ostheer teir 2 changes
9 Jan 2016, 19:02 PM
#1
Posts: 123
Just my thoughts of maybe something that could help ostheer early to mid game.. i honestly think grens kind of bleed pretty hard early game do to alot the times 1 man goes down very easily while treing to make it too cover, and at 30mp reinforce costs it really keeps pushing you off the field and keeping you off in outnumbered engaments. I also just thought of why not adding a puma at 80 fuel to teir 2 to help deal with usf early vehicle rushes.. it would give ostheer a reliable moveable at so that you don't have ur big heavy pak the jump to tier 3 is just a big cost especially during the early game allied pushes
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9 Jan 2016, 19:08 PM
#2
Posts: 123
I also thought of maybe buffing the pio mp40 a tad to make them more compact affective giving ostheer a chance in close quarter maps and also it could hopefully apply to assault grens
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9 Jan 2016, 19:25 PM
#3
Posts: 109
You can get puma from mobile defense doctrine. Pioneers also aren't really used for combat unless you give him flamewerfer. But interesting suggestions c
9 Jan 2016, 19:35 PM
#4
Posts: 123
The problem is that it's limited to a commander and also that the cp requirment is a little to high it would be better placed at 3 or 4 do to usf cheap tech costs
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9 Jan 2016, 22:21 PM
#5
Posts: 10
Let's not forget that ostheer has the best AT, and you can also equip panzerschreck on pgrens, I know it's muni expensive but it, kind of, solves your problems with light tanks and such
9 Jan 2016, 22:33 PM
#6
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
I also thought of maybe buffing the pio mp40 a tad to make them more compact affective giving ostheer a chance in close quarter maps and also it could hopefully apply to assault grens
We already saw what happened when Pioneers already were like that - to even entertain the idea, they'd need a significant cost increase as well...at the very least (Bonus sight for a CQC unit is certainly quite a boon - they'd be able to easily avoid HMGs and constantly flank them).
10 Jan 2016, 00:49 AM
#7
Posts: 1891
I think that every faction could use more upgrades and maybe 1 to 2 new units. So I agree op.
Light AT upgrade for halftrack, buff pios vet with regards to combat, maybe give Grens a squad upgrade that gives them five men but doesn't let them receive any other upgrades.
Light AT upgrade for halftrack, buff pios vet with regards to combat, maybe give Grens a squad upgrade that gives them five men but doesn't let them receive any other upgrades.
The Fascisti Will Pay.
10 Jan 2016, 01:03 AM
#8
Posts: 707
We already saw what happened when Pioneers already were like that - to even entertain the idea, they'd need a significant cost increase as well...at the very least (Bonus sight for a CQC unit is certainly quite a boon - they'd be able to easily avoid HMGs and constantly flank them).
Good luck trying to fight off USF Rifleman + Free LT with free BAR Thompson + M20.
Upgrade shreck against M20? No LMG against BAR rifles
Upgrade LMG? No shreck against M20
Teller mine? Pray that he hits it and you can fight off the big blob with your crappy gren
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10 Jan 2016, 01:19 AM
#9
Posts: 665
No. Ostheer has good AT and great armor with all their mainline units scaling quite well, at the cost of no light vehicles outside doctrines. This weakness is deliberate, and serves to keep them honest mid-game.
You can use PaKs, shrecks (yes, expensive, but one volley cripples or kills most light vehicles), Teller mines and/or a well microed 222 to keep light vehicles at bay until the Stug comes out and hopefully turns it into scrap metal.
At best, I'd be in favor of a buff to the 222 if it comes with a cost increase, that would make it able to fight the M20 toe to toe. It should still lost to a Stuart however.
You can use PaKs, shrecks (yes, expensive, but one volley cripples or kills most light vehicles), Teller mines and/or a well microed 222 to keep light vehicles at bay until the Stug comes out and hopefully turns it into scrap metal.
At best, I'd be in favor of a buff to the 222 if it comes with a cost increase, that would make it able to fight the M20 toe to toe. It should still lost to a Stuart however.
10 Jan 2016, 01:42 AM
#10
Posts: 609
Ostheer T2 AT already contains the best AT gun and AT infantry while their tier 1 contains the best snare without side-tech and their pioneers have the second best AT mine and a 222 that'll shred most Allied lights.
The only thing T2 needs is scaling up the 222 so it can function a little more effectively at AI for a higher price-tag.
The only thing T2 needs is scaling up the 222 so it can function a little more effectively at AI for a higher price-tag.
10 Jan 2016, 02:14 AM
#11
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
Good luck trying to fight off USF Rifleman + Free LT with free BAR Thompson + M20.
Upgrade shreck against M20? No LMG against BAR rifles
Upgrade LMG? No shreck against M20
Teller mine? Pray that he hits it and you can fight off the big blob with your crappy gren
Implying to me that Pioneer effectiveness in March 2014 was fine is a waste of both of our times.
10 Jan 2016, 02:15 AM
#12
Posts: 738
Good luck trying to fight off USF Rifleman + Free LT with free BAR Thompson + M20.
Upgrade shreck against M20? No LMG against BAR rifles
Upgrade LMG? No shreck against M20
Teller mine? Pray that he hits it and you can fight off the big blob with your crappy gren
L2P
MG+gren support holds off rifles+m20 fine, 222 comes out early enough to counter.
ostruppen+sniper still works fine on larger maps
10 Jan 2016, 02:38 AM
#13
Posts: 174
Just my thoughts of maybe something that could help ostheer early to mid game.. i honestly think grens kind of bleed pretty hard early game do to alot the times 1 man goes down very easily while treing to make it too cover, and at 30mp reinforce costs it really keeps pushing you off the field and keeping you off in outnumbered engaments. I also just thought of why not adding a puma at 80 fuel to teir 2 to help deal with usf early vehicle rushes.. it would give ostheer a reliable moveable at so that you don't have ur big heavy pak the jump to tier 3 is just a big cost especially during the early game allied pushes
I also thought of maybe buffing the pio mp40 a tad to make them more compact affective giving ostheer a chance in close quarter maps and also it could hopefully apply to assault grens
Aren't you basically asking to turn OST into OKW? Give them a Puma and make Pios more like Sturms?
T0 MG42, T1 Mortar & Sniper level the playing field against Rifles.
I agree it's tough and requires some sweat to knock out a 4-5 minute M20 as Ostheer, but USF has to go through the same nonsense 15 minutes later against the OST Panther.
Unless we are really striving to have mirror matches, I don't think OST needs an early / mid-game buff. Not with the Panthers and Werfers and Tigers looming later in the match.
10 Jan 2016, 16:35 PM
#14
Posts: 123
It's just kind of annoying how almost all of ostheer opponents can keep spamming infantry because ostheer does not have a very good hard counter to early infantry spam in vehicle form... okw has a luch,soviets have to t70, and usf has very good countering vehicles. The scout car is not reliable enough to be a good counter.
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10 Jan 2016, 16:44 PM
#15
Posts: 935
I also just thought of why not adding a puma at 80 fuel to teir 2 to help deal with usf early vehicle rushes..
I am absulutly agree lets move HMG in teir 2.
11 Jan 2016, 00:06 AM
#16
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
It's just kind of annoying how almost all of ostheer opponents can keep spamming infantry because ostheer does not have a very good hard counter to early infantry spam in vehicle form... okw has a luch,soviets have to t70, and usf has very good countering vehicles. The scout car is not reliable enough to be a good counter.
222 would be perfect with Miragefla's mod's changes.
Sdfkz 222
Previously the 222's Coaxial MG had no rotation with only a 10 degree firing cone with no ability to traverse making it difficult to track targets it chases after, particularly at close-range. The reload has been shortened the reload on the MG to reduce the length the MG is not firing.
-Coaxial MG now has 10 degree traverse to the left, right, and up.
-Coaxial MG Reload from 6/6.5 to 4/4.5.
Sdfkz 222
Improved the performance of the 222 in terms of survivability against small-arms. Veterancy adjusted on the 222 to account for the autocannon being the primary weapon which relies on scatter. Cost slightly raised.
-Armour from 9/4.5 to 12/6.
-Coaxial MG now gains accuracy bonuses with veterancy.
-Fuel price from 15 to 20.
-Autocannon far range accuracy set to 0.025 (for some reason it was set to 0.02)
-222 autocannon can now attack ground.
11 Jan 2016, 07:53 AM
#17
Posts: 482
Poineers' pop cost should be 5 like previous stats.222 could use a slightly buff on pens of its maingun with a cost increasing.Or give 251 an AT upgrade.The grens lol.. sorry this unit is hopeless. Leave it as shit.
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11 Jan 2016, 08:12 AM
#18
Posts: 301
Hello.
3 out of 4 units in the OsT T2 has AT capacity that range from light to heavy. Even the humble 222 has 50% chance to dammage a T70 at each shot).
Adding a Puma is interesting but offers something unneeded in my opinion. But maybe you are right after all.
Kozo.
3 out of 4 units in the OsT T2 has AT capacity that range from light to heavy. Even the humble 222 has 50% chance to dammage a T70 at each shot).
Adding a Puma is interesting but offers something unneeded in my opinion. But maybe you are right after all.
Kozo.
...For conflict is the great teacher,
and pain... the perfect educator...
and pain... the perfect educator...
11 Jan 2016, 08:19 AM
#19
Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1
Why don't you just field 2 222? those are incredibly cheap.
11 Jan 2016, 19:31 PM
#20
Posts: 468
BeefSurge... you think that USF should lose FRP while OKW should keep FRP because they have 235 MP volks and resource penalty... in another post. Please play the game before making suggestions.
SiuKing... Maybe you need to learn to play. OST has T0 mg42 to stop riflemen. you have faust for grens, you have pak40 for the range/kiter light vehicle. you have pgrens with shreks if they charge in. WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT? Greedy bastard just wants to plain flat out dominate Allies.
If you want to make doctrinal units un-doctrinal, do the same for priest, calliope, airborne, rangers, fallschims, stormtrooopers, jaeger infantry, EVERYTHING then. lol.
SiuKing... Maybe you need to learn to play. OST has T0 mg42 to stop riflemen. you have faust for grens, you have pak40 for the range/kiter light vehicle. you have pgrens with shreks if they charge in. WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT? Greedy bastard just wants to plain flat out dominate Allies.
If you want to make doctrinal units un-doctrinal, do the same for priest, calliope, airborne, rangers, fallschims, stormtrooopers, jaeger infantry, EVERYTHING then. lol.
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