At nades in the new workshop beta patch

Hi guys,

Just played multiple games in the new workshop version of the comming patch. Anti tank grenades still give insta engine crits when the health is around 90-100%. This happened to me 90% of the time when a tank with 90-100% health got hit by a at nade.

Anyone else noticing this as well? It was kinda lame since they 'changed' it a patch back.

Which tank?

Which tank?

Panzer 4 (ostheer), Panzer 4 Ausf J (OKW). Panzerfausts do this as well, with the t34-76 and t34-85.

Panzer 4 (ostheer), Panzer 4 Ausf J (OKW). Panzerfausts do this as well, with the t34-76 and t34-85.

Outside of the T34/85 all those tanks have 640 hp and therefore only need to surpass a threshold of 160 damage after the faust to receive an engine crit. If I recall correctly fausts and AT nades do 80 damage so that means any 640hp tank with 88% or less health is going to take engine damage from a faust. The T34/85 meanwhile needs to be below 85% to take a crit. Are you certain the tanks are above 90% hp after faust damage is calculated?

Outside of the T34/85 all those tanks have 640 hp and therefore only need to surpass a threshold of 160 damage after the faust to receive an engine crit. If I recall correctly fausts and AT nades do 80 damage so that means any 640hp tank with 88% or less health is going to take engine damage from a faust. The T34/85 meanwhile needs to be below 85% to take a crit. Are you certain the tanks are above 90% hp after faust damage is calculated?

Yes they were, and some low health tanks got hit on the rear and got nothing. RNG 4 ever

It's because the grenade damage brings the tank down to 75%. If I am remembering this correctly, the crit is applied after the damage from the snare is calculated, can one of the stat experts clarify this for us? IMO the threshold needs to be lowered to ~55% if they want to achieve the desired effect of medium tanks being able to roam/flank effectively. Shit, a 100% health tank will actually get a damage engine from a single AT nade if it is marked. It's still ridiculously easy for baseline infantry to damage engines. This change was really hyped by the closed balance testers but imo it's not achieving the desired results.

As it stands now, it only takes a tiny amount of damage in order to bring a tank low enough to damage the engine with a single vehicle snare. If the idea is to allow medium vehicles to effectively push into enemy lines, then the threshold needs to be lowered, because it takes basically nothing to damage a tank enough to AT nade it, and every mediocre player is going to have at least something to damage a tank enough to snare it, even from full health.

Outside of the T34/85 all those tanks have 640 hp and therefore only need to surpass a threshold of 160 damage after the faust to receive an engine crit. If I recall correctly fausts and AT nades do 80 damage so that means any 640hp tank with 88% or less health is going to take engine damage from a faust. The T34/85 meanwhile needs to be below 85% to take a crit. Are you certain the tanks are above 90% hp after faust damage is calculated?

All forms of snares do 100 damage. They only differ in their projectile and penetration.

I think the confusion the thread author has is related to how the snare works now. The check whether a vehicles receives an engine damage or not is done after the damage of the faust/at nade is applied. Any tank that falls below the 75% threshold after the 100 damage is applied (if the nade penetrated) will receive an engine damage critical.

I think he was assuming that if the tank was at 90% health before the at nade hit, it wouldn't get the critical.

Yes they were, and some low health tanks got hit on the rear and got nothing. RNG 4 ever

This suprises me. I haven't played with the update that they just released but played a couple of games with the patch/mod from yesterday and never had anything like this happen.

Regarding the nades from the back. If the tank was bigger than a p4 (panther, tiger, elefant, etc.) there is a chance that the at nade deflects.

Could you upload the replay? It would help a lot to find out what went wrong.

As it stands now, it only takes a tiny amount of damage in order to bring a tank low enough to damage the engine with a single vehicle snare. If the idea is to allow medium vehicles to effectively push into enemy lines, then the threshold needs to be lowered, because it takes basically nothing to damage a tank enough to AT nade it, and every mediocre player is going to have at least something to damage a tank enough to snare it, even from full health.

It really depends on what the change was meant to accomplish. If the change was meant to make tanks on flanks harder to engine crit when they encounter lone infantry squads it is a success as it means a single at snare won't slow down a tank that is far away from support chasing away back capping squads. If it was meant to give tanks the ability to better maneuver in the middle of a major engagement then I agree that it isn't accomplishing enough since in those scenarios there is a lot of AT damage going out that can make tanks fairly easy to snare.

HOWEVER, I have also seen 100% tanks of medium range take an eng crit and the damage was around 85% or more and a eng crit was still applied. It seems to happen more to Ost tanks than T34s but it is incosistent at best with what is published

All forms of snares do 100 damage. They only differ in their projectile and penetration.

I think the confusion the thread author has is related to how the snare works now. The check whether a vehicles receives an engine damage or not is done after the damage of the faust/at nade is applied. Any tank that falls below the 75% threshold after the 100 damage is applied (if the nade penetrated) will receive an engine damage critical.

I think he was assuming that if the tank was at 90% health before the at nade hit, it wouldn't get the critical.

That was indeed what I was assuming. But why did they implement this then, if one at nade can get a tank below said threshold we still have the same problem as we had before with insta engine crits. Only heavy tanks might not be effected with their larger health pool, but they are not made for fast flanking manouvres. The change makes no sense then.

This suprises me. I haven't played with the update that they just released but played a couple of games with the patch/mod from yesterday and never had anything like this happen.

Regarding the nades from the back. If the tank was bigger than a p4 (panther, tiger, elefant, etc.) there is a chance that the at nade deflects.

Could you upload the replay? It would help a lot to find out what went wrong.

I have played some matchmaking games after that. I will play the workshop versio again today, if it happens again I will post a replay asap.

HOWEVER, I have also seen 100% tanks of medium range take an eng crit and the damage was around 85% or more and a eng crit was still applied. It seems to happen more to Ost tanks than T34s but it is incosistent at best with what is published

Just as I have seen. To put further insult to injury, some tanks take no engine crit when they have low health and get at naded from the rear.

tbh i somehow always liked the AT nade mechanics in this game as you had to use your tanks more ike tanks and not like crushing nascars

That was indeed what I was assuming. But why did they implement this then, if one at nade can get a tank below said threshold we still have the same problem as we had before with insta engine crits.

All vehicles with more than 400 hp are affected by the change. If your tank was fully, repaired it wouldn't have received the engine critical. If you however took any other at fire before (1 zook shot or 2 ptrs hits are enough) you'll get the crit.

The way they implemented it is actually rather clever because it means that light vehicles, which can be hard to deal with at the start of the game (m3 with flamerthrower engineers in it, for example) will always receive the engine damage critical. Had they done it the other way round (check the health before the damage of the at snare is applied) light vehicles wouldn't be snared, which can be devastating in the early game.