spare manpower to secure VPs a little bit more.

In both cases, adding population to bunkers is out of the question.

If two players are duking it on par, the OST can still lay down bunkers to defend vital flank points without having to worry about his capacity to assault at all.

I don't think that's fair, and I don't think Fighting Positions are fair without population either. Once you pay for the MG, it should cost population.

USF got nerffed for jumping out of their vehicles to repair cause of pop issues, some CAN'T anymore. Population matters in games. I don't see why MG bunkers get a free pass.

If two players are duking it on par, the OST can still lay down bunkers to defend vital flank points without having to worry about his capacity to assault at all.

I don't think that's fair, and I don't think Fighting Positions are fair without population either. Once you pay for the MG, it should cost population.

USF got nerffed for jumping out of their vehicles to repair cause of pop issues, some CAN'T anymore. Population matters in games. I don't see why MG bunkers get a free pass.

One reason is because ostheer has never been the strongest of factions and struggles with mp as it is. Nerfing them in this way just because it unnecessary I think. Obviously everything is up for discussion but I think this is a non issue. Against soviets bunkers are a good way to swap 150mp (plus precious time building them) for the muni for the satchel required to eliminate them, or a couple of shots from a su76. Against US they are more potent but it’s tough to find the breathing space to construct one against good players as you can neither afford the manpower or the time for one unit to be out of action to build it as you fend off the waves of rifles. Brit has an aec.

They are useful to OST in that they can help prevent collapse of your support weapon based army if the front line is cracked ( i like them as a backstop ) but I don’t think they swing balance much.

If two players are duking it on par, the OST can still lay down bunkers to defend vital flank points without having to worry about his capacity to assault at all.

Because throwing away 150 mp and 60 muni doesn't hurt your ability to win this game?

Bunkers and defensive positions are rarely seen and easy to take out by every faction.
If you're having trouble vs them, I suggest you ask for advice.

On maps like Trois-Point where you can easily defend two choke points from either side. Launching an assault can be costly when you have to fight through MG bunkers that are backed by AT guns, mortars, and god forbid a King Tiger, Jag, or Elephant.

I'm not talking about a lone MG bunker sitting off in the wilderness all by itself. They're supported, just like any MG42 is supported. Except as the game goes on not only does this MG not cost population, it just needs to be repaired which costs zero resources. Even an MG team would cost you some manpower as it gets bombed to shit.


So on a map like Trois-Point, with painful chokes. Unless I'm USF, I have to dedicate pop to those points to make sure I'm being flanked. I lay plenty of landmines, but people aren't idiots, they'll grab sweepers.


If OST "depends" on these bunkers to stay in the game as some of you are sourcing, then why not give them a buff, why would you cling to the MG bunker rather than what the real problem is? if MG bunkers can be so easily dealt with, and the faction has a clinging weakness that it requires a MG bunker. Then why not change that?

On maps like Trois-Point where you can easily defend two choke points from either side. Launching an assault can be costly when you have to fight through MG bunkers that are backed by AT guns, mortars, and god forbid a King Tiger, Jag, or Elephant.

Shit map and the entire axis roster is defending bunkers, why, i can make pio's look OP this way.

I'm not talking about a lone MG bunker sitting off in the wilderness all by itself. They're supported, just like any MG42 is supported. Except as the game goes on not only does this MG not cost population, it just needs to be repaired which costs zero resources. Even an MG team would cost you some manpower as it gets bombed to shit.

Said repairing pio's are also free and take no (extra) damage during repairs I take it?
And it's not like an mg42, which can reposition and gain vet to boot.

If OST "depends" on these bunkers to stay in the game as some of you are sourcing, then why not give them a buff, why would you cling to the MG bunker rather than what the real problem is? if MG bunkers can be so easily dealt with, and the faction has a clinging weakness that it requires a MG bunker. Then why not change that?

???

No one claims this, no one defends this, all people are saying is that bunkers are a non-issue and adding popcap to a unit that is barely used is a waste.

I don't know how people can defend OST MG bunker (and OKW with fortification doc) when it become serious meta right now, especially bigger team game. It's extremely annoying just to flush out those mg bunkers defending victory point. Of every axis players I encounter, all of them resort to MG bunker spam, no spare.

MG bunker spam is worst as Brit Emplacement spam. Just imagine Brit Emplacement with 0 popcap - you know how terrible it is. At least, Brit have big manpower and fuel cost slap along with it. If you can complain one side, why not other?

US MG emplacement can have pop cap as well, at least it's ten time easier to dislodge an US emplacement when I'm playing as axis.

Counter? Possible. But when late game hit with Jagdtiger/Elefant and bunches of rocket artillery, all allies counter options become invalid. You just have to over skill your opponent or become salty.

Either you are axis fanboi wanting to abuse it or just playing 1v1 and claiming it's not a problem.

Are Ost bunkers really an issue? I usually play allies and will carelessly YOLO into one every once in awhile but they're really not a big deal. They go down almost as fast as fighting pits

If Ost needs any changes, it would be an upgrade to 5 man squads for grens so they could survive indirect fire better.

Counter? Possible. But when late game hit with Jagdtiger/Elefant and bunches of rocket artillery, all allies counter options become invalid. You just have to over skill your opponent or become salty.

Either you are axis fanboi wanting to abuse it or just playing 1v1 and claiming it's not a problem.

Having to overskill your opponent to win does sound a bit unfair. I generally view the bunkers the same as the bunkers used in coh1, they are a speed bump for enemy forces and little else. They don’t cause much damage after all and comparisons to a bofors or mortar bit are silly. That said I’m prepared to accept that they may may have become a problem (after 4 years) due to other changes in the factions for big games. In 1’s and 2’s OST couldn’t be said to be overpowered so nerfing them in any way seems counterproductive to balance. In big games I would expect allied artillery to render them a waste of resources - is this not the case? At what stage in the game do you find them proliferating?

AT guns kill bunkers in 3 shots and they never miss.

good one

Counter? Possible. But when late game hit with Jagdtiger/Elefant and bunches of rocket artillery, all allies counter options become invalid. You just have to over skill your opponent or become salty.

Either you are axis fanboi wanting to abuse it or just playing 1v1 and claiming it's not a problem.

i can sign that. bunkers may not be that much of an issue in smaller modes, but well, even in 2v2 on narrow maps it can be a big problem with a axis lategame units camping nearby

Bunkers are 3shot from any tank and any at gun. 3 shots for 150mp and 60 mun. I wanna see any faction that can just throw those resources away like that, especially if it's Ostheer. Any fighting position, MG bunker is a horrible investment unless you are capped and are floating resources too. I don't see any problem other than an L2P issue.