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RELIC'S WPC Change of plan

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10 Sep 2016, 23:43 PM
#101
avatar of DevM
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jump backJump back to quoted post10 Sep 2016, 23:39 PMpage305


A retroactive DQ would disqualify Nog before he and Von played. So Von would be the one to move on.


In that case you would have to give hans a chance too since he also played noggano for it to be fair.
10 Sep 2016, 23:48 PM
#102
avatar of page305

Posts: 26

jump backJump back to quoted post10 Sep 2016, 23:43 PMDevM


In that case you would have to give hans a chance too since he also played noggano for it to be fair.


Not true. The scenario I mentioned fixes this acute problem with minimal impact on the tourney.

Your viewpoint says he should be DQ'd to the start which would ruin the whole tourney. Sotjador would have to play Quentin, winner would have to play Hans, winner would have to play Von. This is unfair to Von b/c he already won his spot (and risked losing that spot once). Why should he have to re-defend it and risk losing it again?
10 Sep 2016, 23:50 PM
#103
avatar of AmiPolizeiFunk
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Posts: 16697 | Subs: 12

I feel for Noggano. It pains me to think that one of the top players in this scene who earned the right to fight for the championship is now really wishing we didn't reach the 5th milestone. Now he's thinking, "dang, I shoulda lost intentionally in the Semi-Finals so at least I would still have a chance to win $750." It's all just so backwards.

Without Noggano playing in the finals, this event is pretty much borked. His run was exciting to watch and he achieved some great upsets. DevM already beat Jesulin, I hardly want to see them play again. Von didn't earn a spot in the finals, I don't want to see him vs. DevM either. If Relic is gonna flat-out DQ the guy that earned the spot based on some fine print rule technicality, they should at least compensate him. Major Bloodnock was right... if having a passport was a requirement, passports should have been checked at the start, not right before the finals.

I was really looking forward to VonIvan vs. Jesulin for 3rd place... I thought that was gonna be a pretty good match-up and a fun set for a really good prize ($750 is a lot for this scene).
10 Sep 2016, 23:55 PM
#104
avatar of page305

Posts: 26

I feel for Noggano. It pains me to think that one of the top players in this scene who earned the right to fight for the championship is now really wishing we didn't reach the 5th milestone. Now he's thinking, "dang, I shoulda lost intentionally in the Semi-Finals so at least I would still have a chance to win $750." It's all just so backwards.

Without Noggano playing in the finals, this event is pretty much borked. His run was exciting to watch and he achieved some great upsets. DevM already beat Jesulin, I hardly want to see them play again. Von didn't earn a spot in the finals, I don't want to see him vs. DevM either. If Relic is gonna flat-out DQ the guy that earned the spot based on some fine print rule technicality, they should at least compensate him. Major Bloodnock was right... if having a passport was a requirement, passports should have been checked at the start, not right before the finals.

I was really looking forward to VonIvan vs. Jesulin for 3rd place... I thought that was gonna be a pretty good match-up and a fun set for a really good prize ($750 is a lot for this scene).


If there has to be a DQ, why not do it in a way so no one is really punished. I'm not saying it's ideal, but I feel it's damage control with no real victims. Von gets a pass only because he happened to be the one who played against Noggano in the most recent match. How else could you fix the DQ without someone really losing out. If Nog is DQ'd from the finals alone then someone has to either get a free pass, a second chance at playing or someone has to defend their spot a second time. I think that would be far more damaging to someone that has no fault (just my opinion obviously).

I guess 3rd/4th match could be a match for 3rd and winner moves to 1st/2nd match. Then one still loses out (Nog).
10 Sep 2016, 23:58 PM
#105
avatar of AmiPolizeiFunk
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This is so ridiculous. If you DQ a player, the other player wins.

In what universe do we wind back the clock and give somebody else a chance???

If you DQ Noggano, Devm wins. That's just basic tournament rules. It's a single-elimination tournament. Those who lost (Von, Jesulin, and all the rest), ARE ELIMINATED. What are we playing here, Back to the Future?
11 Sep 2016, 00:06 AM
#106
avatar of page305

Posts: 26

This is so ridiculous. If you DQ a player, the other player wins.

In what universe do we wind back the clock and give somebody else a chance???

If you DQ Noggano, Devm wins. That's just basic tournament rules. It's a single-elimination tournament. Those who lost (Von, Jesulin, and all the rest), ARE ELIMINATED. What are we playing here, Back to the Future?


So the tourney ends with a 1st place ribbon and no final event or trip for the other competitors. Good call.

Tourney is over everyone, no finals. Ami says so.

Had this happened in OCF you'd bend over backwards to fix this someway somehow. You wouldn't have just cancelled the finals to follow strict rules in the serious world of video games... you know that.
11 Sep 2016, 00:09 AM
#107
avatar of FichtenMoped
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jump backJump back to quoted post11 Sep 2016, 00:06 AMpage305


So the tourney ends with a 1st place ribbon and no final event or trip for the other competitors. Good call.

Tourney is over everyone, no finals. Ami says so.

Had this happened in OCF you'd bend over backwards to fix this someway somehow. You wouldn't have just cancelled the finals to follow strict rules in the serious world of video games... you know that.


+1
11 Sep 2016, 00:12 AM
#108
avatar of TheMachine
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It's messy but Noganno had about 2 months to get a passport sorted and made absolutely no attempt to do so, nobody's fault but his own.

The trip to Vancouver was entirely free, for the tournament that he entered for free. If he can't adhere to the tournaments rules and the terms and conditions that were disclaimed at the start, too bad, someone should take his place.
11 Sep 2016, 00:16 AM
#109
avatar of AmiPolizeiFunk
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So are we following strict rules or not? You can't have it both ways. You wanna follow strict rules to DQ Noggano but you wanna bend the rules of a single-elimination tournament to allow the other guys another chance?
11 Sep 2016, 00:17 AM
#110
avatar of page305

Posts: 26

It's messy but Noganno had about 2 months to get a passport sorted and made absolutely no attempt to do so, nobody's fault but his own.

The trip to Vancouver was entirely free, for the tournament that he entered for free. If he can't adhere to the tournaments rules and the terms and conditions that were disclaimed at the start, too bad, someone should take his place.


SO how do you fix this without ruining the tourney entirely? I suggested a way that no one would be hurt (including Nog), minimal impact on the bracket and the tourney would go on. (https://www.coh2.org/topic/56348/relic-s-wpc-change-of-plan/post/567419)

If everyone is so set on kicking Nog out entirely, it can still be done without ruining the tournament. DQ him at the match against Von. Von "wins" that match (#29) and moves to the final with a free pass. Jesulin win 3rd with no opponent and the final still happens.
11 Sep 2016, 00:21 AM
#111
avatar of page305

Posts: 26

So are we following strict rules or not? You can't have it both ways. You wanna follow strict rules to DQ Noggano but you wanna bend the rules of a single-elimination tournament to allow the other guys another chance?


You must not have read my initial suggestion. What other guys are getting a second chance?
11 Sep 2016, 00:23 AM
#112
avatar of AmiPolizeiFunk
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Wow TheMachine. Vilifying Noggano is adding insult to injury. Please don't do it.

When I first read the idea of War Paint, I knew at that very moment that if a Russian would make the finals (i.e. Jove), and if the 5th milestone was reached (two big if's), this would be a problem. It is not easy for a Russian to get a passport and a travel visa in a timely manner. This is a notorious problem in other huge games like CS:GO and DOTA2. What good would it have done had he bent over backwards trying to get a passport 2 months ago when it generally takes 3 months to get one? And what if he made all of those efforts and he didn't even make the finals? The hassle probably wasn't even worth it to him. Are you saying he should have not played at all? That's crap.
11 Sep 2016, 01:09 AM
#113
avatar of Thunderhun

Posts: 1617

jump backJump back to quoted post9 Sep 2016, 19:35 PMGdot


ALL WE NEED IS ONE AMERICAN.


BELIEVE :hansGASM:
11 Sep 2016, 05:09 AM
#114
avatar of VonIvan

Posts: 2487 | Subs: 21

11 Sep 2016, 05:30 AM
#115
avatar of iTzDusty

Posts: 836 | Subs: 5

Relic originally announced that the finals would take place on Sept.11th, one week after the Quarters/Semis. Thinking that two players could be flown from anywhere in the world to Vancouver with less than 7 days to arrange the trips was a ludicrous notion in the first place. We all saw problems with this coming from a mile away.

To then go and cite some fine print in the rules to DISQUALIFY NOGGANO for not being able to satisfy this condition is completely and utterly unfair and unreasonable. The original plan/rules said ONE WEEK. What is it now, one month? A month in a half? Things are being changed along the way, so you can't go and say "well he broke the terms and conditions of the rules" because you are changing those rules as we go. Basically, Noggano should not be blamed for poor planning on Relic's part. He deserves the second place prize at minimum.


Relic clearly stated that if milestone 5 were to be hit, that the grand finals would be delayed pending travel planning.

Yeah, I agree its a fucked situation, but don't make things up.

Give Noggano the 2nd place prize money, let whatever two guys get flown out fight for the 1st place and 3rd place money, problem solved.
11 Sep 2016, 07:40 AM
#116
avatar of I984

Posts: 224

This is so ridiculous. If you DQ a player, the other player wins.

In what universe do we wind back the clock and give somebody else a chance???

If you DQ Noggano, Devm wins. That's just basic tournament rules. It's a single-elimination tournament. Those who lost (Von, Jesulin, and all the rest), ARE ELIMINATED. What are we playing here, Back to the Future?


This is actually the point here.

We have two guys in the final, one forfeits, thing is over, end of story.
11 Sep 2016, 09:03 AM
#117
avatar of vasa1719

Posts: 2635 | Subs: 4

Permanently Banned
It's messy but Noganno had about 2 months to get a passport sorted and made absolutely no attempt to do so, nobody's fault but his own.

The trip to Vancouver was entirely free, for the tournament that he entered for free. If he can't adhere to the tournaments rules and the terms and conditions that were disclaimed at the start, too bad, someone should take his place.


Do you know how make passport in Russia ? How many its cost ? Do you know what documents need for him and time to get it ? Before you write it ?
11 Sep 2016, 09:10 AM
#118
avatar of vasa1719

Posts: 2635 | Subs: 4

Permanently Banned


Tournament organization from Relic just FailFish and NotLikeThis (change brackets 4Head). People blame Noggano, but dont blame Relic BrookeBack. If you change rules (battle whos gone instead Noggano), so i dont see problem that he play from Russia final vs DevM (in both exmaple you change rules). To be honest i respect Jesulin and Ivan, but imo now thay are to weak vs DevM and its be game only one goal.
11 Sep 2016, 09:11 AM
#119
avatar of alcoholic
Patrion 15

Posts: 93

I really apreciate that relic organizes this tournament, but can someone enlighten me about what the point is to fly the players to Vancouver in the first place?
I really dont get it. Is it meant to be part of the price? To me it feels more like a punishment in the first place. And if it is meant to be part of the price, is it not kind of silliy to disqualiify someone that cant accept the price?
11 Sep 2016, 09:19 AM
#120
avatar of MajorBloodnok
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Do you know how make passport in Russia ? How many its cost ? Do you know what documents need for him and time to get it ? Before you write it ?


I rather suspect you might. Do enlighten us. :)

According to this guide for Russians already abroad, it could take 3 months. I assume that time limits for domestic applications will be little different.

http://travel.stackexchange.com/questions/46679/how-long-should-it-take-to-get-a-russian-passport

In the circumstances of this competition, it seems unlikely that Noggano could ever have obtained a passport in the WPC time limits. Hence my earlier suggestion that passports be checked at the start.

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Rosbone: It is really hard to tell people to buy the DLC with feeling like they are throwing their money down the toilet for a nearly dead game. But Big Tonks!!! Oh well, not my problem.
Yesterday, 18:12 PM
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Yesterday, 18:10 PM
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Yesterday, 18:09 PM
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Yesterday, 16:42 PM
aerafield: What? No, he means that all the new maps are for 1v1. Though Im pretty sure they will be playable in 2v2 as well
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Willy Pete: Are the maps really locked behind dlc? Surely they must be in the regular update
Yesterday, 15:22 PM
Rosbone: I would like to join in celebration with the 9% of Coh3 MP players who are getting ALL of the new maps. Woohoo! #3Tards
Last Friday, 19:22 PM
OKSpitfire: I hope that at least one of heavies is a like-for-like reskin of the coh 2 ISU-152. I miss that thing.
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Rosbone: Buy our cool new large tanks that will never get played on the 4 new 1v1 maps added. Perfect synergy! :facepalm:
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Rosbone: Everyone ready for some deep penetration :snfPeter:
Last Thursday, 17:13 PM
Lady Xenarra: I'm sure the ppl who defended it as balanced for Allies will be screaming like they got scaled with boiling water, in COH3. How the tables turn.
Last Thursday, 11:33 AM
Willy Pete: I think it was nuts with any engine damage. Especially on superheavies
Last Thursday, 07:03 AM
aerafield: Personally I think without the ram ability, it's worse than loiters for example
Last Thursday, 00:09 AM
Willy Pete: It combined well with most slowing abilities, not just ram stuns
19 Feb 2025, 23:36 PM
Willy Pete: Only??? I think not being able to shoot it down and the ramp up effect also had something to do with it
19 Feb 2025, 23:34 PM
Willy Pete: Really
19 Feb 2025, 23:30 PM
aerafield: AT overwatch was broken only because it came with the faction of T34 ramming
19 Feb 2025, 22:29 PM
Willy Pete: Love to see Relic really learning from their past mistakes. Let's bring back the dumbest ability in coh2, and charge money for it
19 Feb 2025, 20:34 PM
Willy Pete: New DAK commander will have AT overwatch as alternate choice to elefant
19 Feb 2025, 20:33 PM
aaa: Funy thing new players dont know that. And are trying to compete vs hacks
19 Feb 2025, 10:33 AM
aaa: Online gaming is trash in general, not just coh. On high level there are all cheats in most games
19 Feb 2025, 10:24 AM
aaa: 2 cheaters in 3 days. MH and DH
19 Feb 2025, 09:57 AM
aerafield: I am a simple man, I build Humvees with Pathfinders and Missile Launchers inside, I am happy
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aerafield: those who know, know: https://www.reddit.com/r/CompanyOfHeroes/s/fPk4yLIgmK
18 Feb 2025, 15:40 PM
adamírcz: Might be onto somethin here, combine side armour existing, maps where flanking is a viable option, and hopefully also heavies actually being less manouverable than mediums (lookin at you coh2), and it might be fun gameplay
17 Feb 2025, 13:39 PM
Willy Pete: Shouldn't coh3 heavies actually have insane front armor values? The glory days of 400+ Kt armor wouldn't be as bad when side armor is a thing. Not to say its a good idea lol
14 Feb 2025, 23:14 PM
aerafield: But then again, maybe CoH3 superheavies should actually have insane armor values because the whole game is designed for the clumsy & inept anyway :snfPeter:
14 Feb 2025, 23:04 PM
aerafield: It's like you have to coordinate an entire orchestra of abilities and the correct units, meanwhile your opponent just clicks his 1 superheavy tank occasionally...
14 Feb 2025, 23:01 PM
aerafield: the giga frontal armor also made these units too oppressive in average or low ELO games
14 Feb 2025, 22:59 PM
aerafield: Massive HP pool but reasonable amount of armor is way healthier design
14 Feb 2025, 22:57 PM
aerafield: Say what you want, but the titanium frontal armor design of coh2 superheavies was bullshit. Too many bad players not getting punished for their bad micro because penetration RNG carries them
14 Feb 2025, 22:57 PM
Willy Pete: Also the attack ground with the pak40 looked perfect, that Pershing should be dead
14 Feb 2025, 19:18 PM
Willy Pete: Ahh just saw the other one that died. Some bad rng I think but there was an AT gun at med range for a chunk of that fight
14 Feb 2025, 19:14 PM
Willy Pete: Which KT? I saw one got almost deleted but it also showed its side to a hellcat AND the m5. I think the player even admitted he got lucky
14 Feb 2025, 19:10 PM
Lady Xenarra: I understand that the devs want to sell the Allied part of the DLC, but the KT got swiss cheesed like a COH2 bunker on treads :S
14 Feb 2025, 15:16 PM
SupremeStefan: They should make dlc separataly for axis and alies
14 Feb 2025, 10:28 AM
SupremeStefan: 25$ is actually a ok price for 40 abilites = 8 commanders = 4 battlegroups. But problem is that it comes in bundle
14 Feb 2025, 10:24 AM
Willy Pete: Have they shown the actual trees yet for the new commanders? Skimmed through the deep dive today, didnt see em
13 Feb 2025, 22:29 PM
Rosbone: Big Tonk boners incoming :hansGASM:
13 Feb 2025, 17:38 PM
donofsandiego: Probably not
12 Feb 2025, 14:57 PM
Lone-Wolf: Hi guys. Error code -4. Any fixes?
08 Feb 2025, 17:09 PM
donofsandiego: Probably not
07 Feb 2025, 16:57 PM
SkYisTheLimiT_CoH: any coh2.org admin there ?
07 Feb 2025, 12:43 PM
Lady Xenarra: Ever the contrarian, aerafield.
07 Feb 2025, 11:59 AM
aerafield: I havent seen the new units in action yet (whose BGs will not be purchased by too many people as they are pretty expensive I recon), but I can say with 100% confidence that the Pershing needs a buff
07 Feb 2025, 02:31 AM
Lady Xenarra: I would think lots more players would come/return since there's so many iconic units being added in the new BGs. I just don't want to hear another 8+ yrs of Pershing need buff complaints
06 Feb 2025, 23:22 PM
adamírcz: If I had my supply of copium, Id say they might at least get enough money to not have to wait 5 months with problems that should be a matter of bi-weekly hotfix
06 Feb 2025, 23:10 PM
adamírcz: I mean, its overpriced,
06 Feb 2025, 23:10 PM
Rosbone: Will it help or hurt the current player base is the real question. Should add more players, but may drive many away.
06 Feb 2025, 19:17 PM
Rosbone: Yes you too can play with a persdhing for the low price of $24.99 USD. Or be the poor schlub who gets his rectum reconfigured who doesnt have the latest pay to win stuffs.
06 Feb 2025, 19:16 PM
donofsandiego: persdhing in coh 3? 😳
06 Feb 2025, 18:42 PM
Rosbone: @aerafield Ahhh, I think I made a pershing like twice in my life since that commander is pretty bad in 4s.
05 Feb 2025, 23:20 PM
aerafield: @Rosbone coh2 pershing has the same ability so, whatever. Though it's probably gonna be a 30 seconds ability to make it super broken pay to win, then 2 months later it will get "hotfixed" into a skillshot like coh2 pershing
05 Feb 2025, 22:00 PM
Rosbone: How do we feel about Pershing shooting thru multiple buildings?
05 Feb 2025, 19:43 PM
Rosbone: I am just happy Relic was smart enough to put this out now because the community was falling asleep waiting 3 months between patches. And a new/old map was shown :banana:
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aerafield: Not even the trailer can hide the trash sound effects
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Lady Xenarra: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSvwH2mXje8 Well this should result in 'interesting' reactions... :rofl:
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