Let's Talk: Sd.Kfz. 222

I find the current design of 222 v light tanks to mirror USF mediums versus axis heavies. The arguments similarly so.

Lets not forget how long it takes to heal these things. One of the main reason why going two of them can bite you in the ass. Your reducing mine sweeper/flame presence on the field

We're talking cost effectiveness.
What you get for the money you paid.
Put WC51, M3, Greyhound, M20 and 222 next to each other and you'll see one greatly standing out with what it does and for what you pay.


You realize that changes literally NOTHING? Not even the amount of PTRS shots it takes? And you still have too cost efficient vehicle.


Pair of 222s doesn't struggle nor needs a long time to kill T70, front or rear, doesn't matter, it'll be dead within next 10-15 seconds.
AEC is hardcountered by dual 222 which cost considerably less then AEC.
Only Stuart can stand up to them.


Again, 2x222 hardcounters AEC for considerably lesser cost. If you micro better then average potato, you won't even lose single 222.

you keep going on about the 222's effectiveness against vehicle, but ignore the 222's weakness against infantry.

conscript at nades and USF weapon are pretty cheap. Both of those upgrade cost less then what it takes for the wehr to even buy one 222. There isn't really an excuse for the USF or the soviet to not have enough fuel by the time the wehr get a 222.

you keep going on about the 222's effectiveness against vehicle, but ignore the 222's weakness against infantry.

conscript at nades and USF weapon are pretty cheap. Both of those upgrade cost less then what it takes for the wehr to even buy one 222. There isn't really an excuse for the USF or the soviet to not have enough fuel by the time the wehr get a 222.

Unless that infantry has hard or soft AT, 222 will route it easily.

Unless that infantry has hard or soft AT, 222 will route it easily.

So like a lone capping tommie squad or penal battalion a 222 can push off, but take damage enough to need repairs from pioneers.

I guess you could call that cost effective. It also cant recap or stall the squad either so that pio pretty much has to go along in that situation.

I dunno I find that the 222 is still pretty awkward in that it's entire pupose is to currently shut down allies rushing a light vehicle for shock value.

I don't think that is its best role or even a good one, but I would not call that gimmicky usage OP.

So like a lone capping tommie squad or penal battalion a 222 can push off, but take damage enough to need repairs from pioneers.

I guess you could call that cost effective. It also cant recap or stall the squad either so that pio pretty much has to go along in that situation.

I dunno I find that the 222 is still pretty awkward in that it's entire pupose is to currently shut down allies rushing a light vehicle for shock value.

I don't think that is its best role or even a good one, but I would not call that gimmicky usage OP.

That's the gist of the problem, it got the health buff so it could be pressed into service as an early AT unit to compensate for the trouble OH was having with that. If the AI capabilities are buffed the cost will need to increase, potentially making it too expensive to serve in that makeshift AT role.

I dunno I find that the 222 is still pretty awkward in that it's entire pupose is to currently shut down allies rushing a light vehicle for shock value.

Sure, would be much better if turbo-firing T70s could freely roam the fields, right?
'cuz dont tell me allies should get an AT weapon to deal with vehicles... thats nonsense..

Discussing a single Medium / Light Vehicle doesn't solve the problem. Smaller Tanks ( t70, P II , Stuart , AEC and 222) are too predominant in this game at the moment and rendering complete Teching Trees like Tier 1 of USF and Soviet useless in competative 1v1 environments.
All of these vehicles need to be looked at concerning balance and pricing.

Discussing a single Medium / Light Vehicle doesn't solve the problem. Smaller Tanks ( t70, P II , Stuart , AEC and 222) are too predominant in this game at the moment and rendering complete Teching Trees like Tier 1 of USF and Soviet useless in competative 1v1 environments.
All of these vehicles need to be looked at concerning balance and pricing.

yes, yes , yes.

Until light vehicles stop acting like mobile death-dealing machines, this game won't stop being cancer.

yes, yes , yes.

Until light vehicles stop acting like mobile death-dealing machines, this game won't stop being cancer.

I don't think it's a problem with light vehicle lethality as much as it is a problem of timing and shock value. The Centaur, for example, is significantly more lethal than a T-70 but because it arrives at roughly the same time as a Stug or Panzer IV it can't run around the map effectively unopposed.

I don't think it's a problem with light vehicle lethality as much as it is a problem of timing and shock value. The Centaur, for example, is significantly more lethal than a T-70 but because it arrives at roughly the same time as a Stug or Panzer IV it can't run around the map effectively unopposed.

So if you wanted to "nerf" light vechs so that they come out 10 min later, I'd be ok with that. This means I'll actually have some AT options from multiple sources.

So if you wanted to "nerf" light vechs so that they come out 10 min later, I'd be ok with that. This means I'll actually have some AT options from multiple sources.

But wasn't it one of Relic's intended design changes that had light vehicles last longer and medium armour come later? I recall that was the reason why they upped the original CPs for heavy and medium call-ins and raised cost to tech and get tanks- they wanted players to spend more time in mid-game. Which just means 222s running around.

I agree that was their intended design, which is why I'm suggesting their lethality be severely limited in favor of a more harassmen/recon/utility role (think of the OKW Puma).

Truly what makes this game so frustrating to play is the fact a player can build a light tank or two and just go haywire against the enemy without putting in very much effort. Like when did you get a squad 1-shotted by a t70 and think - "damn this guy is so good, his plays crushed me..." (Never!).

I was never much of a vCoH player, but a lot of the gimping vehicles we see and have seen in CoH2 just don't exist in that game (and as such, fit the more slower paced and longer lasting fire-fights in vCoH as well as the more controllable loss of life to squads). Compare this to CoH2, where they ramp up the lethality on a lot of stuff still in this game - mostly tanks (tank RNG shots in general, t70, P2, demos, laser-lmg accuracy).

In fact, I remember seeing many builds in vCoH that really didn't rely on fuel and tank teching at all and only used the occasional vech as a side thought or for a special purpose (since infantry could not be instantly pushed back by the sight of a tank). This is in direct contrast to CoH2 where the meta heavily revolves around who builds what tank first and how many squad kills can that tank nail.

Relic wanted to increase the windows time for light tanks play. Problem is OStheer doesn't have light tanks.