FBP V1.1 UPDATE

So what's the intended counter to the Jackson if I might ask? According to your previous posts it's not the stug, pIV, PV, JP4, or PVI. What is it? Or is the Jackson supposed to be top of the food chain for a lower price?

Also, how does one shot from a panther or Tiger take it out of combat? Last I checked 600hp-200hp= 400hp not 0. Does the Jackson get a main gun disabled at 400hp or something?

It also has 10/15 extra range than the tiger and panther while still being faster than both (except slightly slower max speed that panther) meaning it can kite.

omg this topic is so stupid so u tell me whats the counter to the elefant with KT pls tell me, 2 jackson is ok ? U want balance between mediums but people sometimes forget how usf is hopeless vs heavy tanks i hope this patch will solve usf late game problems and i dont give garden about poor wermaht because this is myth that wermaht is weak yo

omg this topic is so stupid so u tell me whats the counter to the elefant with KT pls tell me, 2 jackson is ok ? U want balance between mediums but people sometimes forget how usf is hopeless vs heavy tanks i hope this patch will solve usf late game problems and i dont give garden about poor wermaht because this is myth that wermaht is weak yo

its neraly 600 fuel only to get this units.

and to bring KT you need all 3 trucks set up...means about 200 more fuel..

u must be bad if u had at this time no big mediums army with minumin 2 players.

its neraly 600 fuel only to get this units.

and to bring KT you need all 3 trucks set up...means about 200 more fuel..

u must be bad if u had at this time no big mediums army with minumin 2 players.

good luck micro 4 jacksons kappa

good luck micro 4 jacksons kappa

Why? u need only 2...make a infantery push and click your bs call-ins and snipe with jackson...2 jackson can shot 6 shoots before must retreat... should be the death for a KT

I am sensing a renewal of the penal syndrome here. This time however, it is in the form of the Jackson, that is getting put in the place that the terminator penals were put in before.

well considering those heavy TDs are team game creatures, I think I can confidently say that Jackson is not useless in the live version of the game in 2v2+... no where near useless...

A lot of the clans we've consulted have reassured us that Jackson is either completely useless (due to its fragility), or completely overshadowed by the Firefly, which has more durability and hits harder at the same time. The only reason those clans bring USF along is for Calliope, the ambulance and nothing else.

the problem of getting super hard countered by the ele and JT is a part of a greater problem of team games where JT and ELE just becomes the critical mass bomb i.e. both sides are at even power with a few tanks on each players' command and axis team getting ELE or JT will just swing the balance of armour power pendulum way over to the axis side. In which case 90% if the time, then the allies only option is to get enough AT and AI to hold off while getting katyusha, land mattress and calliope to wipe axis inf (those three units basically have the same problem where they are handle-able one to two at a time but becomes absolutely unmanageable once they hit critical mass).

Note that along with HeavyTD meta, allied arty-wipe meta is also going down the drain to keep balance in check.

so i think 280 damage for super TDs are the right way to go to reduce the critical mass problem by making medium tanks able to withstand 1 more shot and its impact will be big - we've seen similar impact with stewie... but the quoted line is a poor reasoning to give jackson extra HP, let alone a new role.

The primary reason Jackson is getting a makeover is 1v1.

The only way somebody is going to build a jackson in 1v1 is when they want to concede defeat. USF currently lacks access to proper tanks that can chase and finish off enemy tanks. The sherman, while excellent at AI, lacks the speed and durability to fill this niche. Therefore, the Jackson is revamped to fill those shoes. The new design also fits USF's design as a mobile, aggressive faction.

4v4-wise, the new Jackson also gets a unique identity. Rather than being a budget-firefly, the Jackson gets a new identity that will let it be used in a different fashion from all other TDs in the game.

I am sensing a renewal of the penal syndrome here. This time however, it is in the form of the Jackson, that is getting put in the place that the terminator penals were put in before.

You are correct in sensing a renewal of the Penal syndrome. However, if want to take a trip to the way-back machine, you will see that most complaints we got about Penals were completely off the mark/bullshit.

E.g., one of the top complaints we had was how the PTRS upgrade would make Luchs a completely useless never-build unit, etc.

If we only ever get feedback about the Jackson, of course you are only ever going to get Jackson changes.

I wanted to post here a serious post long time ago but every time I wanted to do so, I left it as is, because I was unable to post here anything productive here, that would show the cons of a patch and possibly move it somewhere.

That´s it, here isn´t anything we can point at as a bad change because most of the changes are no brainers and will surely move the game into better place than it was before.

Of course, there´s still going to be a lot of BS in the game, but that´s not the problem of the patch, the BS was here for 2+ years and still wasn´t addressed.Maybe it will be in the future.But our job here, in the playtesting, is to point out things that a)come from this patch b) hurt balance.

Our job here is to playtest everything and see if any OP BS comes solely from this patch, if there is some degradation in terms of units, builds and so on. And if you look at the patch as a whole, there really isn´t anything that can move the game down. Yes, some of those changes aren´t possibly the best and they aren´t completely addressing the problem as a whole but they are at least greatly improving the imbalance created there.

So for me this patch is really nice addition to coh2 and I think it will only improve the game (for example giving players more options when it comes to choosing doctrines). At least I was unable to find any of all changes that will hurt the game or balance.

Keep up the good work Mr.Smith and co.

PS: Guys, Jackson isn´t going to be changed, because USF needs a reliable TD that can go toe-to-toe with biggest axis tanks. It isn´t a good faction design when faction becomes extinct after minute XY just because they lack tools to counter single heavy tank.
If you want to counter a Jackson get TD on your own (JP4)or use some kind of an infantry AT like a pak or schrecks. It´s still a tank with paper armor, penetrated by anything.

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PS: Guys, Jackson isn´t going to be changed, because USF needs a reliable TD that can go toe-to-toe with biggest axis tanks. It isn´t a good faction design when faction becomes extinct after minute XY just because they lack tools to counter single heavy tank.
If you want to counter a Jackson get TD on your own (JP4)or use some kind of an infantry AT like a pak or schrecks. It´s still a tank with paper armor, penetrated by anything.

they guy with the ost faction will be fucked up if they changes goes life. or he must evry single time pick the ele commander.

with what want the ost player counter such a bs unit, which outrange all of his anti tank units?

look to the poor at performanche from panther...if u struggle to deal with a panther as usf player...its your own failure, and u know this.

if u make usf at stronger .. u must weaken their infantery.

usf has by far the best infantery...now they get such a good TD?

usf has by far the best infantery...now they get such a good TD?

Hm why Okw Inf rape Usa in 1vs1 then so that the luchs comes so fast?

And thats vet 0 inf. Going to be vet3-5 hf as usa soviet, brit.

they guy with the ost faction will be fucked up if they changes goes life. or he must evry single time pick the ele commander.

with what want the ost player counter such a bs unit, which outrange all of his anti tank units?

look to the poor at performanche from panther...if u struggle to deal with a panther as usf player...its your own failure, and u know this.

if u make usf at stronger .. u must weaken their infantery.

usf has by far the best infantery...now they get such a good TD?

Your posts are like firing with ppsh at max range. You´ll have the feeling of having great rate of fire and effectivity but in reality only few out of all bullets hit their target

why not just make super heavy TD's nerf to only a good level and make them cheaper? like giving them 60 range, slower rotation and change cost to something like 550/170, i dunno, or you could make them a.k.a Tiger ace call-in where it costs only manpower to call-in and reduced fuel income by hmm, 50%?

b4 howitzer needs some love in team games. needs more accuracy and aoe

+1

You are correct in sensing a renewal of the Penal syndrome. However, if want to take a trip to the way-back machine, you will see that most complaints we got about Penals were completely off the mark/bullshit.

E.g., one of the top complaints we had was how the PTRS upgrade would make Luchs a completely useless never-build unit, etc.

If we only ever get feedback about the Jackson, of course you are only ever going to get Jackson changes.

That is what I meant exactly! However, the complaints about the penals being WAY too strong was indeed justified, as they are getting nerfed still. The same goes for the Jackson I fear.

As for the other changes, I love them. I can't emphasize how much I love them enough

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ok. If jackson's role change is due to 1v1, I have no objection to that since I don't play 1v1.

but i think i have enough usf 2v2+ games which i think probably mounts up to more than 500 games since past year and half during which time I played constantly getting good rank, I feel confident to state that Jackson was fine and is fine. It dies easy? tough luck. What were you doing for last 3 years not adapting?

Yeah, USF lack tank chasers/ finishers... USF has downsides - what faction doesn't? I fundamentally disagree with this kind of reasoning for giving a unit a new role. Doesn't USF do fine in 1v1, too? sure Jackson was a rare creature in recent tourneys due to call-in meta. And if USF does fine from balance point of view, the only reason to change Jackson's role (not minor stat readjustment) would be if its design was totally out of whack. I liked Jackson's squishy but packs a heavy punch role. I thought it was fine.

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to make myself clear, I have little qualms of changing Jackson as long as it does not become useless (which it is NOT right now) and I quite like the idea of shaking things up since it will give me a new toy to play with.

what I have problem with is what seems to be the bad reasoning, imo, to prompt a change. Like with things i mentioned before. Did t70's recon and cap needed to be combined? did cloaking speed nerf had to be auto-reversed? Did Jackson's role had to change from glass canon to tank chaser? these are preferences... yea, jackson in 1v1 is useless but I would be happy to discuss and play games with anyone arguing jackson is useless in 2v2+.

jackson in 1v1 is useless but I would be happy to discuss and play games with anyone arguing jackson is useless in 2v2+.

We can show you 3xOstheer vs. 3xUSF, bring it on!

All that Jackson arguing...
This is exactly where target tables should come in, to make it perform equally against both Wehrs and OKWs panther and also reliably defeat heavy tanks (if not used in an idio%tic way, of course), but at the same time, not one-shoot medium tanks

Do note on the Jackson it's likely only get a slight adjustment now. No more big reworks like Penals.

What is being discussed to ease the unit in:

1. Less accuracy. Primarily meant to make the M36 worse against medium vehicles and slightly worse at firing at distance.

2. Higher cost back near to the 1.0 levels. Given it's the most mobile TD with 40 sight, good health, good firepower, it should be pricer. This also leaves more room for M4 Shermans rather than just Jacksons and Scotts.

3. Reverting far-range penetration back to normal levels. Since this unit penetrates mediums regularly, no differences there. This is mainly to allow it to keep plinking at heavies, but for best effect, you want to close.

On other things: how is the Le.IG 18, Maxim and other units in the FBP? We've had around 8 pages of M36 discussions. We could make a thread on it instead if it gets more focus here.

We can show you 3xOstheer vs. 3xUSF, bring it on!

i can accept any inv during weekends if i am online. although i would be the only one.

good luck micro 4 jacksons kappa

4 is more easy than 5 right?
Keep being positive.

omg this topic is so stupid so u tell me whats the counter to the elefant with KT pls tell me, 2 jackson is ok ? U want balance between mediums but people sometimes forget how usf is hopeless vs heavy tanks i hope this patch will solve usf late game problems and i dont give garden about poor wermaht because this is myth that wermaht is weak yo

Says the man who doesn't play Wehrmacht yo