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Who needs heavy tanks...when you got...

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Pedro_Jedi
4 Mar 2015, 12:38 PM
#21
avatar of Pedro_Jedi

Posts: 543

jump backJump back to quoted post4 Mar 2015, 10:03 AMAladdin


1 Katy=200 fuel (including tier and katy herself)=almost 1 IS2 (can make you very vulnerable, delaying ur callins/tanks, etc (specially in 1v1)).


I'm always a little unconfortable with these calculations that put the price of the building on top of the price of the vehicle. Seeing that you'll probably build more than just one Katy (SU-85's, Katy's, Su-76 if you're brave enough), maybe it's more correct to just dilute the price of the building on all built vehicles.

I know, what we are measuring here is actually time, but this does not include random factors like holding 2 fuels, building caches, drops, etc etc etc.

But, OT, I played again some games with sov's and ostheer, and man the Katyusha is a pain in the arse.
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Highfiveeeee
4 Mar 2015, 13:24 PM
#22
avatar of Highfiveeeee

Posts: 1740

I don't know what to think about buffing howitzers...
I sadly remember the patch where Katjushas became Stukas with about 30 shots destroying everything.
I will never trust Relic in balancing again and neither should you.
It is though God by command has withdrawn every other throne.
And God is saying 'No. These people will deal with me alone.'

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Aladdin
4 Mar 2015, 13:43 PM
#23
avatar of Aladdin

Posts: 959

jump backJump back to quoted post4 Mar 2015, 12:38 PMPedro_Jedi


I'm always a little unconfortable with these calculations that put the price of the building on top of the price of the vehicle. Seeing that you'll probably build more than just one Katy (SU-85's, Katy's, Su-76 if you're brave enough), maybe it's more correct to just dilute the price of the building on all built vehicles.

I know, what we are measuring here is actually time, but this does not include random factors like holding 2 fuels, building caches, drops, etc etc etc.

But, OT, I played again some games with sov's and ostheer, and man the Katyusha is a pain in the arse.


I was talking about 1v1, and how many vehicles do u think one could afford to build from that in a normal match! especially if u're going to skip t34/76 (or t70) or delay ur callins. That can work in some games, but generally that's not the case.
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Aladdin
4 Mar 2015, 13:46 PM
#24
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Posts: 959

jump backJump back to quoted post4 Mar 2015, 10:11 AMAustralian Magic


Yes, in 1v1 that's obvious but in team games? It does not matter. You can easily make ML-20, Katy and 2 SU85s.


Although in 2v2 I really often go for B-4 + SU85 + KV1 as dmg sponge + Katy.


yes I meant 1v1, I agree with you about team games, but still howitzer with the amount of damage it can deal can be still a game changer, although it probably works better in some certain maps.

The thing I don't like about COH2 is that in many games, you lose/win to the MAP and not to your opponents.
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braciszek
4 Mar 2015, 13:48 PM
#25
avatar of braciszek

Posts: 2053

Irregulars. D:

Havent seen in so long for obvious reasons...
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Rollo
4 Mar 2015, 13:49 PM
#26
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Posts: 738

Rzhev is arty heaven because it encourages static play with the Ice and fuel/VP locations. Imo one game doesn't really equal the ML-20 being good, it and the wehr howitzer are pretty terribad compared to the B-4 and rarely pay for themselves by the time they get bombed by off map Arty.

Click for depression

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elchino7
4 Mar 2015, 14:47 PM
#27
avatar of elchino7
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Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

3v3+ and you don't have any offmap to nuke artillery -> You are doing something wrong.

My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.

Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.

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Aerohank
4 Mar 2015, 14:54 PM
#28
avatar of Aerohank

Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1

In team games Soviet artillery is extremely deadly, but 1 opponent with Close Air Support can render it all useless.

In 1v1 vs an equal opponent, the ML-20 is a big investment that you can only afford if your opponent does not go for call-in tanks as Ostheer, or does not go for a fast T3 into panther as OKW.
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Burts
4 Mar 2015, 14:55 PM
#29
avatar of Burts

Posts: 1702

The ml-20 is just simply a mediocre unit. It's not a good unit like B4 or shocks, and not a bad unit like the su-76.

It's just one of those units that are decent but call ins are a better choice most of the time.
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FaustCostBulletin
4 Mar 2015, 16:37 PM
#30
avatar of FaustCostBulletin

Posts: 521

Personally, I prefer the LeFH. It doesn't have a better alternative that comes in better doctrines like B4 does, and LeFH kills infantry fine, has a longer barrage, and has a Counterbattery ability that has been very useful to me. It can kill 120mm mortars, 81mm, and effectively shut down any kind of artillery except maybe Katyusha (which still gets killed sometimes) the enemy has; which is apparently more abundant on the Soviet side according to some. So that's gotta be something right?

However, ML-20 has been pretty interesting so far in my minimod where you can build T-34/85 without doctrines, so I can go for it without having to sacrifice call-ins. Which I think is its main problem in vanilla. It's an okay unit while call-ins are mandatory.
Find out about my redesign of all four factions, with more to come!

Feel free to contact me regarding your Attribute Editor-related questions.
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Alexzandvar
4 Mar 2015, 16:53 PM
#31
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Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

The LefH is worse than the 120mm mortar.
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pigsoup
4 Mar 2015, 17:32 PM
#32
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Patrion 14

Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2

surprised you could even use a static howi.

team game meta is one ost player going cas commander and cheesing the battlefield with skillplanez which includes a recon pass and dive bomb.

i like howi very much and think it is needed against any decent axis team, but cas makes me not go howi even i go terror commander most of the time. we just use priests.



















Playercard of Bo-Bobby Lion

3v3: Pstreak: - 3
3v3: Pstreak: + 8
3v3: Pstreak: - 3
3v3: Pstreak: - 2


















Playercard of Bo-Bobby Lion

3v3: Pstreak: - 3
2v2: Pstreak: - 2with Ohme
2v2: Pstreak: + 1with Ohme
2v2: Pstreak: + 3with Medman






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Panta
5 Mar 2015, 00:56 AM
#33
avatar of Panta

Posts: 2

http://www.coh2.org/replay/31718/ml-20
Playercard of Panta

1v1: P2v2: P3v3: P4v4: P
1v1: P2v2: P3v3: None4v4: P
1v1: P2v2: P3v3: P4v4: P
1v1: None2v2: P3v3: None4v4: P


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Pedro_Jedi
5 Mar 2015, 01:28 AM
#34
avatar of Pedro_Jedi

Posts: 543

jump backJump back to quoted post4 Mar 2015, 13:43 PMAladdin


I was talking about 1v1, and how many vehicles do u think one could afford to build from that in a normal match! especially if u're going to skip t34/76 (or t70) or delay ur callins. That can work in some games, but generally that's not the case.


Well, as u can see, I'm mainly a 1v1 player, rather mediocre at stats. But I can assure u that I can push much more than 1 or 2 vehicles, with or without call-ins.

I like to try some different stuff, and it's not rare for me to not use IS2 or T34-85 for some period. Since I'm not good, I lose a lot, but have a blast playing it, at least
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FaustCostBulletin
5 Mar 2015, 09:36 AM
#35
avatar of FaustCostBulletin

Posts: 521

jump backJump back to quoted post4 Mar 2015, 16:53 PMAlexzandvar
The LefH is worse than the 120mm mortar.


LeFH on counterbattery is not so I don't see the comparison here. Counterbattery is the keyword here. It is immense pressure on so called Allies artillery superiority.
Find out about my redesign of all four factions, with more to come!

Feel free to contact me regarding your Attribute Editor-related questions.
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turbotortoise
5 Mar 2015, 09:49 AM
#36
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Posts: 1283 | Subs: 4



indirect fire shoutout from the USF camp!
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Katitof
5 Mar 2015, 10:05 AM
#37
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Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post4 Mar 2015, 16:53 PMAlexzandvar
The LefH is worse than the 120mm mortar.

And tiger is worse then KV-1, yes, we've seen your sparks of brilliance before, keep them for yourself unless you applied for a clown and getting the experience.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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Alexzandvar
5 Mar 2015, 15:12 PM
#38
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Mar 2015, 09:36 AMFaustCostBulletin


LeFH on counterbattery is not so I don't see the comparison here. Counterbattery is the keyword here. It is immense pressure on so called Allies artillery superiority.


The soviet howitzers are better at killing enemy artillery due to precision shot.

jump backJump back to quoted postYesterday, 16:53 PMAlexzandvar
The LefH is worse than the 120mm mortar.

And tiger is worse then KV-1, yes, we've seen your sparks of brilliance before, keep them for yourself unless you applied for a clown and getting the experience.


The lefh only does slightly more damage while costing 100 manpower more. And the lefh can't move to reduce its scatter. Stop being an ass.
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Katitof
5 Mar 2015, 15:19 PM
#39
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Mar 2015, 15:12 PMAlexzandvar


The soviet howitzers are better at killing enemy artillery due to precision shot.



The lefh only does slightly more damage while costing 100 manpower more. And the lefh can't move to reduce its scatter. Stop being an ass.

200 dmg vs 80 dmg per shot.

"slightly"

And costing 100 menpower more then what? There is not a single unit in game that costs 500mp.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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FaustCostBulletin
5 Mar 2015, 15:29 PM
#40
avatar of FaustCostBulletin

Posts: 521

Pak43 :mvgame:

Alex not knowing how much LeFh goes to show his extent of experience with the thing
Find out about my redesign of all four factions, with more to come!

Feel free to contact me regarding your Attribute Editor-related questions.
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