Imo OP elements of Axis factions (222, sniper, units performing effectively for their price) are necessitated because of the early riflemen>light vehicle snowball we all know and love.
I don't feel like explaining the "why" behind my proposed changes, but here they are.
Rifleman EBPS size value to .87
M1 Garand long range cooldown to 1.5, mid range to 1.25, close range to .5. (These are rof nerfs.)
M1 Garand accuracy decrease by 10%.
Riflemen EBPS cost to 52.
"Smoke grenade" default ability; tie AT nade to frag tech.
Make "Volley Fire" vet 1 ability; reduce received accuracy malus.
Remove vet 3 received accuracy decreased, replace with LoS increase and passive healing.
Vet 2 bonus changed to slight received accuracy decrease (.87 to .79) and passive sprint.
Increase recieved suppression of Rifle squads to 1.15, making them easier to suppress. (Historically justified.)
Reworking muh Riflemen
- This thread is locked
27 Jun 2016, 20:03 PM
#1
Posts: 1891
The Fascisti Will Pay.
27 Jun 2016, 20:11 PM
#2
Posts: 794
They are mostly fine.
Their received accuracy needs some tweaks and swapping and that's it.
Their received accuracy needs some tweaks and swapping and that's it.
27 Jun 2016, 20:15 PM
#3
Posts: 1891
They are mostly fine.
Their received accuracy needs some tweaks and swapping and that's it.
Leave their role the same and nerf them USF becomes the worst faction (gj lelic)
If there's ever going to be real, by the numbers balance (not like Ost prices being artificially deflated to give them support against teh Riflemen and M20)
there has to be a re-thinking of the unit from direct combat to harassment with combat coming through abilities and upgrades, not raw stats
The Fascisti Will Pay.
27 Jun 2016, 20:20 PM
#4
Posts: 794
They already require multiple upgrades to unleash their full potential.
Currently sturms wreck them and only cost 20 MP more and grens snipe them while you are charging. They are only strong at flanking and when grouped.
Accuracy and ROF nerfs make no sense.
But it's your idea, your thread etc. Each to their own.
Currently sturms wreck them and only cost 20 MP more and grens snipe them while you are charging. They are only strong at flanking and when grouped.
Accuracy and ROF nerfs make no sense.
But it's your idea, your thread etc. Each to their own.
27 Jun 2016, 20:27 PM
#5
Posts: 1891
They already require multiple upgrades to unleash their full potential.
Currently sturms wreck them and only cost 20 MP more and grens snipe them while you are charging. They are only strong at flanking and when grouped.
Accuracy and ROF nerfs make no sense.
Early game rifles aren't really meant to charge unless there's Grens in the open or your flanking
Any case a Rifle dps nerf early game means the USF could actually get variety in T0, buffed REs, a .30 cal LMG team, anything.
And on requiring upgrades for full potential: most games where USF wins they swamp Axis early, meaning Bars and Zooks are never really needed because they take the map with Riflemen+captain and a light vehicle. It's pretty much to counter heavy Volks/fusilier builds/and allow infantry to blow up buildings and deter lights to some mediums
And yeah, really I'm just bored as hell with the Amis as a faction
The Fascisti Will Pay.
27 Jun 2016, 20:36 PM
#6
Posts: 794
I agree that the Stuart is over performing (irrelevant of the recent bug) and needs some adjustments.
The fact that you can only build rifls early game is a feature to me, how you use them, where you send each one and when you plan to finally yolo into your opponent, which upgrades to unlock first etc are the challenging factors and interesting elements when playing as USF.
Moving the jeep into HQ (after OKW Pfaust gets fixed of course), would be a welcome change.
T0 (T1 actually) MG or mortars would create another bland faction, while also undermining some of the core design elements.
The fact that you can only build rifls early game is a feature to me, how you use them, where you send each one and when you plan to finally yolo into your opponent, which upgrades to unlock first etc are the challenging factors and interesting elements when playing as USF.
Moving the jeep into HQ (after OKW Pfaust gets fixed of course), would be a welcome change.
T0 (T1 actually) MG or mortars would create another bland faction, while also undermining some of the core design elements.
27 Jun 2016, 20:47 PM
#7
27 Jun 2016, 20:48 PM
#8
Posts: 1891
I agree that the Stuart is over performing (irrelevant of the recent bug) and needs some adjustments.
The fact that you can only build rifls early game is a feature to me, how you use them, where you send each one and when you plan to finally yolo into your opponent, which upgrades to unlock first etc are the challenging factors and interesting elements when playing as USF.
Moving the jeep into HQ (after OKW Pfaust gets fixed of course), would be a welcome change.
T0 (T1 actually) MG or mortars would create another bland faction, while also undermining some of the core design elements.
Agree to disagree then dude. I get what your saying about the faction uniqueness but it's a nightmare to balance and play against (look at Ost vs USF lol plus all the threads about rifle blobs.) plus Rifle play as a "faction feature" loses its luster once you get good with them
To me the faction uniqueness is lightweight, mobile units that are versatile and good at harassment, so that could be reflected in T0 mortars and MGs hypothetically
The Fascisti Will Pay.
27 Jun 2016, 20:55 PM
#9
Posts: 794
Agree to disagree then dude. I get what your saying about the faction uniqueness but it's a nightmare to balance and play against(look at Ost vs USF lol plus all the threads about rifle blobs.)
It hasn't been a nightmare for the past 2 years, it is not a nightmare now.
The freshly added T0 turbo pack howie is a nightmare however.
27 Jun 2016, 21:01 PM
#10
Posts: 168
you funny then buff usf late game mate [buf pershing , shermans, scots buf rangers. ]
rifelman arent thet good right now they should get a buff
rifelman arent thet good right now they should get a buff
27 Jun 2016, 21:02 PM
#11
Posts: 1891
It hasn't been a nightmare for the past 2 years, it is not a nightmare now.
The freshly added T0 turbo pack howie is a nightmare however.
Grow some balls (instead of tits) and address your audience directly.
I mean that's what I'm trying to say-USF is never tourney viable because they don't have a mortar/good combined arms, but at the same time giving them access to that with current Rifles pushes them way over the top. (Hence nightmare.) I understand that the faction design is all about Rifles but pushing the viability of a faction to how well you micro one unit is not really strategy, it's 100% men of war micro kappa
i see where your coming from though, we should play sometime. (2v2 ofc)
The Fascisti Will Pay.
27 Jun 2016, 21:05 PM
#12
Posts: 7
Wow. you take this game really, really seriously.
27 Jun 2016, 21:06 PM
#13
Posts: 794
Sure, that would be a pleasure mate.
i see where your coming from though, we should play sometime. (2v2 ofc)
28 Jun 2016, 07:15 AM
#14
Posts: 168
What, now that you can't blob against tanks you want to make rifles weak?
Of coursh
28 Jun 2016, 07:20 AM
#15
Posts: 1891
What, now that you can't blob against tanks you want to make rifles weak?
I play 80% USF. I want the faction to be more focused on mobile combined arms and harassment, expending lots of munitions to win firefights.
With current Rifles USF is stuck as a one trick pony.
The Fascisti Will Pay.
28 Jun 2016, 07:22 AM
#16
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
units performing effectively for their price
Since when the F that equals to OP?
Also, what you're suggesting would put rifles below osttruppen for efficiency, thats not rework, thats so many nerfs to the point of removing the unit without offering any reasonable alternative and moreover, you've just removed the only singular reason to ever build RETs, whats up with that?
Come on, there are mod tools, try your own settings there first before posting them on forum and contaminating our brains with such retarded ideas.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
28 Jun 2016, 07:25 AM
#17
Posts: 1248
Since when the F that equals to OP?
Also, what you're suggesting would put rifles below osttruppen for efficiency, thats not rework, thats so many nerfs to the point of removing the unit without offering any reasonable alternative and moreover, you've just removed the only singular reason to ever build RETs, whats up with that?
Come on, there are mod tools, try your own settings there first before posting them on forum and contaminating our brains with such retarded ideas.
I smelled you coming after I noticed there wasn't a katitof post yet. I knew it Kappa
28 Jun 2016, 07:29 AM
#18
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
I smelled you coming after I noticed there wasn't a katitof post yet. I knew it Kappa
Its always nice, coming home, knowing there is someone waiting
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
28 Jun 2016, 07:54 AM
#19
Posts: 276
I think I just puked in my mouth a little.
I am not responsible for anything I say.
28 Jun 2016, 08:43 AM
#20
Posts: 1891
Since when the F that equals to OP?
Also, what you're suggesting would put rifles below osttruppen for efficiency, thats not rework, thats so many nerfs to the point of removing the unit without offering any reasonable alternative and moreover, you've just removed the only singular reason to ever build RETs, whats up with that?
Come on, there are mod tools, try your own settings there first before posting them on forum and contaminating our brains with such retarded ideas.
I'm working on a WFA redesign mod, hence the modding tools stats in the OP.
In it rifles are durable for the price, can circumvent MGs with smoke, and generally are good at harassing. If you want to defend an area you buy the .30 cal team I swapped REs with in the HQ, the .30 cal team is a more mobile 4 man Maxim with smaller arc for 230 MP.
The Fascisti Will Pay.
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