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Kappatch - A minor rebalance mod

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31 Oct 2014, 19:07 PM
#141
avatar of VonIvan

Posts: 2487 | Subs: 21


However, I do think it's a little silly that when Relic releases patch notes they are damned before even going live and getting a chance to play it, and when Cruzz does the same everyone praises it like it's gospel. I guess it's understandable that a clean slate and wide eyed optimism are much preferred over the track record of Relics patches.

That's because Cruzz is the Jesus of CoH2.
31 Oct 2014, 19:49 PM
#142
avatar of Cabreza

Posts: 656

jump backJump back to quoted post31 Oct 2014, 19:07 PMVonIvan

That's because Cruzz is the Jesus of CoH2.


Can we get that image as the portrait for the Kappatch? Right now it's thumbnail image totally blank.
31 Oct 2014, 20:04 PM
#143
avatar of QueenRatchet123

Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2

Permanently Banned
this mod must be used in future tourneys
31 Oct 2014, 20:22 PM
#144
avatar of RPhilMan1

Posts: 106

Let's get a cast of a game using this mod. I'd like to see it in action.
31 Oct 2014, 20:26 PM
#145
avatar of Napalm

Posts: 1595 | Subs: 2

and when Cruzz does the same everyone praises it like it's gospel. I guess it's understandable that a clean slate and wide eyed optimism are much preferred over the track record of Relics patches.


Johns I think the big thing about the Cruzz patch is that it addresses out standing balance issues that have been around since the games release.

Cruzz, if there is something I could suggest for the next revision it would be revisiting the Vet 1 abilities on the Soviet faction.
31 Oct 2014, 20:32 PM
#146
avatar of Mr. Someguy

Posts: 4928

jump backJump back to quoted post31 Oct 2014, 08:03 AMCruzz
Because the LMG34 on them is so far out of the weapon performance curve it ain't even funny, needed to do something about it without altering the Obers too much. Any squad picking them up is a terminator. Maybe just flat out nerfing the MG34 and giving the 3 other guys better base weapons is a better choice, we'll see. But they absolutely need to have their damage spread out between the models better than now.

I could see increasing the base Kar98's being a problem with recrewing though. Imagine an MG 42 with half an Ober's DPS guarding the flank, it'd be the old Penal MG all over again.

Instead, is it possible to reduce the DPS of their rifles and the MG 34 to normal levels, then add a +35% (number is a guestination) accuracy bonus to the squad that loses effect if a model leaves the squad (to recrew a weapon)? I'd imagine it's possible, Veteran troops don't retain their bonuses when they recrew another weapon, I just don't know how complex it would be to work out.



I´d like spawning from ambient building removed from jaeger light infantry and stormtroopers, so that partisans and falls are only infantry who have it.

You realise Stormtroopers are just Panzergrenadiers with Gren Kar 98's who have to choose between one Panzerschreck or their default StG's, right? Popping out of buildings is the entire appeal of Stormtroopers.
31 Oct 2014, 20:59 PM
#147
avatar of Cruzz

Posts: 1221 | Subs: 41


I could see increasing the base Kar98's being a problem with recrewing though. Imagine an MG 42 with half an Ober's DPS guarding the flank, it'd be the old Penal MG all over again.


You can give them slot weapons that will not drop and do not take an item slot, like how conscript ppsh are setup. These are always equipped over the base weapon, but will never transfer to recrewed weapons.


Instead, is it possible to reduce the DPS of their rifles and the MG 34 to normal levels, then add a +35% (number is a guestination) accuracy bonus to the squad that loses effect if a model leaves the squad (to recrew a weapon)? I'd imagine it's possible, Veteran troops don't retain their bonuses when they recrew another weapon, I just don't know how complex it would be to work out.


Also possible

Had to do a hotfix because I had screwed up the partisan files so badly.

31.10.2014.3

Fixed the partisans, had forgotten to include a modified file in the previous patch so dispatch wasn't changed before. Changed way SMG weapon is applied so it should properly apply on reinforce now.

Heavily reduced airplane crash damage.

Experimenting with flamethrower explosion crit, flamers should no longer blow up if there is more than one member in the squad.

31 Oct 2014, 21:21 PM
#148
avatar of PanzerErotica

Posts: 135

You realise Stormtroopers are just Panzergrenadiers with Gren Kar 98's who have to choose between one Panzerschreck or their default StG's, right? Popping out of buildings is the entire appeal of Stormtroopers.


I do. What is their reason for that? How they perform is entirely different topic but spawning like partisans and fallschirmjaegers is just a lack of imagination from relic´s part. They were "dudes with stuff" after all.
31 Oct 2014, 21:37 PM
#149
avatar of Mr. Someguy

Posts: 4928

jump backJump back to quoted post31 Oct 2014, 20:59 PMCruzz
You can give them slot weapons that will not drop and do not take an item slot, like how conscript ppsh are setup. These are always equipped over the base weapon, but will never transfer to recrewed weapons.

"Heavy" Kar 98's that get equipped over their weaker Kar 98's, that's actually a really good idea. Easier to measure performance stat-wise too. As long as they don't prevent the MG 34 from being handed down or increase the drop chance (since the game will see 4 heavy weapons instead of 1), it'd be perfect.


I do. What is their reason for that? How they perform is entirely different topic but spawning like partisans and fallschirmjaegers is just a lack of imagination from relic´s part. They were "dudes with stuff" after all.

1. Spawning from a building is their entire appeal. The StG Upgrade gives them the same guns as Panzergrenadiers and the Panzerschreck only give them one. They're actually inferior to Panzergrenadiers in that way, coming out of buildings is their only upside. Remove spawning from buildings, and they become redundant.

2. "dudes with stuff" was OKW's Urban Assault Light Infantry, different unit with different weapons (4x MP 40). Not sure why people keep confusing them with Wehrmacht's Stormtroopers.
31 Oct 2014, 22:40 PM
#150
avatar of Bulgakov

Posts: 987

How about nerfing all early game clown cars or making them unavailable before the first 5 minutes?

Then making demo charges auto-detonate like satchels so they can't be used like unit-deleters?


You could buff sovs and amis to compensate, I'm suggesting these because I don't see demo or clown cars as either skillful or fun to play against.
31 Oct 2014, 22:53 PM
#151
avatar of braciszek

Posts: 2053

How about:
"soviet and US demo charge can now be manually targeted, with 1 armor and 40 hp. (vulnerable to small arms)" (taken from another balance mod) A suggestion if they are too bothersome.

And since penals can do something, m3 probably doesnt need to be as silly anymore..

INB4: copy pasting that quote on my phone makes it past above the player quote no matter what.

How about nerfing all early game clown cars or making them unavailable before the first 5 minutes?

Then making demo charges auto-detonate like satchels so they can't be used like unit-deleters?


You could buff sovs and amis to compensate, I'm suggesting these because I don't see demo or clown cars as either skillful or fun to play against.


I feel bad using this new avatar...
31 Oct 2014, 23:20 PM
#152
avatar of spam.r33k

Posts: 503

How about:
"soviet and US demo charge can now be manually targeted, with 1 armor and 40 hp. (vulnerable to small arms)" (taken from another balance mod) A suggestion if they are too bothersome.

And since penals can do something, m3 probably doesnt need to be as silly anymore..

INB4: copy pasting that quote on my phone makes it past above the player quote no matter what.



I feel bad using this new avatar...


stephennjf suggested something similar and cruzzi in his infinite wisdom has actually already reduced the armor stats on both mines and demos to make them more vulnerable to small arms fire
31 Oct 2014, 23:28 PM
#153
avatar of Kreatiir

Posts: 2819

T70 switch with 76.

Rest is very nice.
31 Oct 2014, 23:28 PM
#154
avatar of Sarantini
Honorary Member Badge
Donator 22

Posts: 2181

Nice work.
What about nerfing the canister shot on the greyhound and making the normal gun a lot better?
31 Oct 2014, 23:39 PM
#155
avatar of Gneckes

Posts: 196

Seems excellent, I'm impressed!
My only concern is that which has been mentioned above: splitting the community doesn't seem like a good idea.

I can only hope Relic takes a hint from this (and the community's reactions to this)!
1 Nov 2014, 00:10 AM
#156
avatar of Cruzz

Posts: 1221 | Subs: 41


What about nerfing the canister shot on the greyhound and making the normal gun a lot better?


Quite reasonable, will keep in mind.


Poll time:

What to do with vehicle death crits?

Currently the situation for (the vast majority of) vehicles is that a shot that brings the unit down to 0 health has these probabilities:

55% chance outright destroy
20% chance out of control
10% main gun destroyed
10% engine damage REAR ARMOR HITS ONLY
5% abandon

Due to the engine damage issue, it effectively is slightly harder to kill a vehicle when firing at its rear because the chance of the death crits will be slightly lower.

So anyway, what do you think should be done to these values? Conditionals can be attached to the crits to an extent, like "abandon, only if has crit x"
1 Nov 2014, 00:11 AM
#157
avatar of The Soldier

Posts: 218

Nice work.
What about nerfing the canister shot on the greyhound and making the normal gun a lot better?


PLEASE do this Cruzz. The M8 Greyhound does 40 damage per shot currently - not even enough to kill a soldier in a direct hit.
1 Nov 2014, 00:24 AM
#158
avatar of What Doth Life?!
Patrion 27

Posts: 1664

What about the crappy Soviet call-in M-42 45mm At gun? I propose it functions like the Puppchen and can get suppressed, retreat and garrison buildings.
1 Nov 2014, 00:34 AM
#159
avatar of Soheil

Posts: 658

question for Cruzz - is it possible to, for example rename unit from call-in and place them to Tiers? Changing units in Tiers? Changing units weaponry? Adding them new weapon upgrades?

smells eastern front
1 Nov 2014, 00:44 AM
#160
avatar of Mr. Someguy

Posts: 4928

jump backJump back to quoted post1 Nov 2014, 00:10 AMCruzz
What to do with vehicle death crits?

Currently the situation for (the vast majority of) vehicles is that a shot that brings the unit down to 0 health has these probabilities:

55% chance outright destroy
20% chance out of control
10% main gun destroyed
10% engine damage REAR ARMOR HITS ONLY
5% abandon

Due to the engine damage issue, it effectively is slightly harder to kill a vehicle when firing at its rear because the chance of the death crits will be slightly lower.

So anyway, what do you think should be done to these values? Conditionals can be attached to the crits to an extent, like "abandon, only if has crit x"

Is it possible for 'out of control' to only trigger if the vehicle is moving forward at a faster pace? It looks silly when a reversing vehicle instantly lunges forward and explodes. Also, disable 'out of control' on engine damaged vehicles, seeing a vehicle go 'out of control' and moving 2 inches a second just reminds me of this.

As for Abandon, what if we kept Abandon and maybe even increased the chance, but also inflict 'destroyed engine' and 'immobilized' on any vehicles abandoned by death critical?

Would it be possible for Infantry AT Abilities to trigger soft criticals (driver injured, gunner shocked, etc) like what used to happen in the Beta? I don't like that Infantry AT abilities are virtually useless now. There's no punishment for charging through infantry anymore, which makes anything short of another Tank much more vulnerable. Perhaps also increase the range on the Panzerfaust, since without the engine critical, the M3 and WC are free to rule the early-game against Wehrmacht.


What about the crappy Soviet call-in M-42 45mm At gun? I propose it functions like the Puppchen and can get suppressed, retreat and garrison buildings.

I propose lower the cost and change Vet 2 to Sprint.
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