Where's the hotfix?

If you actually play the live game and not use a cheat mod you will soon realize that you can't do this.

EDIT: I retract my previous statement. If they you queue them both up at the same time they will both be equipped. This has been fixed and will be patched in a hotfix scheduled for later this week.

Where's the hotfix?

Also, what is up with this? I'm not aware of people farming using the cheatmod, if they do then forgive me, but testing for bugs on late-game units in the normal game is anything but efficient. Why would Relic punish players for helping them improve the game? (We all know why but humor me.)

I've read this 6 times and still can't tell what this thread is supposed to be about. Are you having a stroke?

I've read this 6 times and still can't tell what this thread is supposed to be about. Are you having a stroke?

EDIT: After delving in the forums I found the list of hotfix changes. (Why Relic doesn't post these in an easy to find place boggles my mind.) I have been backpacking since Wednesday and people in Momo's stream told me the mortar was still broken so I assumed the hotfix didn't happen. That is my mistake.

The second part of my post is an inquiry into why Relic's community manager would shame players for using a cheatmod to find bugs in coh2 when Relic can't even find them on their own. It doesn't make sense to me.

I am inquiring why there wasn't a hotfix this week when Kyle said there would be. There are game-breaking bugs that came with Tuesday's patch.

Oh, you.
You well know the answer.
The single person they have working on the game now couldn't get it done before the week ended. LUL

Edit: or, less cynically, there were a ton of knock-ons that QA kept catching.

we need at least one more hotfix addressing two things: stacking bug... AGAIN and usf mortar rebalance.

Quite a few things seem to need hotfixes. One of those is the abysmal state of Ostheer infantry.

Quite a few things seem to need hotfixes. One of those is the abysmal state of Ostheer infantry.

Lolwat? Dont forget to support that infantry with MG's and snipers.

Another bug: OKW mines still cause heavy engine damage.

MG42 will get wiped within 2 barrages from a USF mortar currently.

Some nice stats displaying the glassy grenadier problem:

I wanted to compare the UKF's Infantry Sections to other infantry with roughly the same position in the other factions. Here are the stats:
.

Stat	Infantry Sections	Grenadiers	Osttruppen	Obersoldaten	Panzerfusilliers	Riflemen	Conscripts	Penal Battalions
Squad Cost/Cost per Model	280/70	240/60	200/33.33	400/100	290/48.33	280/56	240/40	270/45
Reinforcement Cost/Time	35/7	30/6	~16.6/2	40/12.5	24.16/4.8	28/5.6	20/4	22.5/4.5
Number of Models	4-5	4	6	4	6	5	6	6
Total Health	320 - 400	320	480	320	480	400	480	480
Received Accuracy	0.8	0.91	1.25	0.7	1	0.97	1.087	1
Effective Health	400 - 500	~352	384	~457	480	~412	~442	480
Final Received Accuracy (vet 2 IS, vet 4 Obers, vet 3 all others)	0.528	0.7007	0.89375	0.38527	0.77	~0.56 (next patch: 0.5975)	0.6522	0.77
Final Effective Health	~606 - ~758	~457	~537	~831	~623	~714 (next patch: ~669)	~736	~623

.
Please note: Infantry Sections have 30% longer cooldown and 50% longer reload out of cover. Osttruppen have three times the listed accuracy in cover.
.

Stat	Lee-Enfield	Gren Kar98K	Ost Kar98K	Ober Kar98K	PF Kar98K	M1 Garand	Conscript Mosin-Nagant	SVT
Damage	16	16	8	16	10	8	16	8
Cooldown	0.375/0.6	0.75/1.25	0.75/1.25	0.75/1.25	0.75/1.25	0.5/1	1.25/1.75	0.5/1
Reload	1.25	1.5/2.6	1.5/2.6	1.5/2.6	1.5/2.6	2.1/2.8	2.4/3.4	2/3.5
Magazine	10	6/7	6/7	6/7	5/6	9/10	9/10	11
Accuracy (N/M/F)	0.598/0.564/0.529	0.748/0.661/0.598	0.3165/0.299/0.282	0.92/0.863/0.805	0.805/0.748/0.69	0.713/0.667/0.5175	0.541/0.495/0.334	0.69/0.46/0.288
Moving Acc/Cooldown Multiplier	0.25/1.5	0.5/1.5	0.25/1.5	0.5/1	0.5/1	0.6/1.25	0.5/1.5	0.5/0.5

.

MG42 will get wiped within 2 barrages from a USF mortar currently.

Some nice stats displaying the glassy grenadier problem:

Note 3 things

1. These stats have been out-of-date at least since December.
2. You also need to present offensive accuracy; while some units are more glassy than others, they are also more cannon-like
3. If you aren't presenting actualy DPS numbers for all range, you need to make sure that you present all variables needed to calculate it:
- Wind up
- Wind down
- Aim time (ready and fire)

These are different for all weapons, and have a massive impact in the final damage output.

Since those are single-shot items, you might as well calculate how long it takes to fire between shots (this is not equal to cooldown.

While some other units have been changed, grenadiers have not had any edits in any patches since those stats were published.

Point still stands.

While some other units have been changed, grenadiers have not had any edits in any patches since those stats were published.

Point still stands.

To have a case, you need to compare something to something else. If the other units have changed, who are you going to compare to?

PS: What about Grenadier LMG?

EDIT: The stats are incorrect even for Grenadier kar98.
e.g.: Cooldown should be 0.25/1.5

You are still missing aimtime and winddown, which are massive (in the order of 2.5 secs between shots). That's why cooldown doesn't even tell half of the story.

While some other units have been changed, grenadiers have not had any edits in any patches since those stats were published.

Point still stands.

No they don't.

You seem to be ignoring the fact that grenadiers have a higher DPS than their allied counterparts to make up for their smaller squad size.

grens could use a survivablity buff. Look at all the core allied inf on max vet. IS target size goes down to around 0.52, Rifles also goes down to around 0.55, even lol conscripts get target size of 0.6 on vet3 whilst grenadiers start good with 0.91 but get a horrible vet3 surviavablity bonus. Instead of -23 recc acc on vet3 they should atleast get -29 recc acc on vet3.

grens could use a survivablity buff. Look at all the core allied inf on max vet. IS target size goes down to around 0.52, Rifles also goes down to around 0.55, even lol conscripts get target size of 0.6 on vet3 whilst grenadiers start good with 0.91 but get a horrible vet3 surviavablity bonus. Instead of -23 recc acc on vet3 they should atleast get -29 recc acc on vet3.

It did not cross your mind that concripts have a ridiculous bad dps against vet units at vet3? You never considered using combined arms against USF and UKF who have bad access on rocket artillery? Ostheer may not have the best anti-infantry baseline infantry but Grens are by far the best allrounders with long range dps, rifle grenades and panzerfausts.

Where's the hotfix?

Also, what is up with this? I'm not aware of people farming using the cheatmod, if they do then forgive me, but testing for bugs on late-game units in the normal game is anything but efficient. Why would Relic punish players for helping them improve the game? (We all know why but humor me.)

no need in hotfix its good how it is .

relic ment to do this

i need to up my 4 v 4 ...

grens could use a survivablity buff. Look at all the core allied inf on max vet. IS target size goes down to around 0.52, Rifles also goes down to around 0.55, even lol conscripts get target size of 0.6 on vet3 whilst grenadiers start good with 0.91 but get a horrible vet3 surviavablity bonus. Instead of -23 recc acc on vet3 they should atleast get -29 recc acc on vet3.

As others have mentioned, you need to take the following into account:
- The great cost-efficiency of LMG42
- The offensive stats that grens get (which is 100% transferable to the LMG42)

Stating that grens are fragile, while ignoring the output is like stating that the Jackson needs to be buffed, solely because it has 480HP (without looking at its damage output)

Now:
- Grens are extremely fragile
- I'm not saying that thier DPS output/utility completely makes up for their fragility

However, instead of breaking the game further by giving in to the powercreep, wouldn't it be better to revert some of the lolvet buffs Cons/Rifles have received over the past?

I say breaking, because if we up received accuracy across the board:
- Vehicle-mounted MGs will no longer be able to do their job
- If we up Vehicle MG DPS, we will break them against AT guns
- If we remove received accuracy penalties from AT guns, infantry will have a hard time decrewing them for tanks to go through
- The vicious cycle perpetuates

Finally, note that there are 2 other factions (namely OKW and UKF) whose infantry haven't had the chance to benefit from the lolvet roulette yet. Where is the call for Volksgrenadier/Sturmpioneer vet revamp? (one should go up, the other should go down).

Firesparks has gathered some excellent suggestions there to reverse the ongoing infantry-based powercreep (and also rein LMG-meta in somewhat):
https://www.coh2.org/topic/51037/firesparks-balance-mod

Derailed to the max. Oh well it was just a whine thread anyway.

That's what you get for asking rhetorical questions.

To have a case, you need to compare something to something else. If the other units have changed, who are you going to compare to?

PS: What about Grenadier LMG?

EDIT: The stats are incorrect even for Grenadier kar98.
e.g.: Cooldown should be 0.25/1.5

You are still missing aimtime and winddown, which are massive (in the order of 2.5 secs between shots). That's why cooldown doesn't even tell half of the story.

My post is about survivability. Those survivability stats are still accurate for other units, therefore point is still valid that grenadiers are the worst infantry in the game, and do not scale late game where they will get wiped out constantly.

Their damage output is not in any way significant when compared to the DPS output of allied infantry with upgraded weapons. Not to mention the fact many players will be constantly wasting 60 munis to get squadwiped incessantly.

No they don't.

You seem to be ignoring the fact that grenadiers have a higher DPS than their allied counterparts to make up for their smaller squad size.

False. DPS output is nullified by the fact models will get dropped immediately.