COH2.ORG » Forums » Parlor Room » COH2 Central » COH2 Gameplay » Tank smoke.

Tank smoke.

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Posts: 393

I know this has been brought up countless times, but are we ever going to see a change to tank smoke?

It is a skilless, get-out-of-jail-free ability that ignores bad play and is heavily RNG influenced. The only counter play is attack grounding which is extremely inaccurate and straight up broken on certain maps due to the geometry. Players need never be afraid of overextending into ATGs, Su-85s and Jacksons when they can get away scot-free.

It is neither an exciting ability nor is it being used as an aggressive tool which I'm sure Relic intended it to be used as.

I'd suggest making the vehicle only able to pop smoke if has no critical applied to it. This way we would see it more as an offensive tool than the phase plasma shield it is now.

This also applies to blitz (even though it was nerfed on heavies iirc). Blitz isn't as bad since the tank is still hittable, but the solution here is simple: Don't let the tank use blitz when reversing.

Posts: 505

27 Jun 2015, 14:18 PMPurlictor

I know this has been brought up countless times, but are we ever going to see a change to tank smoke?

It is a skilless, get-out-of-jail-free ability that ignores bad play and is heavily RNG influenced. The only counter play is attack grounding which is extremely inaccurate and straight up broken on certain maps due to the geometry. Players need never be afraid of overextending into ATGs, Su-85s and Jacksons when they can get away scot-free.

It is neither an exciting ability nor is it being used as an aggressive tool which I'm sure Relic intended it to be used as.

I'd suggest making the vehicle only able to pop smoke if has no critical applied to it. This way we would see it more as an offensive tool than the phase plasma shield it is now.

This also applies to blitz (even though it was nerfed on heavies iirc). Blitz isn't as bad since the tank is still hittable, but the solution here is simple: Don't let the tank use blitz when reversing.

I think the cant have been crit'd thing is a bit much. Although I do agree its a bit too easy.

Having to manually aim it, like the Sherman has to would go a long way to making this ability more balanced. Using it offensively would mean a much larger level of micro, especially if being used by multiple vehicles simultaneously.

I'd be happy for it to be that way.

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yep. it is too easy.

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Posts: 187

27 Jun 2015, 14:18 PMPurlictor

Don't let the tank use blitz when reversing.

I don't think they have away to set forward and reverse speeds. However you could make blitz an out of combat ability so it can only be used at the start of an assault and not as a get away speed buff.

Posts: 1116 | Subs: 1

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27 Jun 2015, 16:23 PMTetley

I don't think they have away to set forward and reverse speeds. However you could make blitz an out of combat ability so it can only be used at the start of an assault and not as a get away speed buff.

Yes thats an alternative, but If that were the case then the speed buff should be lengthened by about 5 seconds. Because it currently only last 10 seconds.

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Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

Would require a change of a lot of doctrines, which Relic probably isn't going to do.

Buuuuuut they have said they are going to rework all Vet abilities so Blitz will probably get a change/removed.

Posts: 538

I like the way Shermans use smoke. Fire it somewhere. That works beautifully.
-->use that for Wehr as well is my suggestion

Posts: 1708 | Subs: 2

I would like them to at least make panzer tactician be like how sherman smoke is deployed instead of how it currently is (press button to not die)

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

Free deployable smoke on literally every vehicle with half an inch of armor if you made it the way the Sherman smoke is would probably be a little bit more OP than it currently is.

Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4

They should have just avoided putting it on the best Ostheer commanders. Elite and Spearhead do not need this at all. It would be good if they switched them for the air dropped smoke pots on these commanders.

I'd say it's fine on Fortified Armor, Festung Armor, Blitzkrieg, and Mobile Defense because of how little these doctrines are used.

Posts: 2561

The smoke at least needs to have a slight 2 second delay or something. It's the instant nature of the ability that bugs me the most. They can just walk right into situations that will get their tanks killed, cause causalities for enemy players, pop smoke and get away with 0 cost to themselves.

And attack ground is not always something players can do in time. Most players simply don't have the micro skill to hit attack ground instantly. It can take even good players around 3 seconds and that's

Right now the ability too heavily rewards bad micro and decisions. It's way too good, especially on already hard to kill tanks like panthers and tigers.

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27 Jun 2015, 18:48 PMOmega_Warrior

And attack ground is not always something players can do in time. Most players simply don't have the micro skill to hit attack ground instantly. It can take even good players around 3 seconds and that's

.

3 seconds to press "G", aim, and click?

I don't agree, it takes at most, half a second to do this.

Posts: 2561

27 Jun 2015, 18:51 PMQueenRatchet123

3 seconds to press "G", aim, and click?

I don't agree, it takes at most, half a second to do this.

Maybe for you. Not at generally intermediate level play I see. Things in this game need to be need to be balanced for not only high level players but lower as well.

Most players I see can take a good two seconds just to hit reverse, and that's something they are prepared to do. Smoke comes with no warning and will catch a lot of players off guard as they scramble to hit G and the right spot.

Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2

Well, 3secs is more than enought. I assume that smoking tank is in the center of battle, and you see it. Hotkey for AT gun, hotkey for ground attack and 1 click is something you can do in 1-1.5s especially if you have cursor ready over target since you do everything else with hotkeys.
Just a bit of practice

To the topic...

I think, all skill abilities should be countered with skills, so skill-less abilities should be easily countered by your own skills. From that point of view, if we assume that ground attack requires some mid-level skills to execute right, it's fine between Sherman smoke and ground attack - skill smoke vs skill micro. But PT is truly braindead ability which you can try to deny with your own skills - not fair. One big smoke nade aimed manually would be better cause right now it's A-move + "Oh shit, 2 ZiSes" + smoke and be happy.

It promotes brainless attacks which are not punished.

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Try to use more than just "T" and "R" for hotkeys.

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Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

Panzer Tactician on light vehicles like the Puma, HT, and whatnot are fine because they do need the extra survivability later in the game. Were it gets problematic is when you have Tigers/Panthers running around field using it.

Personally I would like to see Panzer Tactician for the Tiger and Panther get switched to a "smoke thrower" like the Sherman.

Posts: 2561

27 Jun 2015, 19:52 PMAlexzandvar

Panzer Tactician on light vehicles like the Puma, HT, and whatnot are fine because they do need the extra survivability later in the game. Were it gets problematic is when you have Tigers/Panthers running around field using it.

Yeah on light vehicles it's perfectly fine. Most of them die in two hits anyway.

Posts: 550 | Subs: 1

27 Jun 2015, 18:18 PMAlexzandvar

Free deployable smoke on literally every vehicle with half an inch of armor if you made it the way the Sherman smoke is would probably be a little bit more OP than it currently is.

I won't comment on whether anything would be op or not, however:

Neither panzer tactician nor sherman smoke is free.

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

27 Jun 2015, 19:55 PMsherlock

I won't comment on whether anything would be op or not, however:

Neither panzer tactician nor sherman smoke is free.

Panzer Tact isn't free, Sherman smoke however is.

Posts: 2561

27 Jun 2015, 20:38 PMAlexzandvar

Panzer Tact isn't free, Sherman smoke however is.

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7.
Oorah!
550
230
.705
+1
8.
Zsirbacsi
363
206
.638
+17
9.
★DEFEKTOJIOG★
120
39
.755
+2
10.
Dieter
306
155
.664
-1

                    

                        1.
NeedBanner
192
90
.681
+14
2.
godjaemin
660
261
.717
+2
3.
ZEAL
942
383
.711
+3
4.
Rodinho
640
355
.643
+4
5.
1SAYE
815
273
.749
+22
6.
Misaki
229
67
.774
+2
7.
[Dengue]™Alexandro
1218
390
.757
+8
8.
浦和小调
808
325
.713
+2
9.
好好做个人行吗
1227
729
.627
-2
10.
White pigs delete the game
702
351
.667
+3

                    

                        1.
vonLewinski
458
159
.742
+12
2.
GiantDwarf
845
203
.806
+11
3.
GiantDwarf
391
56
.875
+10
4.
ChadusRiflemen
287
86
.769
+3
5.
ker_141
398
148
.729
+5
6.
night_raven0203
3587
1758
.671
+4
7.
elpern
382
166
.697
+8
8.
逼罗，逼罗 你妈很滑很润
1291
480
.729
+11
9.
[-✰-81] Cc
463
220
.678
+5
10.
джинь
826
140
.855
-1

                    

                        1.
ChadusRiflemen
476
195
.709
+4
2.
DIRTY_FINISHER
2697
1457
.649
-1
3.
Aljosa - Buy Me A Car [BOBER]
130
48
.730
-2
4.
☞ ps3YES ☜
951
397
.705
+1
5.
MightBeTheMeowGamer
138
69
.667
-1
6.
CrossFire- JellyBelly
1045
381
.733
+1
7.
Pioneer
191
101
.654
-1
8.
William H. Harrison
515
211
.709
+4
9.
Zirty Zoggy
93
26
.782
-2
10.
BatON
1188
785
.602
+4

                    

                        1.
SFC. LEE ッ
3377
1089
.756
+1
2.
Oorah!
359
153
.701
+1
3.
★DEFEKTOJIOG★
65
13
.833
+1
4.
JOE
1244
753
.623
+2
5.
Sumi
351
303
.537
-2
6.
125656923
276
199
.581
+1
7.
itsjomal
111
45
.712
+1
8.
쿨게이
247
125
.664
+12
9.
Pedro.
417
286
.593
+3
10.
Irrelephant
146
82
.640
+4

                    

                        1.
godjaemin
395
284
.582
+5
2.
卡提希娅高手
894
743
.546
+1
3.
浦和小调
407
260
.610
+1
4.
末逝
362
234
.607
+4
5.
King of Lee
788
592
.571
+3
6.
TN.Lhunathix
960
670
.589
+7
7.
Brown
174
75
.699
+2
8.
BATTLEDANNY1
519
352
.596
+1
9.
CNposition
330
217
.603
+1
10.
Shiranui Second XFJ-01a
432
330
.567
+1

                    

                        1.
джинь
596
82
.879
+10
2.
MoronPark_Cat YE
431
63
.872
+9
3.
Eisernes Kreuz
148
39
.791
+7
4.
오리야꽥꽥해
288
162
.640
+6
5.
RoadmanR_UwU
143
48
.749
-1
6.
Aljosa - Buy Me A Car [BOBER]
181
51
.780
+4
7.
Bloop
143
65
.688
+11
8.
miGOTE
389
260
.599
+3
9.
小鱼干
186
78
.705
+1
10.
Boomerwaffen
814
466
.636
+2

                    

                        1.
Aljosa - Buy Me A Car [BOBER]
286
169
.629
+2
2.
DIRTY_FINISHER
1704
928
.647
+4
3.
CrossFire- JellyBelly
1003
300
.770
+5
4.
Zirty Zoggy
107
25
.811
+1
5.
Burden
169
62
.732
-1
6.
Solmeer
173
72
.706
+3
7.
MightBeTheMeowGamer
121
42
.742
+1
8.
HSRometh
780
615
.559
-1
9.
MoronPark_Cat YE
72
15
.828
-2
10.
Sir Ducksworth
491
329
.599
-1

                    

                        1.
Thales
817
302
.730
-1
2.
Remder
636
186
.774
+6
3.
계엄령
1592
782
.671
-2
4.
BATTLEDANNY1
105
28
.789
+2
5.
Ovidiu
1582
789
.667
+3
6.
Riiiiina
328
127
.721
+16
7.
★DEFEKTOJIOG★
120
51
.702
+1
8.
Kaianto
98
36
.731
-1
9.
SoE-Sturmpanther
369
62
.856
-1
10.
TaLa
275
168
.621
+3

                    

                        1.
BeRyan
971
647
.600
+7
2.
卡提希娅高手
622
434
.589
+3
3.
死者为大
411
188
.686
+8
4.
ukill
273
198
.580
-1
5.
开图炸房死一户口本
141
60
.701
+2
6.
Starry sky
856
649
.569
+2
7.
King of Lee
452
331
.577
+2
8.
浦和小调
353
230
.605
+1
9.
M U N O
329
201
.621
+3
10.
破阵子1945
84
71
.542
+2

                    

						Data provided by 
						
						 Relic Entertainment
					