USF has no actual counter to the sniper either way tbh.
Plus less bleed with fewer models.
In your 265 USF Victory ( GG for #1 ) you haven't met a single Sniper ? or are you saying to BeefSurge that USF can kill a sniper ?
USF and potential suggestions for its Design
25 Aug 2015, 12:58 PM
#61
Posts: 742 | Subs: 1
In your 265 USF Victory ( GG for #1 ) you haven't met a single Sniper ? or are you saying to BeefSurge that USF can kill a sniper ?
25 Aug 2015, 13:27 PM
#62
Posts: 2115 | Subs: 1
In your 265 USF Victory ( GG for #1 ) you haven't met a single Sniper ? or are you saying to BeefSurge that USF can kill a sniper ?
what exactly can a usf player do to counter a sniper vs an aware opponent
servant to the vet 5 königskübel
b4 and soviet FHQ enthusiast
fan of the illustrious black prince
b4 and soviet FHQ enthusiast
fan of the illustrious black prince
25 Aug 2015, 13:46 PM
#63
Posts: 742 | Subs: 1
what exactly can a usf player do to counter a sniper vs an aware opponent
Are you implying that Top USF are playing against unaware opponent 100% of the time ?
Cut retreat path, flank, bring light vehicule for example ?
Win ratios are among the highest for USF in 1v1, and i think they go against snipers too
25 Aug 2015, 14:09 PM
#64
Posts: 830
Are you implying that Top USF are playing against unaware opponent 100% of the time ?
Cut retreat path, flank, bring light vehicule for example ?
Win ratios are among the highest for USF in 1v1, and i think they go against snipers too
The m20 can counter snipers pretty needly. Since a reasonable counter to the m20 only comes in the form of either a 222 or a pak. Usually I swap the m20 crew out, have a free bazooka, just in case the 222 comes.
Other than that, not really any viable counters available. I mean cutting the retreat path usually doesn't work. You need a lot of firepower to kill the Ost sniper
25 Aug 2015, 14:14 PM
#65
Posts: 657
Addressing the elephant in the room, lack of heavy vehicles.
Will help alleviate late game issues with Sherman Jumbo and/or Pershing. Also better scaling rifleman would be beneficial, better vet bonuses and tie anti-tank rifle grenade with the grenade package.
For those who say the Pershing barely had any impact, three things.... Comet... Ostwind... Sturmtiger...
Will help alleviate late game issues with Sherman Jumbo and/or Pershing. Also better scaling rifleman would be beneficial, better vet bonuses and tie anti-tank rifle grenade with the grenade package.
For those who say the Pershing barely had any impact, three things.... Comet... Ostwind... Sturmtiger...
25 Aug 2015, 14:15 PM
#66
Posts: 742 | Subs: 1
The m20 can counter snipers pretty needly. Since a reasonable counter to the m20 only comes in the form of either a 222 or a pak. Usually I swap the m20 crew out, have a free bazooka, just in case the 222 comes.
Other than that, not really any viable counters available. I mean cutting the retreat path usually doesn't work. You need a lot of firepower to kill the Ost sniper
Do you need a lot of power to kill a gren entity (80 + 2 HP) ?
Cutting the retreat path is really hard in Teamgames modes i agree, in 1V1 its a lot easier
25 Aug 2015, 14:34 PM
#67
Posts: 2115 | Subs: 1
Do you need a lot of power to kill a gren entity (80 + 2 HP) ?
Cutting the retreat path is really hard in Teamgames modes i agree, in 1V1 its a lot easier
yes you do because youre fighting a sniper at its max range, always backing off forcing you to follow and thus run into his brave defenders who will enjoy the free dps because you want to damage the sniper.
servant to the vet 5 königskübel
b4 and soviet FHQ enthusiast
fan of the illustrious black prince
b4 and soviet FHQ enthusiast
fan of the illustrious black prince
25 Aug 2015, 14:37 PM
#68
Posts: 830
Do you need a lot of power to kill a gren entity (80 + 2 HP) ?
Cutting the retreat path is really hard in Teamgames modes i agree, in 1V1 its a lot easier
90% of the times it retreats into either a defensive force or it just retreats fully. If you have one conscript or rifle squad flanking into it's retreat path, it usually gets away.
25 Aug 2015, 14:38 PM
#69
Posts: 830
yes you do because youre fighting a sniper at its max range, always backing off forcing you to follow and thus run into his brave defenders who will enjoy the free dps because you want to damage the sniper.
25 Aug 2015, 14:39 PM
#70
Posts: 742 | Subs: 1
yes you do because youre fighting a sniper at its max range, always backing off forcing you to follow and thus run into his brave defenders who will enjoy the free dps because you want to damage the sniper.
This is why flanking exist, attack from multiple sides
Sniper is good yes, broken no, even if a receive accuracy would be nice on him
25 Aug 2015, 14:39 PM
#71
Posts: 830
Addressing the elephant in the room, lack of heavy vehicles.
Will help alleviate late game issues with Sherman Jumbo and/or Pershing. Also better scaling rifleman would be beneficial, better vet bonuses and tie anti-tank rifle grenade with the grenade package.
For those who say the Pershing barely had any impact, three things.... Comet... Ostwind... Sturmtiger...
Agreed but a slight nerf to the rifle's early game potential must be implemented if their late game scaling is buffed.
25 Aug 2015, 14:47 PM
#72
Posts: 2487 | Subs: 21
In your 265 USF Victory ( GG for #1 ) you haven't met a single Sniper ? or are you saying to BeefSurge that USF can kill a sniper ?
(Thanks). Of course I've played vs snipers. They are almost impossible to counter if micro'd very well (which is why REs help to deal with that mp bleed). I'm saying to BeefSurge that either way USF will have less of a bleed with 4 rifles instead of 5 vs a sniper, thus allowing for a tiny bit more flexibility.
25 Aug 2015, 15:06 PM
#73
Posts: 738
I feel like Soviets should get a t-14 armata, the faction just feels too weak without a tank to breakthrough and kill everything.
I mean relic never ruled it out so it's a strong possibility
I mean relic never ruled it out so it's a strong possibility
25 Aug 2015, 22:29 PM
#74
Posts: 830
I feel like Soviets should get a t-14 armata, the faction just feels too weak without a tank to breakthrough and kill everything.
I mean relic never ruled it out so it's a strong possibility
this is a serious thread, stop trolling and leave if you can't build up anything that comes close to reason.
26 Aug 2015, 05:15 AM
#75
Posts: 1891
(Thanks). Of course I've played vs snipers. They are almost impossible to counter if micro'd very well (which is why REs help to deal with that mp bleed). I'm saying to BeefSurge that either way USF will have less of a bleed with 4 rifles instead of 5 vs a sniper, thus allowing for a tiny bit more flexibility.
It would be cool to test this. IMO it would slow USF teching down by a hair because of more retreating/hiding with 4 man rifles, which could have a chain reaction. (Who knows Kappa.)
The Fascisti Will Pay.
26 Aug 2015, 08:15 AM
#76
Posts: 830
It would be cool to test this. IMO it would slow USF teching down by a hair because of more retreating/hiding with 4 man rifles, which could have a chain reaction. (Who knows Kappa.)
Ostheer has 4 man squads and can still hold the field. Ostheer faces more dangers to small squad sizes in the early game than USF will ever face early game.
26 Aug 2015, 08:47 AM
#77
40 
Posts: 88
Addressing the elephant in the room, lack of heavy vehicles.
Will help alleviate late game issues with Sherman Jumbo and/or Pershing. Also better scaling rifleman would be beneficial, better vet bonuses and tie anti-tank rifle grenade with the grenade package.
For those who say the Pershing barely had any impact, three things.... Comet... Ostwind... Sturmtiger...
i don't know if thats addressing the elephant in the room more like beating a dead horse.
The USF will not be getting a heavy tank any time soon i think its not so much that it wont have an impact it just changes the dynamic how how us i splayed once you get to t-4 i hink relic was intent of making the US a combined arms faction and i think a heavy vehicle supported by Jacksons would be damn near impossible for any armour to beat not to mention zooks and AT guns
26 Aug 2015, 08:49 AM
#78
40 Posts: 88
I feel like Soviets should get a t-14 armata, the faction just feels too weak without a tank to breakthrough and kill everything.
I mean relic never ruled it out so it's a strong possibility
or give em the Tsar bomb and wait to hear complains that axis still needs to be nerfed
26 Aug 2015, 09:45 AM
#79
Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1
Had some time lately, my contribution:
USF start with same amount of mp and 30 fuel
T0 :
Core Units (no need Tier unlock): RE, ATGun, .50, Ambulance (same prices)
Buying 1 officer unlock grenades
Buying 3 officers reduce all units popcap and upkeep by 1/3
T1 (150mp + 30fu) : 30 seconds to be unlock
RM (260mp)
M20 (340mp 20fu) (skirt purchase remains the same)
Lieutenant (150mp + 40fuel) unlock half-track (300mp 60fu) + unlock BARs
T2 (150mp + 40 fu) : 30 seconds to be unlock
RM (260mp)
Pack Howitzer (380mp)
Captain (150mp + 40 fu) unlock Stuart (240mp 70fu) + unlock Zooks
T3 (150mp + 90 fu) requires T1 +T2. 30 seconds to be unlock
Sherman (340mp + 110fu)
M8A1 motor carriage (260mp + 75fu)
Major (150mp + 30 fu) unlock M36 Jackson (350mp 125fu)
Different build possible:
First RM have 10mp reduction price to compensate the fact you can't buy them anymore from T0 and their late game scaling.
T0 RE spam + MG, allow you to swarm the field and take ground control with MGs. Maybe too powerful, dunno.
T1 fast RM + M20 or fast lieutenant BARs + halftrack. Early 20 is automatically balanced by the fact it doesn't have skirt before 40 munitions and delay your lieutenant and BARs. Fast Lieutenant + BARs should come around the same time as today.
T2 RM + captain + fast stuart, come around the same time as today. Force you to backtech to get BARs. but since you have access to .50 + pack howitzer, it is another way to play.
T3 requires T1 + T2 but not the officers. So you can try a fast sherman or a fast M8A1. Problem is you will be lacking of mobile power and no BARs or Zooks to cover you. But you have Atgun and .50
Fast T3 BO need to be tested to adjust the cost, don't know how it can break the actual balance.
M36 Jackson comes at the same time as today with the Major Unlock.
Only think I added is a general buff once you bought each of the officer, 1/3 popcap and upkeep reduction for a faction struggling late game.
USF start with same amount of mp and 30 fuel
T0 :
Core Units (no need Tier unlock): RE, ATGun, .50, Ambulance (same prices)
Buying 1 officer unlock grenades
Buying 3 officers reduce all units popcap and upkeep by 1/3
T1 (150mp + 30fu) : 30 seconds to be unlock
RM (260mp)
M20 (340mp 20fu) (skirt purchase remains the same)
Lieutenant (150mp + 40fuel) unlock half-track (300mp 60fu) + unlock BARs
T2 (150mp + 40 fu) : 30 seconds to be unlock
RM (260mp)
Pack Howitzer (380mp)
Captain (150mp + 40 fu) unlock Stuart (240mp 70fu) + unlock Zooks
T3 (150mp + 90 fu) requires T1 +T2. 30 seconds to be unlock
Sherman (340mp + 110fu)
M8A1 motor carriage (260mp + 75fu)
Major (150mp + 30 fu) unlock M36 Jackson (350mp 125fu)
Different build possible:
First RM have 10mp reduction price to compensate the fact you can't buy them anymore from T0 and their late game scaling.
T0 RE spam + MG, allow you to swarm the field and take ground control with MGs. Maybe too powerful, dunno.
T1 fast RM + M20 or fast lieutenant BARs + halftrack. Early 20 is automatically balanced by the fact it doesn't have skirt before 40 munitions and delay your lieutenant and BARs. Fast Lieutenant + BARs should come around the same time as today.
T2 RM + captain + fast stuart, come around the same time as today. Force you to backtech to get BARs. but since you have access to .50 + pack howitzer, it is another way to play.
T3 requires T1 + T2 but not the officers. So you can try a fast sherman or a fast M8A1. Problem is you will be lacking of mobile power and no BARs or Zooks to cover you. But you have Atgun and .50
Fast T3 BO need to be tested to adjust the cost, don't know how it can break the actual balance.
M36 Jackson comes at the same time as today with the Major Unlock.
Only think I added is a general buff once you bought each of the officer, 1/3 popcap and upkeep reduction for a faction struggling late game.
26 Aug 2015, 10:42 AM
#80
Posts: 2561
i don't know if thats addressing the elephant in the room more like beating a dead horse.
The USF will not be getting a heavy tank any time soon i think its not so much that it wont have an impact it just changes the dynamic how how us i splayed once you get to t-4 i hink relic was intent of making the US a combined arms faction and i think a heavy vehicle supported by Jacksons would be damn near impossible for any armour to beat not to mention zooks and AT guns
I thought this was common knowledge by now. The pershing model is already done. It's only a matter of when now.
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