Conscripts y u so bad

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 09:26 AM__deleted__

I don´t want to be pesimistic, but if we give conscripts indoctrinal ppsh, we will have to remove their vet3 recieved accuracy bonus.

Because currently ppsh vet3 conscripts beat vet3 lmg grens, always. I run several tests and it always ended the same.

Even if conscripts run through red cover whole time without using ooorah and grens are in green cover - grens will lose.

Conscripts always win against grens if both are vet3, cons have ppsh and grens have lmg42.


SOLUTION: Make conscripts a cannot fodder unit. At vet 3 they get decrease in reinforcement cost (15-16 mp) and also decrease their "value" so other units vet less from killing vet3 conscripts (so they become cannon fodded but not vet fodder )

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 12:51 PMDangerous-Cloth

Well that is why you have panzergrenadiers.

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 13:07 PM__deleted__

So you want me to say that 240 mp unit with 40 munny upgrade should defeat 240 mp unit with 60 munny upgrade. Always ! No matter where each of these units stand. Even cover and tactical play won´t help grens

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 13:51 PMDangerous-Cloth

No not always, but grens suck vs pretty much everything, so it wouldn´t really matter in this case. The point being is that cons should´t keep on sucking just because grens suck lol.

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 15:00 PMShadowLinkX37

Can't we just make a ppsh doctrine good? Like change something out for mark target or something? Mark target is probably the best soviet ability in the game. Of course balance the doctrine so it doesn't become the next guard motor and spammed every game and balance cons accordingly but I don't see a problem with keeping it in doctrine.

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 14:35 PM__deleted__

all infantry squads should suck like grens. To add tactical depth. Right now vet3 rifles vs vet 5 volks is 5 second fight compared to vanilla factions combats

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 15:47 PMEtherealDragon

What Miragefla said - Cons just need their rifles adjusted so that they aren't a RNG unit that either A) Drops Models on the first volley and wins the engagement or B) Squad develops Parkinson's and can't hit crap.

The "High Model Count, Low Accuracy" design was fine at launch but hasn't aged all that well.

I suppose an alternative to straight up Buffing Cons is just adding a "Rifle Training" Upgrade (either HQ or Unlocked at Tier 3-4) that improves accuracy or something along those lines.

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 15:47 PMDangerous-Cloth

Agreed.

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 08:42 AMTickTack

I like this idea.

There are some other changes that'd be good though, like faster molotovs or molotov/nade package.

Your thoughts on these?

Jump back to quoted post11 Apr 2017, 23:20 PMMaret

How about to give cons "To the last man" ability like penals have? Replace this stupid "Flare mine" ability.

Jump back to quoted post13 Apr 2017, 00:36 AMAngrade (Ægion)

The delay does not interfere with the anti garrison or emplacements since it still goes off. It just adds in a bit of reaction time seeing that there extremely little to no room to dodge it like any other grenade.

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 17:26 PMImagelessbean

But a delay would be a serious nerf. Look at the molotov, that has a huge effective delay and it comes off as being a silly upgrade.

On the ahistoric portion of the flame nade, while I agree flame nades are fantasy, molotovs were used by all armies and they were common. If Volks had the ability changed to molotov it would be historically accurate, although it would be weird that it was different from scripts.

I used to advocated for reduced script cost at vet 3, so that they could be used for merge. This would make sense to me if they lost the received accuracy, as noted. This way conscripts would function like it cannon fodder, the original design, without being too good and overwhelming players.

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 17:44 PMc r u C e

So you advocated for them to continue being usseles,but worse?
Why cannon foder?
All the other factions base infantry scale decent in the late game with weapon upgrades...non doctrinal weapon upgrades...why is it necesary for these guys to be "support" or "utility" units and usseles in any combat situations excluding Ppsh commanders ?
Conscript's "usefulness" was being overshadowed by overperforming units(ROKS Penals,T70 or Maxim spam) but as these units are being corrected,you can clearly see that Conscripts are s**t.

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 16:57 PMFLTA

Molotovs are good enough in my opinion for 15mu, but they should be packaged with AT-nades or unlocked for free with T3/4.

At the moment unlocking them in early game sets you back a bit too much, especially since you most likely need AT-nades unlocked for 222 or Luchs.

Jump back to quoted post14 Apr 2017, 17:30 PMMaret

What about ability that will works like "Radio net" from sherman? More squads of cons more stronger effect will be (just thinking about limit of squads when effect not will be grow anymore). From one side this will do cons effective only in masses and useless one by one (like Relic want to see cons - masses infantry), from other side such blob will be vulnerable to MG, rocket artillery and will be weaker when one squad of blob retreating.