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How to prevent blobs

26 Mar 2015, 16:01 PM
#81
avatar of Aladdin

Posts: 959

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Mar 2015, 12:55 PMpigsoup


i guess you mean b4 when you say by far superior indirect fire and i agree about demo, but what other much stronger support weapons?

soviet just simply does not have an AOE suppression platform, M2HB is nice, needs support like HMG42.


what support weapons? maxim, 50cal., mortars, AT guns (Ost pak40 is good but OKW's rocketen is garbage), etc. and not only B4 btw!Katusha is great for its price and punishes blob hard, priest is great against buildings and even ML20 is devastating against building and if only one shot lands it can kill a whole army (specially because of this stupid mechanics where all ur troops gather in one small point sometimes, ...
26 Mar 2015, 16:56 PM
#82
avatar of pigsoup
Patrion 14

Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Mar 2015, 16:01 PMAladdin


what support weapons? maxim, 50cal., mortars, AT guns (Ost pak40 is good but OKW's rocketen is garbage), etc. and not only B4 btw!Katusha is great for its price and punishes blob hard, priest is great against buildings and even ML20 is devastating against building and if only one shot lands it can kill a whole army (specially because of this stupid mechanics where all ur troops gather in one small point sometimes, ...




The Maxim is currently the most durable and easy to use MG in the game, and the 82mm mortar's vet ability is excellent.

Soviets have the best blob counters in the game, not really much contest there. Axis doesn't have anything like the ISU or B4.



one question. i just want to know. do you guys think allies blobs are as much of a problem as axis blob?
26 Mar 2015, 16:58 PM
#83
avatar of WingZero

Posts: 1484

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Mar 2015, 16:56 PMpigsoup




one question. i just want to know. do you guys think allies blobs are as much of a problem as axis blob?


When I am playing Axis, I have no problem dealing with Rifle blob what so ever. OKW blobs on the hand have Shreks for AT and Obers for AI, perfect mix.
26 Mar 2015, 17:08 PM
#84
avatar of Aladdin

Posts: 959

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Mar 2015, 16:56 PMpigsoup




one question. i just want to know. do you guys think allies blobs are as much of a problem as axis blob?


yes, because if you are a good allies player, your opponent blobing means his defeat.

Also, early and mid game are very infantry based where a mighty rifleblob (which can be deadly with BAR for instance) can be a serious problem for axis (specially in close combat maps).

Just remember, as axis when you blob there is always the risk of all ur army blowing up with a demo charge, but as allies you don't need to worry as much cause axis doesn't even have demos (that's just an example), which makes the blober's life much easier.

When I play allies, I would seriously love to see my opponent blobing, cause I punish him for blobbing which results to my win.
26 Mar 2015, 17:47 PM
#85
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Mar 2015, 16:56 PMpigsoup




one question. i just want to know. do you guys think allies blobs are as much of a problem as axis blob?


Rifleblobs, Shock blobs, they are all a pain in the ass to deal with.

Every faction in the game blobs, this isn't some special attribute only reserved for Axis, it's just what the current meta is.

Soviets have a massive amount of blob counters, USF, OKW, and Ost, not so much.
26 Mar 2015, 18:44 PM
#86
avatar of drChengele
Patrion 14

Posts: 640 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Mar 2015, 17:08 PMAladdin
yes, because if you are a good allies player, your opponent blobing means his defeat.
Yes, if you are vastly more skilled than your opponent, then you can defeat him regardless of the tactics he chooses. We knew that. Thank you.

Jesulin beat some Obers once, holy crap guys, I suppose that means they are not overpowered either.
26 Mar 2015, 18:47 PM
#87
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

Yes, if you are vastly more skilled than your opponent, then you can defeat him regardless of the tactics he chooses. We knew that. Thank you.

Jesulin beat some Obers once, holy crap guys, I suppose that means they are not overpowered either.


Obers are bullshit, but OKW blobs are stupid easy to deal with as Soviets. Not so much as USF.
26 Mar 2015, 18:58 PM
#88
avatar of drChengele
Patrion 14

Posts: 640 | Subs: 1

My problem with blobs is - they are not what this game is supposed to be. This is a game of terrain, flanking, and maneuver, with MG suppression mechanic EXPLICITLY designed (in coh1) so there is a cost effective counter to blobs. In theory.

This "infantry ball of doom" approach leaves a sour taste in my mouth. It is as if I was playing... Starcraft. I have to wash my hands and disinfect the room after playing versus a blobber before I stop feeling dirty.

Note, I am not arguing against massed infantry charges. Concentration of troops in a charge should be a valid tactic in some cases. For example, people can blob conscripts. See how far that gets you.

Obers are bullshit, but OKW blobs are stupid easy to deal with as Soviets. Not so much as USF.
With Soviets, yes, you have your demo charges, your Kats, your B4... but all that is really awfully situational. Blob counters are binary. Either you catch his blob with one or these, in which case you obliterate him, or you miss / he doesn't go over your mines / demos, in which case the blob will outgun everything you have and force you off where ever the blob is at the moment.
26 Mar 2015, 19:04 PM
#89
avatar of daspoulos

Posts: 1116 | Subs: 1

Permanently Banned
jump backJump back to quoted post26 Mar 2015, 16:56 PMpigsoup




one question. i just want to know. do you guys think allies blobs are as much of a problem as axis blob?

Speaking from an ostheer standpoint. Vs soviets only the conscript blobs are decent late game but not that bad.

Vs an american rifle blobber is more tricky. Rifles will shred an mg team from the front, so It requires sort of baiting a blob in while your units are in cover. Okw blobs are probably the best, but the allies possess a lot of one shot cheese that they have atleast some form of reliable counter.

Blobbing as ostheer is just fucking stupid and will get you rolled harder than anybody else, unless your blob only consists of vet 3 lmg grens. Which vehicle with explosives will wipe out.

Long story short, for allies its easier due to larger squads soaking up more damage and less likely to have squads wiped. For okw it works due to amazing synergy between the offensive powers of obers and the defensive powers volks while at the same time having AT. As ost its never really a good idea.
26 Mar 2015, 19:23 PM
#90
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

My problem with blobs is - they are not what this game is supposed to be. This is a game of terrain, flanking, and maneuver, with MG suppression mechanic EXPLICITLY designed (in coh1) so there is a cost effective counter to blobs. In theory.

This "infantry ball of doom" approach leaves a sour taste in my mouth. It is as if I was playing... Starcraft. I have to wash my hands and disinfect the room after playing versus a blobber before I stop feeling dirty.

Note, I am not arguing against massed infantry charges. Concentration of troops in a charge should be a valid tactic in some cases. For example, people can blob conscripts. See how far that gets you.

With Soviets, yes, you have your demo charges, your Kats, your B4... but all that is really awfully situational. Blob counters are binary. Either you catch his blob with one or these, in which case you obliterate him, or you miss / he doesn't go over your mines / demos, in which case the blob will outgun everything you have and force you off where ever the blob is at the moment.


You have more than just those 3, shocks rip enemy infantry to shreds, cons can soak up punishment, the maxim is easy to use and is much more mobile than the MG42, precision strike is amazing for attacking defensive positions and HQ's after an army retreats, the T34 is great for crushing because OKW has no snares outside of Fallsch, the mines are cheap, you also have excellent call in abilities like incendiary artillery.

Soviets have wealth of ways to deal with blobbers because you have so many squad wipetastic abilities and weapons, even the ZiS only has 10 less pen than a Pak40 and can use a barrage to wipe out blobs.
26 Mar 2015, 20:12 PM
#91
avatar of JHeartless

Posts: 1637



You have more than just those 3, shocks rip enemy infantry to shreds, cons can soak up punishment, the maxim is easy to use and is much more mobile than the MG42, precision strike is amazing for attacking defensive positions and HQ's after an army retreats, the T34 is great for crushing because OKW has no snares outside of Fallsch, the mines are cheap, you also have excellent call in abilities like incendiary artillery.

Soviets have wealth of ways to deal with blobbers because you have so many squad wipetastic abilities and weapons, even the ZiS only has 10 less pen than a Pak40 and can use a barrage to wipe out blobs.


Pfuse...mines.

Remember in Vanilla Ostheer players would bemoan not having 30 Muni spammable multipurpose mines?

OKW has them...never used...because Shrek.
26 Mar 2015, 20:43 PM
#92
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1



Pfuse...mines.

Remember in Vanilla Ostheer players would bemoan not having 30 Muni spammable multipurpose mines?

OKW has them...never used...because Shrek.


lol, getting the Panzerfuss AT nade to work is horrible, it doesn't even follow outside the range like the other nades do.

OKW doesn't use mines often because you need to get shreks out, and the mines are still expensive in a muni starved faction (early to mid game). And the larger Allied squads make mine insta wipes less likely.

26 Mar 2015, 21:10 PM
#93
avatar of WingZero

Posts: 1484



lol, getting the Panzerfuss AT nade to work is horrible, it doesn't even follow outside the range like the other nades do.

OKW doesn't use mines often because you need to get shreks out, and the mines are still expensive in a muni starved faction (early to mid game). And the larger Allied squads make mine insta wipes less likely.



Why not pick the scavenge doctrine if you are muni starved, you know how USF always need P-47 for heavy armors.
26 Mar 2015, 21:27 PM
#94
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1



Why not pick the scavenge doctrine if you are muni starved, you know how USF always need P-47 for heavy armors.


It doesn't ALWAYS need, but it makes things like the KT more manageable certainly.

And Scavenge is fine, but still OKW mines are best used late game to surprise the enemy. But they are best for killing vehicles not infantry.
26 Mar 2015, 22:39 PM
#95
avatar of JHeartless

Posts: 1637



lol, getting the Panzerfuss AT nade to work is horrible, it doesn't even follow outside the range like the other nades do.

OKW doesn't use mines often because you need to get shreks out, and the mines are still expensive in a muni starved faction (early to mid game). And the larger Allied squads make mine insta wipes less likely.



Youve been playing to the Ober meta too long. Pfuse AT Rnade works just as bad as the USFs. It follows and everything. Fixed at the same time. There is only one good Rnade that isnt buggy and it belongs to Grens.

OKW doesnt USE mines often. Doesnt mean they dont have them and that they arent a reliable snare. They are 30 muni. With that logic they couldnt use Pfausts either. Except they can they just dont. Its like saying Soviets dont have the Kat because its in T4 and no one uses T4.
26 Mar 2015, 23:24 PM
#96
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1



Youve been playing to the Ober meta too long. Pfuse AT Rnade works just as bad as the USFs. It follows and everything. Fixed at the same time. There is only one good Rnade that isnt buggy and it belongs to Grens.

OKW doesnt USE mines often. Doesnt mean they dont have them and that they arent a reliable snare. They are 30 muni. With that logic they couldnt use Pfausts either. Except they can they just dont. Its like saying Soviets dont have the Kat because its in T4 and no one uses T4.


Well, people use the Kat a lot, and people use Pfausts a lot, but not as many people use the OKW AT mine because people want to spend muni on other things.

and Pfuse AT nades are still bugged, they were supposed to get fixed the same time USF's did but they still don't work nearly as often as USF's do. It doesn't follow out of range, and THATs if you can get the bloody thing to activate.

Regardless Soviets have a shitload of blob counters, the rest of the factions don't. End of story.
26 Mar 2015, 23:48 PM
#97
avatar of JHeartless

Posts: 1637



Well, people use the Kat a lot, and people use Pfausts a lot, but not as many people use the OKW AT mine because people want to spend muni on other things.

and Pfuse AT nades are still bugged, they were supposed to get fixed the same time USF's did but they still don't work nearly as often as USF's do. It doesn't follow out of range, and THATs if you can get the bloody thing to activate.

Regardless Soviets have a shitload of blob counters, the rest of the factions don't. End of story.


Except I JUST tested Pfuse. I suggest you do the same :facepalm:

They follow and they bug out JUST as much as USF. I.e. if something causes them to duck for cover...no AT nade...if the Model dies mid animation...no AT nade....if Suppression happens to them in the middle of the anmation no at nade. Just like Rifles.
26 Mar 2015, 23:59 PM
#98
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1



Except I JUST tested Pfuse. I suggest you do the same :facepalm:

They follow and they bug out JUST as much as USF. I.e. if something causes them to duck for cover...no AT nade...if the Model dies mid animation...no AT nade....if Suppression happens to them in the middle of the anmation no at nade. Just like Rifles.


I never said USF's didn't bug out, my point was Fuss's snare isn't reliable so crushing is a big weakness for OKW.
27 Mar 2015, 00:42 AM
#99
avatar of JHeartless

Posts: 1637



I never said USF's didn't bug out, my point was Fuss's snare isn't reliable so crushing is a big weakness for OKW.


And my point is since they are the same and I can use Rifles AT nade just fine since I have literally had to deal with it hundreds of times that you try the same with Pfuse because....they still work.

OKW has plenty of snares if you chose not to use them thats your bad.
27 Mar 2015, 01:35 AM
#100
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

I think this was the problem he might be referring to.

From Kappatch: "Removed 1 second lifetime limit from fusilier at nade, kinda silly for it to be the only one to constantly go poof in midair due to it."
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