OKW Revamp Review

After playing the review, It's clear that the OKW changes are a huge overkill.

1. Teching is way too quick! Both light armor and medium armor are arriving faster then opponents can realistically deal with them. 5 min kubels and flak halftracks are rediculous.

2. Kubel needs a Fuel cost. We already went through this in alpha relic, don't make the same mistake again. We don't need to see the 5+ kubel rushes again.

3. Either normal grenades or flame grenades. USF gets by with just normal grenades just fine and they atleast have to upgrade to it. This is a ridiculous amount of utility that pretty much makes any use of cover and garrisons useless against OKW while still letting them get those nade wipes. Not to mention the extra muni now lets them throw more then ever. Atleast move the flame nades to sturmpios.

4. Increase schrek cost. They can already afford them better with the resource change. Between this, the buff, and the new grenades there is going to be sooo much volk spam.

5. Slow down their armor preduction. OKW armor is straight up better then what the other factions get. There is no way allies can deal with it coming out as early and as frequent as the other factions medium armor does. Their armors costs probably need to be inflated a bit so they aren't as easy to accumulate and replace. Or at very least they need to be delayed so that allies can get a head start on armor preduction.

6. Rethink salvage. It basically gives them extra resources vs opponents for no cost. Before it helped mitigate a weakness. Now it is just an unnecessary resource advantage.

Play it first, propose changes later when you know how it actually works.



Btw, 5-minute light vehicles have been in the game since forever. Soviet Clown-car and US AC have always come out fast. Though I agree with you that light vehicles should come out later (or be weaker so as to have less impact on the game) Would you agree that allied light vehicles should also be delayed or just OKW's?

Oh look, we've gone full circle and OKW are now OP again.

Watch out for the full resource rate 70 munitions schreck blobs.

Play it first, propose changes later when you know how it actually works.



Btw, 5-minute light vehicles have been in the game since forever. Soviet Clown-car and US AC have always come out fast. Though I agree with you that light vehicles should come out later (or be weaker so as to have less impact on the game) Would you agree that allied light vehicles should also be delayed or just OKW's?

I have played it. 3 games so far against some friends. won every match so far.

Even when I didn't rush lights, and let the game drag on I was easily able to roll him after I got 2 P4s.

I have played it. 3 games so far against some friends. won every match so far.

Even when I didn't rush lights, and let the game drag on I was easily able to roll him after I got 2 P4s.

Beating your friends is not objective information. No-one else knows their skill level, if they play much, if they're tired, if they usually play axis. That information is useless.

You'll have to play about 30-50 games in automatch vs players of a similar ability AND compare notes with other players in the community before you can come to any useful conclusions. Why not wait it out instead of panicking?


The OKW changes do seem very strong. I'm sure some of them will be changed back before patch release or shortly after. But until now OKW have been suffering badly. Clown cars, rifle flamer blobs, offmap spam and a whole list of issues. They needed the buffs. Time will tell if these changes will improve the game or not. Relax, in Lelic we trust

Beating your friends is not objective information. No-one else knows their skill level, if they play much, if they're tired, if they usually play axis. That information is useless.

You'll have to play about 30-50 games in automatch vs players of a similar ability AND compare notes with other players in the community before you can come to any useful conclusions. Why not wait it out instead of panicking?


The OKW changes do seem very strong. I'm sure some of them will be changed back before patch release or shortly after. But until now OKW have been suffering badly. Clown cars, rifle flamer blobs, offmap spam and a whole list of issues. They needed the buffs. Time will tell if these changes will improve the game or not. Relax, in Lelic we trust

So we can't say anything until it goes live. That's silly, that's what this mod is for.

And you barely need to play it to see why its so bad. Even with all the things I said they will still be way stronger then they currently are. OKW needed help, I've said so myself. But a lot of these changes are overkill.

These changes are not only making them op, these changes also make them boring to play. Okw just needed some buffs, what it got here is complete bullshit.

1. Flak Timing is pretty much unchanged and only Luchs comes 1 minute to early. Reduce the starting fuel to 15 fuel (2 minute delay)and thats enough for the tech delay.

2. You seem to forget that the Kübel has weaker stats than in the alpha, where its dps was touched. With this changes(which I personally don't like) the Kübel can be still viable in every game stage as an harassing unit which is good. Heavy Kübel builds are easily countered by hand held AT and every light vehicle.

3. Grenades are on the same cooldown timer, means you can't spam nades every engangment. OKW needs the flame grenade to clear garrisons. But I agree the flame nade on the sturmpios seems to make more sense.

4. I rather would like to see schrecks moved to another squads, (either dual schrecks on sturmpios or a special tank hunter squad) and give Volks a 3x Stg 44 upgrade.

5. Vet 4 & 5 were nerfed, OKW armour is on par with allied armour cost wise. That was the main issue. OKW pays more to get units that are just as good or weaker than their allied counterparts (except for JP4).

6. OKW has no caches, so they have salvage. If you want to remove salvage, you need to give them caches, since every faction has them. YET this all won't happen because salvage is in 2 commanders.

1. Flak Timing is pretty much unchanged and only Luchs comes 1 minute to early. Reduce the starting fuel to 15 fuel (2 minute delay)and thats enough for the tech delay.

2. You seem to forget that the Kübel has weaker stats than in the alpha, where its dps was touched. With this changes(which I personally don't like) the Kübel can be still viable in every game stage as an harassing unit which is good. Heavy Kübel builds are easily countered by hand held AT and every light vehicle.

3. Grenades are on the same cooldown timer, means you can't spam nades every engangment. OKW needs the flame grenade to clear garrisons. But I agree the flame nade on the sturmpios seems to make more sense.

4. I rather would like to see schrecks moved to another squads, (either dual schrecks on sturmpios or a special tank hunter squad) and give Volks a 3x Stg 44 upgrade.

5. Vet 4 & 5 were nerfed, OKW armour is on par with allied armour cost wise. That was the main issue. OKW pays more to get units that are just as good or weaker than their allied counterparts (except for JP4).

6. OKW has no caches, so they have salvage. If you want to remove salvage, you need to give them caches, since every faction has them. YET this all won't happen because salvage is in 2 commanders.

Flak still comes faster then it used to due to the 100% resources. Still I'm more worried about the luchs, atleast flaks can't be too aggressive.

Kubels still have plenty enough DPS if spammed, trust me they will be spammed. And when your ally gets his entire army wiped by a single M20, you will want it changed too.


Also the caches cost manpower. Salvage is completely free. I wouldn't say anything if it was and upgrade or something, but right now it's essentially free resources. For a faction that gets just as much resources as everyone else.

Just to take a look at some changes and calling out stuff that is approved in comp stomps (like fast luchs or previously the "5min t70) is just kind of dumb i have to say. And Flak Halftreck comes at the same time as before i don't get it.

Play it first, propose changes later when you know how it actually works.



Btw, 5-minute light vehicles have been in the game since forever. Soviet Clown-car and US AC have always come out fast. Though I agree with you that light vehicles should come out later (or be weaker so as to have less impact on the game) Would you agree that allied light vehicles should also be delayed or just OKW's?

But soviet m3 and USF AC dont have firepower of luchs and his hp (only USF are close to this with stuart).

Play it first, propose changes later when you know how it actually works.



Btw, 5-minute light vehicles have been in the game since forever. Soviet Clown-car and US AC have always come out fast. Though I agree with you that light vehicles should come out later (or be weaker so as to have less impact on the game) Would you agree that allied light vehicles should also be delayed or just OKW's?

rofl

5 min luchs is nowhere near the level of a clown car

Play the patch

rofl

5 min luchs is nowhere near the level of a clown car

Play the patch

Never said it was. Please read more carefully instead of getting angry and filling your posts with pictures of guys' heads.



Clown car with flamer and USF AC come out very fast and have a (in my opinion) negative effect on gameplay and game progression. The same as what you're saying about the Luchs.

its a prev only with relic stating that it will need fine tuning
but the direction is rly good
rly love the change to trucks - flak hq shouldnt have jp4 p4 and panther
kubel should be a t1.5 unit with supresion and a fuel cost - right now its just funny with 2+ kubels into p2
okw and full ammo income is funny too by the time you face a m20 you will have 2 shreks up or shrek and some mines
best we can do now is to play the prev mod and give relic some numbers

Never said it was. Please read more carefully instead of getting angry and filling your posts with pictures of guys' heads.



Clown car with flamer and USF AC come out very fast and have a (in my opinion) negative effect on gameplay and game progression. The same as what you're saying about the Luchs.

Scout car and AC can be taken off by shrecks, luchs is an other beast, you need a shitload of at nades to kill it

The fact you are forced to go for an at solution to live is a joke




Oh and

Scout car and AC can be taken off by shrecks, luchs is an other beast, you need a shitload of at nades to kill it

The fact you are forced to go for an at solution to live is a joke




Oh and

"The fact you are forced to go for an at solution to live is a joke"
--- EXACTLY! This is what axis have to deal with.

OKW are forced to go for raketens to handle the allied light vehicles. That's Manpower tied up in AT when you REALLY need AI to handle the rifles and cons. Is that not also a joke?

It's also brainpower tied up in macro and micro trying to catch the damn vehicle that'll be sent round the map where your raketen isn't. The focus and resources required to destroy these vehicles is considerably less than the focus and resources required to use them. I think that's disbalance.


Until now Allies haven't had to deal with such an early squad-wipe vehicle. I'd prefer it if neither side had to, I think it's no fun to end the infantry stage so quickly. So now allied players will have to deal with the same frustrating issues.

"The fact you are forced to go for an at solution to live is a joke"
--- EXACTLY! This is what axis have to deal with.

OKW are forced to go for raketens to handle the allied light vehicles. That's Manpower tied up in AT when you REALLY need AI to handle the rifles and cons. Is that not also a joke?

It's also brainpower tied up in macro and micro trying to catch the damn vehicle that'll be sent round the map where your raketen isn't. The focus and resources required to destroy these vehicles is considerably less than the focus and resources required to use them. I think that's disbalance.


Until now Allies haven't had to deal with such an early squad-wipe vehicle. I'd prefer it if neither side had to, I think it's no fun to end the infantry stage so quickly. So now allied players will have to deal with the same frustrating issues.

Yes, but Raketwerfer does not force the player into a certain tech tree. Soviet however, have to forgo Maxims just to counter Kubel spam in the next patch.

Yes, but Raketwerfer does not force the player into a certain tech tree. Soviet however, have to forgo Maxims just to counter Kubel spam in the next patch.

a single script squad will kill the kubel quite easily.

6. Rethink salvage. It basically gives them extra resources vs opponents for no cost. Before it helped mitigate a weakness. Now it is just an unnecessary resource advantage.

Well in order to use salvage an OKW player needs something to salvage. Are you in the habit of losing teamweapons/vehicles? Also, have you ever noticed how quickly infantry go down if you attack them while they're salvaging?

Playing three games against friends in a balance preview hardly makes you qualified to make such statements like "After playing the review, It's clear that the OKW changes are a huge overkill.". I'd recommend editing this to something like "After briefly playing the review, it is my opinion that the OKW changes are a bit over the top.". It's people like you who feed the devs misinformation that get us these drastic, if not unnecessary changes in the first place.

Yes, but Raketwerfer does not force the player into a certain tech tree. Soviet however, have to forgo Maxims just to counter Kubel spam in the next patch.

T2 so expensive with 20 Fuel . Also, the M3 counters the Kübel so both tiers offer counters.
Brits have Universial Car & AEC.
USF has M20 & Stuart.

And everybody has AT guns. You see allied factions have more than enough tools to handle "kübel spam"