Login

russian armor
COH2.ORG » Forums » Parlor Room » COH2 Central » COH2 Balance » Teamkill-rate of Allies-arty??

Teamkill-rate of Allies-arty??

PAGES (2)down
New topic New topic     Upload replay New Reply
What do you prefer?
Option Distribution Votes
13%
65%
22%
Total votes: 60
Vote VOTE! Vote ABSTAIN
aerafield
12 Jul 2016, 13:43 PM
#1
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 3032 | Subs: 3

Hey there, if you compare the friendly-fire damage of axis- and allies-arty, you will see that Panzerwerfer and Stuka SMASH their allied troops(yours/ your teammates'), while their allies counterparts (Katyusha,Calliope,Land matress etc.) maybe deal 5% damage to your own or your teammate's units like "Hey, I don't really care that you've hit me, it's ok :)"

And this makes no sense... so it should be either no teamkills or a realistic (high) teamkillrate for BOTH. I prefer the realistic high model(what we currently have on axis arty) because this would mean that players need to think more about their arty usage if they wanna use it in case of supporting their teammate during his push, and need to communicate more like "Hey watch out, I'm shooting there"

Btw this realistic teamkillrate also would make sense for all mortars in this game, wouldn't it?
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
NEVEC
12 Jul 2016, 14:34 PM
#2
avatar of NEVEC

Posts: 708 | Subs: 1

What is this thread supposed to mean? Explosive weapons (all of them) doing like 10-0% of damage to friendly units.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
|GB| The Hooligan486
12 Jul 2016, 14:36 PM
#3
avatar of |GB| The Hooligan486
Senior Referee Badge

Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jul 2016, 13:43 PMaerafield
Hey there, if you compare the friendly-fire damage of axis- and allies-arty, you will see that Panzerwerfer and Stuka SMASH their allied troops(yours/ your teammates'), while their allies opponents (Katyusha,Calliope,Land matress etc.) maybe deal 5% damage to your own or your teammate's units like "Hey, I don't really care that you've hit me, it's ok :)"

And this makes no sense... so it should be either no teamkills or a realistic (high) teamkillrate for BOTH. I prefer the realistic high model(what we currently have on axis arty) because this would mean that players need to think more about their arty usage if they wanna use it in case of supporting their teammate during his push, and need to communicate more like "Hey watch out, I'm shooting there"

Btw this realistic teamkillrate also would make sense for all mortars in this game, wouldn't it?

Can't agree more, +1000 for the realistic version
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
wouren
12 Jul 2016, 16:20 PM
#4
avatar of wouren
Senior Social Media Manager Badge

Posts: 1281 | Subs: 3

Can someone screenshot the stat page for each weapon's friendly fire damage?
The COH2.ORG official discord!
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Imagelessbean
12 Jul 2016, 16:53 PM
#5
avatar of Imagelessbean

Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1

Just a quick warning, making allied arty do high damage to friendly fire would make griefing easier in team games. If not for this I would like to see all arty be lethal and ignore unit owner modifiers.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
skyshark
12 Jul 2016, 17:34 PM
#6
avatar of skyshark

Posts: 239

i think i remember seeing someone smart (like cruzz) saying that arty friendly fire does only 25% damage.

this is ridiculous, since it rewards blobbing and careless play. arty should do full damage to both sides.

if your teammates decide to drop indirect on your base/buildings, then... pick new teammates?
Playercard of SHARK

1v1: Pstreak: + 1
1v1: Pstreak: + 4
2v2: Pstreak: + 1with Good Ol' Czepis
2v2: Pstreak: - 3with Good Ol' Czepis


Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Tiger Baron
12 Jul 2016, 17:42 PM
#7
avatar of Tiger Baron

Posts: 3145 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jul 2016, 17:34 PMskyshark
i think i remember seeing someone smart (like cruzz) saying that arty friendly fire does only 25% damage.

this is ridiculous, since it rewards blobbing and careless play. arty should do full damage to both sides.

if your teammates decide to drop indirect on your base/buildings, then... pick new teammates?


Someone smart lmao, he's just a modder, that's why he's so "smart" as you say.

But seriously, making arty more lethal to your Allies is going to be a troll/griefer's dream and this game isn't exactly a General Simulator so I suggest we actually DON'T stimulate more griefers and trolls to try to and shoot their teammates' units/buildings.

I know most of you won't believe me but once played with Janne (CheatMod creator) and he destroyed my base with around 10 or so land mattresses before they nerfed them in a single barrage while we were on the same team, said he wanted to see the damage it'd do, we were both Brits so...

But yeah, no need for that if you ask me, it would be better for realism for all arty to be doing the same damage to everybody but it would be better gameplay wise for Arty to be doing less damage to it's team's units and buildings.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
skyshark
12 Jul 2016, 17:58 PM
#8
avatar of skyshark

Posts: 239

maybe make it do full damage to your own, but partial to teammates?

it's super annoying to watch sturmpios charge through ISG fire while i have to run away.
Playercard of SHARK

1v1: Pstreak: + 1
1v1: Pstreak: + 4
2v2: Pstreak: + 1with Good Ol' Czepis
2v2: Pstreak: - 3with Good Ol' Czepis


Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
aerafield
12 Jul 2016, 22:26 PM
#9
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 3032 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jul 2016, 17:58 PMskyshark
maybe make it do full damage to your own, but partial to teammates?

it's super annoying to watch sturmpios charge through ISG fire while i have to run away.


Only partial for teammates? I dunno... it wouldn't be that much of a deal if you communicate with your teammate in this situation, would it? :D

But I've seen ppl firing with e.g. land matress or howitzer and they/their teammates just went into these shells/rockets like they dont give a f*ck, and this is really ridiculous :D
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
aerafield
12 Jul 2016, 22:54 PM
#10
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 3032 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jul 2016, 16:53 PMImagelessbean
Just a quick warning, making allied arty do high damage to friendly fire would make griefing easier in team games. If not for this I would like to see all arty be lethal and ignore unit owner modifiers.


Griefing is (in every video game) already easy enough, don't worry. People could just go afk in order to troll you, they don't need realistic teamkill arty. :)
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
medhood
12 Jul 2016, 22:56 PM
#11
avatar of medhood

Posts: 621

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jul 2016, 22:26 PMaerafield


Only partial for teammates? I dunno... it wouldn't be that much of a deal if you communicate with your teammate in this situation, would it? :D

But I've seen ppl firing with e.g. land matress or howitzer and they/their teammates just went into these shells/rockets like they dont give a f*ck, and this is really ridiculous :D

It should be left as is because people would troll and it'd kinda ruin random teamgames

But your own units should do full damage to your units so you cant just have your SMG troops fight enemy SMG troops and a mortar falls on top killing half his squad and barely scratching yours
President of CookiezNcreem Fanclub

No money no honey

Feel free to join Historical Battles Weekends

Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Obersoldat
12 Jul 2016, 23:03 PM
#12
avatar of Obersoldat

Posts: 393

"Friendly fire damage and damage against enemy units are completely different. As a general rule, tank guns have 50%, flamers 25%, explosive weapons mostly 0-10% damage with some notable exceptions like pwerfer (25%), walking stuka (50%), sturmtiger (100%). For example Brit base howitzer damage to friendlies is a whopping 2.5%, so a direct hit from a howitzer (160*0.025*4) deals as much damage to a full squad as a single hit from a kar98k (16*1)." -Cruzzi

Should have same values for axis and allies imo.
The only reason COH2 is still around, is because it's preserved by salt.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
ZombiFrancis
12 Jul 2016, 23:09 PM
#13
avatar of ZombiFrancis

Posts: 2742

Grenades have a 50% friendly fire damage for all varieties at least.

Relic took a bit of a heavy handed approach to the concept of 'hugging the enemy' with how friendly fire works.
Strategic Territory Points Mod:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Ferdinand
12 Jul 2016, 23:14 PM
#14
avatar of Ferdinand

Posts: 9

The arguement that an increase in friendly fire damage would cause trolling is irrevelant because certain Axis weapons already inflict significant friendly fire. The question at hand is should both sides inflict equal friendly fire or should the asymetrical friendly fire we currently have stay.

All AoE weapons should inflict massive damage on your own troops and relatively minor portion on friendly troops.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
pigsoup
13 Jul 2016, 01:04 AM
#15
avatar of pigsoup
Patrion 14

Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2

not sure about axis-allies arty's different team damages but they should all do 100% damage to teams like they did originally.

a stupid but feasable tactic like running into your team's katyusha barrage because it does almost no damage to you should not be possible.



















Playercard of Bo-Bobby Lion

3v3: Pstreak: - 3
3v3: Pstreak: + 8
3v3: Pstreak: - 3
3v3: Pstreak: - 2


















Playercard of Bo-Bobby Lion

3v3: Pstreak: - 3
2v2: Pstreak: - 2with Ohme
2v2: Pstreak: + 1with Ohme
2v2: Pstreak: + 3with Medman






Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
easierwithaturret
13 Jul 2016, 02:19 AM
#16
avatar of easierwithaturret

Posts: 247

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jul 2016, 17:58 PMskyshark
maybe make it do full damage to your own, but partial to teammates?



I think this is the sensible option. It's hard enough to coordinate in random team matches as it is, having arty do full damage would lead to too much rage.

As for OP's suggestion, I agree that we friendly fire damage should be standardised amongst weapons of similar types i.e. all howitzers do the same, similar rocket artillery like pwerfer and calliope do the same. However there is a case for different values for units such as stuka, b4 and Sturmtiger to have higher friendly fire damage because they have higher burst damage and are somewhat more precise.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
nee
13 Jul 2016, 07:15 AM
#17
avatar of nee

Posts: 1216

We need to back up. OP claims that Axis artillery (actually, Panzerwerfer and Walking Stuka, not off-map artillery abilities in general) inflict more TK damage than their Allied counterparts.

But is this even true? Because if not, we're voting on an issue that may not even be an issue at all.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
aerafield
13 Jul 2016, 11:39 AM
#18
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 3032 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post13 Jul 2016, 07:15 AMnee

But is this even true? Because if not, we're voting on an issue that may not even be an issue at all.


It is... I've seen it numerous times already (also on replay casts, YouTube videos etc.) :P
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Australian Magic
13 Jul 2016, 11:47 AM
#19
avatar of Australian Magic

Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2

Interesting fact...

PzWerfer kills your troops like they were enemy's.
Katyusha doesn't even tickle your troops.

Reason for that Relic??
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
ZombiFrancis
13 Jul 2016, 14:58 PM
#20
avatar of ZombiFrancis

Posts: 2742

jump backJump back to quoted post13 Jul 2016, 07:15 AMnee
We need to back up. OP claims that Axis artillery (actually, Panzerwerfer and Walking Stuka, not off-map artillery abilities in general) inflict more TK damage than their Allied counterparts.

But is this even true? Because if not, we're voting on an issue that may not even be an issue at all.


It is. I've done the research a few times.

All allied artillery deals a fraction of the damage as friendly fire compared to the friendly fire values of axis artillery.

Grenades are an exception, which deal 50% friendly fire for everyone.

The Land Mattress was a unique one that dealt an apparently arbitrary amount of friendly fire in between(ish) the general values for allies and axis.

Pretty much if you are allies you can tank artillery barrage after artillery barrage with your units, so there's never a reason to dodge them. Rather it's an incentive to assault into a barrage instead of after it.
Strategic Territory Points Mod:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
PAGES (2)down
New topic New topic     Upload replay New Reply
0 user is browsing this thread:
COH2.ORG » Forums » Parlor Room » COH2 Central » COH2 Balance » Teamkill-rate of Allies-arty??

Ladders Top 10

UKF
USF
OKW
SOV
OST
1v1
2v2
3v3
4v4
  • #
    Steam Alias
    W
    L
    %
    Streak
Data provided by Relic Relic Entertainment

Replay highlight

Top Tier Teams
VS
  • U.S. Forces flag cblanco ★
  • The British Forces flag 보드카 중대
  • Oberkommando West flag VonManteuffel
  • Ostheer flag Heartless Jäger
Einhoven Country
Einhoven Country Honor
Honor it
9
 Download
Download
1231
uploaded by XXxxHeartlessxxXX

Board Info

391 users are online: 391 guests
1 post in the last 24h
7 posts in the last week
39 posts in the last month
Registered members: 49062
Welcome our newest member, Mclatc16
Most online: 2043 users on 29 Oct 2023, 01:04 AM