June 21st Balance update

So is Penal Satchel Charge worth using again?

If you have lots of Penals around why not.

Demo charges will explode if run over (I think...) so it's nice to block an avenue of movement in some cases.

They're pretty good at removing houses/troublesome terrain.

I guess you are on the same skill level as siuking if you expect him to Meet your teammates?

Only time that happens is when I play 3v3/4v4

Good ,now with penal buff i hope grenadiers are completely overshadowed.Already trash vs tommies and rifles.Allied symmetric balance excuse with conscripts was what was keeping this incredible imbalance between wehr and allied inf alive...once soviets too have better earlygame infantry at least...relic will be forced to give grenadiers 5th man upgrade or pzgrens buffs...or watch wehrmacht collapse.

Just before you go into tear waterfall mode, let me remind you that penals are NOT basic general infantry, but AI specialists in AI exclusive tier and barely cheaper then PGs.

Also, there is this thing in T0 called MG42, use it.

Just before you go into tear waterfall mode, let me remind you that penals are NOT basic general infantry, but AI specialists in AI exclusive tier and barely cheaper then PGs.

Also, there is this thing in T0 called MG42, use it.

While I am eager to see the new Penals, there is a possibility, however slim, that they may become the de facto infantry for Soviet meta. It would be wiser to make a stats comparison with other AI specialist infantry rather than appeal to what their intended role / intended balance is.

The second argument seems to imply, in light of my response, that the MG42 would necessarily solve all potential meta developments involving direct fire infantry.

Do the sturms get 1 or 2 shrecks with the upgrade (and what is the cost)

Do the sturms get 1 or 2 shrecks with the upgrade (and what is the cost)

1 shreck and immunity to the cold = 90 munitions

While this patch does take some steps in the right directions, changing faction mechanics this late in the game means you need to constantly tweak the game. Given Relic's abysmally slow rate of change especially in light of glaring issues such as Advanced Emplacements and CONTINUING issues which they don't deal with such as ghosting sandbags, I have no faith in Relic.

JUST FIX THE GAME. STOP CHANGING MECHANICS.

Dude OST will be able to get their troops to the front a few seconds earlier than Brits and USF. At the beginning of a game, this has serious consequences

USFs are considered to have the strongest early game so im not sure why this is a bad thing. Brits are getting a pretty big buff to their early game was well.

And guess what. At the beginning of the game, you can start building Infantry sections or Riflemen INSTANTLY. As Ostheer you have to build your tier structure first then start building grenadiers. Brits start with Infantry sections, Ostheer starts with pioneers. The only one you starts a bit slower than everyone else is USFs since they start with RETs and their Riflemen spawn from their main HQ. On the other hand, they have other benefits that aren't available to other factions like vehicle crews. The brits and USFs also don't have to retreat their engineers to build tech structures.

While this patch does take some steps in the right directions, changing faction mechanics this late in the game means you need to constantly tweak the game. Given Relic's abysmally slow rate of change especially in light of glaring issues such as Advanced Emplacements and CONTINUING issues which they don't deal with such as ghosting sandbags, I have no faith in Relic.

JUST FIX THE GAME. STOP CHANGING MECHANICS.

Mirage_Fla's competitive mod fixes ghosting... but Relic isn't including pretty much every good quality of life change from his mod anyway.

Just before you go into tear waterfall mode, let me remind you that penals are NOT basic general infantry, but AI specialists in AI exclusive tier and barely cheaper then PGs.

Also, there is this thing in T0 called MG42, use it.

Oh you are still here,but i guess this forum is where u spend most of your time anyway.
Penals if succesful will become soviet meta basic infantry,that will be good.The allied infantry blobbers will have no excuses left to stop gren buff then.
Mg42 just got even bigger kick in the sack with american mortar,its not like usf dominated infantry play anyway.Even sniper got nerf.
All this is good...eventually it will force a situation where they have to buff ostheer infantry or see it collapse.

Oh you are still here,but i guess this forum is where u spend most of your time anyway.
Penals if succesful will become soviet meta basic infantry,that will be good.The allied infantry blobbers will have no excuses left to stop gren buff then.

Penals are easily stopped by MG42s, focus fire and anything that doesn't use legs to move around.
Last time I've checked, we didn't got tremendous conscript buffs, just because PGs or obers obliterated them, so if you think grens will be buffed because of it, you're as deluded as always.

Mg42 just got even bigger kick in the sack with american mortar,its not like usf dominated infantry play anyway.Even sniper got nerf.
All this is good...eventually it will force a situation where they have to buff ostheer infantry or see it collapse.

Yes, that USF mortar will make a HUUUUGE difference in sov vs ost matchup
The new soviet BO will be 5x penals, 2x USF mortars into dual Bren
Also, it might be a shocker for you, but USF mortar is not free.
Mortar=less rifles, but you already went to do this:


So you just ignored that.

You haven't played preview, you're completely clueless, you just do your annual patch bitching without knowing what you talk about.

Penals are easily stopped by MG42s, focus fire and anything that doesn't use legs to move around.
Last time I've checked, we didn't got tremendous conscript buffs, just because PGs or obers obliterated them, so if you think grens will be buffed because of it, you're as deluded as always.




Yes, that USF mortar will make a HUUUUGE difference in sov vs ost matchup
The new soviet BO will be 5x penals, 2x USF mortars into dual Bren
Also, it might be a shocker for you, but USF mortar is not free.
Mortar=less rifles, but you already went to do this:


So you just ignored that.

You haven't played preview, you're completely clueless, you just do your annual patch bitching without knowing what you talk about.

As usual you are the one that is clueless,i have mentioned earlier in this forum that only sov vs ost matchup was somehwhat balanced...now even soviet infnatry getting buffs..but ost stays same.Mg42 was in relation to usf.You are a rabid allied fanboy anybody knows that.
Just wait and see...usf will roll over everything next patch.

As usual you are the one that is clueless,i have mentioned earlier in this forum that only sov vs ost matchup was somehwhat balanced...now even soviet infnatry getting buffs..but ost stays same.Mg42 was in relation to usf.You are a rabid allied fanboy anybody knows that.
Just wait and see...usf will roll over everything next patch.

They are not buffing soviet infantry in general - they are buffing penals which, just for your information, were NON-EXISTANT in the meta for a really long time. That's not going to hurt Ostheer.

And if you haven't noticed it yet, Ostheer gets a drastic decrease of tech cost of t3 (15 fuel) and t4(25). If there´s anthing rolling over anyone - it's Ostheer tanks over USF who just got their captain nerfed.

It's sad that T-70's, which are probably the most OP unit are unchanged.

Hell yea. They did not remove tank crush

1. American grenade is no longer effective counter play against 2-3 mg42 strat, thats why usf get's mortar.

2. OKW now receive machinegun in hq, thats second reason why usf won't exist in this game without mortar.

3. Relic, Why i need pack howitzer now?

1. American grenade is no longer effective counter play against 2-3 mg42 strat, thats why usf get's mortar.

2. OKW now receive machinegun in hq, thats second reason why usf won't exist in this game without mortar.

Because USF was insta loosing pre-patch, if OKW used luft\def doctrine or ost used and used 2-3 MG

USF pretty much now have counter to MG for 280 and its allow them to skip grenades and get stuar much faster into the game. Fair enouth, OKW will be able to fight this because of Raketen and faust for volks.

But how Ostheer should fight already dominating USF only god knows. Probably the only way you can somehow survive as Ost against USF now - abuse sniper. If sniper is dead or lucky mortar shot got him, you pretty much insta lose as Ostheer now.

I say, give OKW doctinal sniper and no-one ever ever will play as Ostheer now, lol. Because ostheer is so badly outdated and out-of-meta its not even funny.

They are not buffing soviet infantry in general - they are buffing penals which, just for your information, were NON-EXISTANT in the meta for a really long time. That's not going to hurt Ostheer.

And if you haven't noticed it yet, Ostheer gets a drastic decrease of tech cost of t3 (15 fuel) and t4(25). If there´s anthing rolling over anyone - it's Ostheer tanks over USF who just got their captain nerfed.

Soviets buffed in general. The thing is that you can go for T1 and stay on pair with ostheer inf for a long time, and because penals have their vet bonuses, they can scale into mid\late game pretty good. Considering fact that SU-85 and T34 got buffs aswell, you dont really HAVE to pick doctrines with armor call-ins.

So you can pretty much pick even defensive commander, use penals covered by DSHK, mortars and light AT gun against fast light armor and then roll over your tanks. Or used schreck partysans, or even guards. The thing is that, soviets loosing absolutely nothing now if they picked right commander. And they could chose when they want to have advantage.

OKW wont be so badly hurted by thouse buffs, while Ostheer will be toned down REALLY badly in 1v1 soviet vs ost match up.

As I told before, the only and single thing which keeps ost in game - sniper, nothing more.

But how Ostheer should fight already dominating USF only god knows.

Move the puma to T2. About time lulic.

It's sad that T-70's, which are probably the most OP unit are unchanged.

If you are serious, then the only sensible nerf is a ROF decrease, along with a slight fuel cost reduction and MP cost increase.

1. American grenade is no longer effective counter play against 2-3 mg42 strat, thats why usf get's mortar.

2. OKW now receive machinegun in hq, thats second reason why usf won't exist in this game without mortar.

3. Relic, Why i need pack howitzer now?

white phosphorous + vet 2 barrage.

but it can use god damn 6 shot barrage though.