Ideas for the Missing 6th faction

Adding the US and OKW I understand - this is a financial move, Relic has experience in the US - remember the beta files: a video where the Americans fought on a snow map. But the British, without the third Axis faction - it's ridiculous.

I think part of the reason they went Western was because the got a lot of bad press from Russian players who felt they didn't do the Eastern Front justice. At least that's from what I heard, I can't remember exactly.

I reckon the reason the haven't made a third Axis faction is because they ran out of time before the scheduled release of DOW3 and couldn't fit another expansion in before then. I don't think they'd do it now because any content they make for a brand new game will generate far more Return on Investment than content for a game several years old.

-katanas
-turtle strats
-CoH2 has no navy
-no unit preservation ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
-obsolete medium "armor"
-a complete lack of heavy armor

#TeamAfrikaKorpsAndItaly

Lemme just throw your negatives out the window

-Katanas would belong to officers who also carried SMGs and side arms in the war. They would lead charges similar to oorah, also the more using the charge simultaneously the more bonuses they get. If you've played the FPS Red Orchestra 2 you'd know what I mean.

-Turtle strats? Bahahaha! NO! With a Non-heavy, lots of infantry type Army you'd need to focus on map control and beating the enemy early-midgame. Think USF.

- Coh2 has no Navy? Do they have arty guns magically hidden somewhere? Navy would simply be their off-map artillery. Seriously though haha, that one was so lazy.

- Obsolete medium armor. All just needs to be balanced in like any other vehicle. Ostwind barely saw production, KT etc. Yet you can build those... They would have lots of light vehicles, transports, and medium tanks.

- No Heavy armor? Oh that was the USF for the first 2 years wasn't it HAHAHA. Wasn't a problem then, Pershing was just icing on the cake and wanted by the fans. If you really wanted a heavy it would be a looted Jumbo Sherman stolen from USF and camo'd by the Japs.

As you can see nothing you've posted can't be easily solved. Not only would their army be far more unique than the Italians, it'd be much more fun to play. Not to mention the awesome commanders that would come to the Allies in the Pacific. Oh, and maps.

Afrika Korp and Italians are German Commanders for sure. Not Full Armies

Lemme just throw your negatives out the window

-Katanas would belong to officers who also carried SMGs and side arms in the war. They would lead charges similar to oorah, also the more using the charge simultaneously the more bonuses they get. If you've played the FPS Red Orchestra 2 you'd know what I mean.

-Turtle strats? Bahahaha! NO! With a Non-heavy, lots of infantry type Army you'd need to focus on map control and beating the enemy early-midgame. Think USF.

- Coh2 has no Navy? Do they have arty guns magically hidden somewhere? Navy would simply be their off-map artillery. Seriously though haha, that one was so lazy.

- Obsolete medium armor. All just needs to be balanced in like any other vehicle. Ostwind barely saw production, KT etc. Yet you can build those... They would have lots of light vehicles, transports, and medium tanks.

- No Heavy armor? Oh that was the USF for the first 2 years wasn't it HAHAHA. Wasn't a problem then, Pershing was just icing on the cake and wanted by the fans. If you really wanted a heavy it would be a looted Jumbo Sherman stolen from USF and camo'd by the Japs.

As you can see nothing you've posted can't be easily solved. Not only would their army be far more unique than the Italians, it'd be much more fun to play. Not to mention the awesome commanders that would come to the Allies in the Pacific. Oh, and maps.

Afrika Korp and Italians are German Commanders for sure. Not Full Armies

Lemme throw them back in.

-Katanas: no melee, pointless to have other than for A E S T H E T I C S
-Turtle strats: referring to how they actually fought irl with tunnels and bunkers
-Naval engagements made up a lot of the Pacific theater and to relegate it to just off-map would be doing the Pacific theater an injustice
-Obsolete medium armor WITH no heavy armor is hell to play. Ever try fighting in the late game with only light vehicles? Ever like it?

-Still no unit preservation

Lemme throw them back in.

-Katanas: no melee, pointless to have other than for A E S T H E T I C S
-Turtle strats: referring to how they actually fought irl with tunnels and bunkers
-Naval engagements made up a lot of the Pacific theater and to relegate it to just off-map would be doing the Pacific theater an injustice
-Obsolete medium armor WITH no heavy armor is hell to play. Ever try fighting in the late game with only light vehicles? Ever like it?

-Still no unit preservation

I don't agree, Japan has Type 4 Chi-To - It will be the doctrine Firefly analog

And Type 5 Chi-Ri (available one per fight, produced in one copy) - Tiger analog, but will be more mobile


Italians can only dream of such analogs, or of course use German technology to fill in the gaps. But the fact is that the Germans used the Italians. So it will be the third German faction with Italians elements.

Yeah but only 20 Pershings were used on the Western Front and seen minimal combat. Should the Pershing be taken out then? Relic left historical accuracy behind a long time ago. I still favour the P1 for solid gameplay and a variety of upgrades, deepening strategy. And the P2 is fine but the P1 is just way too far? I don't see how its a massive leap.

snip

The reason I decided against it though was because if you put the Italians in the main faction, you can't have Eastern Front Non German powers in the Doctrines. Italians and Hungarians in the same faction? Relic plays fast and loose with historical accuracy but they at least retain some continuity. If by trying to increase variety by having Italians in the main faction, you really are diminishing it. That's why I still believe this design is optimal for balance, variety, nostalgia and strategic diversity.

Having said this though, if Relic were to release an Italian faction I wouldn't be disappointed.

The reason why the PzII is in the game is because the Luchs variant was a continuation and modernization of the PzII that was actually fielded in combat in 1943-1945. You may make the argument that Comets, Pershings, and Sturmtigers had very small numbers that saw action, but at least it was some action (I agree it's stupid they're in the game though). With the PzI, I can assure you that they saw no action whatsoever after they realized it was completely obsolete in 1941.

I think a lot of Germany's non-German force in the East was already covered (albeit very lazily) by Osttruppen. I don't think it would be realistic for Relic to go back and say "oh yeah let's add some Osttruppen reskins to cover the other half of the non-Germans" for doctrinal units of a new faction. I mean, it's not realistic for Relic to pay attention to CoH2 anymore either, but just in case they prove me wrong about their corporate attitude (please do) I think that an German-Italian faction is more easily pictured (and therefore more easily developed) than one that is a bit of this and a bit of that. It's easier for a dev team to look at a solid central idea that everyone already has an idea of and go off from there.

snip

Chi-Ri: more like the nonexistant Maus analog, since it never saw combat despite the almost finished (still incomplete) prototype.

Cheeto: maybe closer to the Tiger (Ace?), but still: only 2 were built, and neither saw combat, undercutting even the Comet/Pershing/Sturmtiger's low and dismal combat participation. Having a doctrinal 1-time call in Firefly equivalent isn't what I'd call viable armor for the whole faction.

Shameless self-promotion:

https://www.coh2.org/topic/55138/luftwaffe-ground-forces-faction-concept

Chi-Ri: more like the nonexistant Maus analog, since it never saw combat despite the almost finished (still incomplete) prototype.

Cheeto: maybe closer to the Tiger (Ace?), but still: only 2 were built, and neither saw combat, undercutting even the Comet/Pershing/Sturmtiger's low and dismal combat participation. Having a doctrinal 1-time call in Firefly equivalent isn't what I'd call viable armor for the whole faction.

Yes, I know that they did not participate in the battles.
- Chi-Ri by mass and armor is still closer to the Tiger (Elite Tiger analog)
- Chi-To was something from 2 to 7

Yes, I know that they did not participate in the battles.
- Chi-Ri by mass and armor is still closer to the Tiger (Elite Tiger analog)
- Chi-To was something from 2 to 7

Not participate in battles = off the table. Comet, Pershing, and Sturmtiger all at least participated SOMEWHERE. Having an incomplete prototype of a tank that is in the same class as a Tiger doesn't translate directly into a Tiger equivalent in the game. Maus had 3 incomplete prototypes, and is a lot more famous, and it didn't get added to the game because of the same reason: it never saw combat at all. Therefore, the Chi-Ri is in the same situation as the Maus.

It's 2. The Japanese built 6 hulls for their Cheetos, but only completed 2.

The reason why the PzII is in the game is because the Luchs variant was a continuation and modernization of the PzII that was actually fielded in combat in 1943-1945. You may make the argument that Comets, Pershings, and Sturmtigers had very small numbers that saw action, but at least it was some action (I agree it's stupid they're in the game though). With the PzI, I can assure you that they saw no action whatsoever after they realized it was completely obsolete in 1941.

#

This isnt true of the variations however, a lot of the P1 variants were used up until at least 1944. You could still say that the standard P1 wasn't fielded, but is its inclusion any more questionable than Comets/Pershings/Sturmtigers etc? I think that its just nit picking. Relic has played far more fast and loose with historical inaccuracy in the past (Think V1 being used against tanks).

Besides, I've always argued that the P1 should be included for good gameplay reasons even if its mildly historically inaccurate. At the end of the day, it is a game.

I think a lot of Germany's non-German force in the East was already covered (albeit very lazily) by Osttruppen. I don't think it would be realistic for Relic to go back and say "oh yeah let's add some Osttruppen reskins to cover the other half of the non-Germans" for doctrinal units of a new faction. I mean, it's not realistic for Relic to pay attention to CoH2 anymore either, but just in case they prove me wrong about their corporate attitude (please do) I think that an German-Italian faction is more easily pictured (and therefore more easily developed) than one that is a bit of this and a bit of that. It's easier for a dev team to look at a solid central idea that everyone already has an idea of and go off from there.

Yeah but they don't really specify who the Osttruppen are, so who's to say they aren't Axis Russians? I really don't think anyone would throw a fuss over it anyway, they'd just be happy to get cool unique content.

And I really don't see what's so complicated about having a German faction with non German doctrines. It's really as simple as that. Like I said though, I really wouldn't mind seeing an Africa Korps.

There is no missing 6th faction.

There is nothing that says there needs to be an equal number of factions across both sides.

The decision to release an asymmetric third Allied faction (with powerful lategame armour) was probably made at least in part due to the fact there was a larger percentage of Axis players queued in team games after WFA released.

There is no missing 6th faction.

There is nothing that says there needs to be an equal number of factions across both sides.

The decision to release an asymmetric third Allied faction (with powerful lategame armour) was probably made at least in part due to the fact there was a larger percentage of Axis players queued in team games after WFA released.

Nah I think it was far more likely that they released it as a stopgap between Coh2 and DOW3. When they realized they needed to start DOW3 plans for the 6th were shelved I'd say.

Yeah but only 20 Pershings were used on the Western Front and seen minimal combat.

Only 40 ostwind but yeah u can spam them in game
Pershing is limited to one so u know more realistic !

Damn.. You have no life bro?

Damn.. You have no life bro?

Says the Internet Troll

Says the Internet Troll

No, seriously though, how could you arrange that much of a time for that much of an impractical and cringey idea?

No, seriously though, how could you arrange that much of a time for that much of an impractical and cringey idea?

Meh. We each have our own things we enjoy. If we enjoy doing it and it makes us happy why wouldn't we spend time doing it. I don't see how anyone could have a problem with that.

And it didn't take that long anyway. A evening I think.

Doing a Japan faction would be silly, the maps wouldn't translate well into essence 3.0 and should be left for a new game tbh.

Would be better to go with afrika corp but in all honesty I feel like the DOW3 flop may have push up the release for a new coh.

Japan, Italy, and North Africa need to be added to this game.